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knyfeknerd
02-06-2013, 11:37 PM
Have any of you seen this show?
It's on PBS and it rocks!
Featuring one of the "celebrity chefs" I actually happen to respect, David Chang......
......Great stuff. Just saw a DVR'ed episode of Japan.
Freakin' good stuff.
http://www.pbs.org/food/shows/the-mind-of-a-chef/
Check it out. I'm hoping to see mattrud in the background somewhere.

Jmadams13
02-06-2013, 11:41 PM
It a great show. Entertaining, but still informative. I like Changs personality and attitude on food. The episodes where he is with Rene from Noma are the best. His pastry chef is pretty cute too, lol.

mc2442
02-06-2013, 11:42 PM
Odd, I thought I had about every channel with Directv, but I am not authorized to record that show.

franzb69
02-06-2013, 11:46 PM
what sucks is, this country based lock out on videos that are supposed to be out for the public's consumption. i don't get to see the whole episodes. if i get a VPN with a us based ip address then i get to see them, done it before. includes a bunch of other networks and shows.

sachem allison
02-07-2013, 02:08 AM
Have any of you seen this show?
It's on PBS and it rocks!
Featuring one of the "celebrity chefs" I actually happen to respect, David Chang......
......Great stuff. Just saw a DVR'ed episode of Japan.
Freakin' good stuff.
http://www.pbs.org/food/shows/the-mind-of-a-chef/
Check it out. I'm hoping to see mattrud in the background somewhere.

Hate that guy, hope he stubs his toe kinda hate, Bastard!

ecchef
02-07-2013, 05:44 AM
what sucks is, this country based lock out on videos that are supposed to be out for the public's consumption. i don't get to see the whole episodes. if i get a VPN with a us based ip address then i get to see them, done it before. includes a bunch of other networks and shows.

Same here.

Jmadams13
02-07-2013, 11:18 AM
Hate that guy, hope he stubs his toe kinda hate, Bastard!

Really Son? Why so much hate?

pumbaa
02-07-2013, 05:22 PM
I thought I posted something about this. The episode with him and wyle from wd50 doing their egg dishes is my favorite so far.

labor of love
02-07-2013, 05:55 PM
just downloaded a bunch of episodes im gonna check it out this evening. ive heard nothing but good things.

labor of love
02-08-2013, 02:11 AM
not to be too much of a nerd here but, suisin inox western gyuto is all over that first episode. im a little surprised. i expected something higher end.

quantumcloud509
02-08-2013, 06:06 AM
That was a great series. When they first started airing it I would check very night after work for the next episode. Where I work now is heavily influenced by Chang and Tartine.

TheDispossessed
02-14-2013, 11:03 PM
That was a great series. When they first started airing it I would check very night after work for the next episode. Where I work now is heavily influenced by Chang and Tartine.

some nice influences IMO.

TheDispossessed
02-14-2013, 11:03 PM
i noticed the suisin in there too, kinda made me laugh bc it's my first 'real' knife.

Crothcipt
02-14-2013, 11:53 PM
I so want to make the banana cream pie on one episode. Can't wait to see the next installment/season.

mr drinky
02-15-2013, 01:02 AM
I watched the episode when they went to Frankfort KY and got wasted. It was a pretty good show though, and even my wife said she liked it.

k.

sachem allison
02-15-2013, 01:36 AM
Really Son? Why so much hate?

Years ago,( he might not remember me but, I remember him.) I was working and living in Phoenix. One day I get a call from a guy in New York City. He says his name is David and he is about to open a new noodle shop restaurant in the city and is looking for skilled people with the ability to create authentic flavors with a twist. He says he was given my resume and really liked what he saw. He talked to all of my previous employers and some chef friends of mine and was really impressed. He interviewed me for a couple of hours and we talked food and ideas. We talked every other day for about a month, He got recipes from me for sauces, soup stocks, dumplings and a bunch of other stuff. I don't mind because, I like helping out guys who are opening new places and I don't mind sharing my knowledge. Then one day he calls me up and says" hey, I want you to be my Executive Sous chef, when can you get out here?" I said, " I can be there in two weeks". We agree on a start date, salary and duties. I buy a plane ticket, break my lease in Phoenix, come up with first, last, security and find an apartment in NYC in less than 2 weeks, sell my truck to do it because, I won't need a vehicle in NYC and lost my girlfriend because, she didn't want to go with me. I talked with David, everyday those two weeks going over vendors, menu ideas and how and who we were going to pick for the staff. He went over who the partners were and thier personalities. I called him that morning to let him know my flight number. Everything was going great. A couple hours later as I was walking onto the plane my cell phone rang and it was David. He ask me how I'm doing. I say fine, I'm on my way to the city, I just got on the plane. David says, "about that, My buddy just got into town and he was who I wanted originally for the position so, I gave it to him." " I won't be needing you, sorry." I say, "What the f..., David, I just gave up everything in my life for this opportunity, I'm on the plane right now!" David says. " what can I say, you shoulda got it in writing."
That's why I hate that smug son of a ***** and I don't hate anybody. Momofuku and David Chang's empire can kiss my shiny metal ass! Mattrud I'm cool with though, he's the man.

franzb69
02-15-2013, 01:59 AM
damn sachem, i understand the hate. i never really liked him though. he does come of a bit smug on some of his interviews. and i bet he's stoned half the time he's in the kitchen, i can see it in his eyes. life lesson learned, put everything important in writing. i will remember that as well.

thanks for sharing.

labor of love
02-15-2013, 04:43 AM
Years ago,( he might not remember me but, I remember him.) I was working and living in Phoenix. One day I get a call from a guy in New York City. He says his name is David and he is about to open a new noodle shop restaurant in the city and is looking for skilled people with the ability to create authentic flavors with a twist. He says he was given my resume and really liked what he saw. He talked to all of my previous employers and some chef friends of mine and was really impressed. He interviewed me for a couple of hours and we talked food and ideas. We talked every other day for about a month, He got recipes from me for sauces, soup stocks, dumplings and a bunch of other stuff. I don't mind because, I like helping out guys who are opening new places and I don't mind sharing my knowledge. Then one day he calls me up and says" hey, I want you to be my Executive Sous chef, when can you get out here?" I said, " I can be there in two weeks". We agree on a start date, salary and duties. I buy a plane ticket, break my lease in Phoenix, come up with first, last, security and find an apartment in NYC in less than 2 weeks, sell my truck to do it because, I won't need a vehicle in NYC and lost my girlfriend because, she didn't want to go with me. I talked with David, everyday those two weeks going over vendors, menu ideas and how and who we were going to pick for the staff. He went over who the partners were and thier personalities. I called him that morning to let him know my flight number. Everything was going great. A couple hours later as I was walking onto the plane my cell phone rang and it was David. He ask me how I'm doing. I say fine, I'm on my way to the city, I just got on the plane. David says, "about that, My buddy just got into town and he was who I wanted originally for the position so, I gave it to him." " I won't be needing you, sorry." I say, "What the f..., David, I just gave up everything in my life for this opportunity, I'm on the plane right now!" David says. " what can I say, you shoulda got it in writing."
That's why I hate that smug son of a ***** and I don't hate anybody. Momofuku and David Chang's empire can kiss my shiny metal ass! Mattrud I'm cool with though, he's the man.
wow. this story really changes my opinion of david chang.

Ucmd
02-15-2013, 05:35 AM
Years ago,( he might not remember me but, I remember him.) I was working and living in Phoenix. One day I get a call from a guy in New York City. He says his name is David and he is about to open a new noodle shop restaurant in the city and is looking for skilled people with the ability to create authentic flavors with a twist. He says he was given my resume and really liked what he saw. He talked to all of my previous employers and some chef friends of mine and was really impressed. He interviewed me for a couple of hours and we talked food and ideas. We talked every other day for about a month, He got recipes from me for sauces, soup stocks, dumplings and a bunch of other stuff. I don't mind because, I like helping out guys who are opening new places and I don't mind sharing my knowledge. Then one day he calls me up and says" hey, I want you to be my Executive Sous chef, when can you get out here?" I said, " I can be there in two weeks". We agree on a start date, salary and duties. I buy a plane ticket, break my lease in Phoenix, come up with first, last, security and find an apartment in NYC in less than 2 weeks, sell my truck to do it because, I won't need a vehicle in NYC and lost my girlfriend because, she didn't want to go with me. I talked with David, everyday those two weeks going over vendors, menu ideas and how and who we were going to pick for the staff. He went over who the partners were and thier personalities. I called him that morning to let him know my flight number. Everything was going great. A couple hours later as I was walking onto the plane my cell phone rang and it was David. He ask me how I'm doing. I say fine, I'm on my way to the city, I just got on the plane. David says, "about that, My buddy just got into town and he was who I wanted originally for the position so, I gave it to him." " I won't be needing you, sorry." I say, "What the f..., David, I just gave up everything in my life for this opportunity, I'm on the plane right now!" David says. " what can I say, you shoulda got it in writing."
That's why I hate that smug son of a ***** and I don't hate anybody. Momofuku and David Chang's empire can kiss my shiny metal ass! Mattrud I'm cool with though, he's the man.

wow, not taking any business his way next time i'm in new york. scratching momofuku off the list.

labor of love
02-15-2013, 11:35 AM
i pretty much assume all celebrity chefs are A holes. comes with the territory.

knyfeknerd
02-15-2013, 11:41 AM
That sucks Son. I guess nice guys finish last-as usual.
It's still a good show......
......but if I ever meet "the Chang" I'll give him a swift kick to the gnad's from you!
A lot of the chefs I've worked with that were really brilliant also had enormous demons and quite a few skeletons.
Pobody's Nerfect.

DeepCSweede
02-15-2013, 12:42 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xclIy6HLpnw

The guy definitely deserves a "Nut Shot" with a "You know why!" as you walk away

sachem allison
02-15-2013, 01:25 PM
Hey, The one thing I don't begrudge him is his success. He made it and that's fine. Go to his restaurant, eat the food. He didn't make it other people did like Matt. My issue is on a personal level, not a business one. I think there should be more successes like Momofuku. If his success gets people thinking about food and what can be done with it, good for him. I just won't be going there. I guess I really don't hate the guy he just really disappointed me as a person and a fellow chef and to me that is a whole lot worse. I can respect a person I hate but, I have no respect for him.

Jmadams13
02-15-2013, 01:32 PM
That last statement just shows you are a good person Son. We all steady respect you, and this is just one more reason why. No shame in being the better person in situations like that

chinacats
02-15-2013, 02:06 PM
wow, not taking any business his way next time i'm in new york. scratching momofuku off the list.

x2

Zwiefel
02-15-2013, 02:24 PM
Damn Son. I don't think I could forgive something like that. I wouldn't wrap myself up with hating him though (sounds like you didn't do that either)...but that's just not acceptable or forgiveable.

I've never heard of him or his place before...I'll make sure I steer clear of his place though. there are too many other people doing good work and also being decent people that I could give money to.

Crothcipt
02-15-2013, 06:41 PM
Damn Son, not the first time I heard of chefs doing that. Also I have met a few people that made it to the city before they got the call. A few I worked with had no business even being on the phone with a chef. Any way, I plan on trying his place if I ever make it to Nyc, along with others. It is just sad when you hear about it happening to someone you like.

keithsaltydog
02-15-2013, 07:14 PM
No one makes it through life wt. out feeling used & abused.Anger may fuel the fires short term,blame game,but not long term.Look at diff. old persons some are open & alive while other's are closed, angry,pissed off,& now your old too.Both went thru **** in their lives.

A Suisin Inox Western,shows they have knife awareness,it is not fancy,a capable workhorse blade at a fair price.

Chef Doom
02-16-2013, 02:35 AM
lost my girlfriend because, she didn't want to go with me.

So Son, I have two questions for you, assuming the experience wasn't too painful.

1. How attractive was this girlfriend you left behind for this "wonderful" opportunity?

2. Did you get back with her after the situation blew up?

Keep in mind your answers will forever alter my opinion and respect for you. :eyebrow:

Notaskinnychef
02-16-2013, 09:32 AM
So Son, I have two questions for you, assuming the experience wasn't too painful.

1. How attractive was this girlfriend you left behind for this "wonderful" opportunity?

2. Did you get back with her after the situation blew up?

Keep in mind your answers will forever alter my opinion and respect for you. :eyebrow:

well considering his location is still NYC (as per his profile), I assume he didn't go back. Granted I have no idea where you started so im just using my "end of nightshift" rambling brain lol

sachem allison
02-16-2013, 12:15 PM
So Son, I have two questions for you, assuming the experience wasn't too painful.

1. How attractive was this girlfriend you left behind for this "wonderful" opportunity?

2. Did you get back with her after the situation blew up?

Keep in mind your answers will forever alter my opinion and respect for you. :eyebrow:
all my women are hot
stayed in New york and got an executive chef job the next day. Tried the long distance thing for awhile, it didn't work out and she is one of my closests friend now. No harm, no foul.lol

tkern
02-16-2013, 12:19 PM
all my women are hot

the true mind of a chef

sachem allison
02-16-2013, 12:49 PM
If I'm dating her, she's hot. doesn't matter what she looks like. some of the most beautiful women I have ever met are some of the ugliest people I have ever met and it's an instant turn off. Some of the sexiest women I have met have not been the most beautiful. It depend on my mood.lol

Mike L.
02-16-2013, 08:11 PM
[QUOTE=sachem allison;181469] some of the most beautiful women I have ever met are some of the ugliest people I have ever met and it's an instant turn off. Some of the sexiest women I have met have not been the most beautiful. lol[/QUOTE

+1

Paradox
02-17-2013, 04:27 PM
. David says, "about that, My buddy just got into town and he was who I wanted originally for the position so, I gave it to him." " I won't be needing you, sorry." I say, "What the f..., David, I just gave up everything in my life for this opportunity, I'm on the plane right now!" David says. " what can I say, you shoulda got it in writing."

WOW! It's a good thing he said that to you while you were still a few thousand miles away over the phone. I can sure imagine going to jail for beating him on the spot if he had waited till I got there and said that to my face.

While I wouldn't have necessarily guessed him for this kind of behavior I am not surprised by it either after watching him on TV a bit. That last line really fits.

My PBS station has just started the first season of "Mind" on a new run here. I have set the DVR and seen the first 2 episodes. I am enjoying it for sure.

Benuser
02-17-2013, 09:57 PM
If I'm dating her, she's hot. doesn't matter what she looks like. some of the most beautiful women I have ever met are some of the ugliest people I have ever met and it's an instant turn off. Some of the sexiest women I have met have not been the most beautiful. It depend on my mood.lol

Great text!

Chef Doom
02-18-2013, 04:11 PM
Hahaha, what a way to dodge my question I should probe for more body measurements and dimensions, but I will let it go.

And I have to disagree with anyone here. I have no problem taking the most attractive woman to all of the functions I go to know matter how ugly she is on the inside, so long as she doesn't speak to anyone. I definitely don't believe in convincing myself that an ugly girl I'm dating is pretty just so I can stomach the situation. I'm pretty upfront. If I'm not dating a woman for her looks, then it's because she is easy.

Jmadams13
02-18-2013, 04:34 PM
^that made my day...

sachem allison
02-18-2013, 05:19 PM
Hahaha, what a way to dodge my question I should probe for more body measurements and dimensions, but I will let it go.

And I have to disagree with anyone here. I have no problem taking the most attractive woman to all of the functions I go to know matter how ugly she is on the inside, so long as she doesn't speak to anyone. I definitely don't believe in convincing myself that an ugly girl I'm dating is pretty just so I can stomach the situation. I'm pretty upfront. If I'm not dating a woman for her looks, then it's because she is easy.

I said, she was hot. I wasn't joking or evading, she really is hot.lol You gotta be young, and I mean that with no disrespect. I used to only think with my ..... too. Things change and perspectives do to.
do who you can as long as you can and have as much fun doing it as possible.

brainsausage
02-18-2013, 05:35 PM
A buddy of mine worked for Chang back when Momofuku was first getting attention. Said he was a pompous prick, and would show up in the middle of service, stoned/drunk, walk on the line push people off their stations and start making food, completely screw up the flow and ruin the expediter's ticket picks, then saunter off and let everyone pick up the pieces...

It was probably a good thing that you didn't end up there Son...

Chef Doom
02-18-2013, 09:19 PM
I said, she was hot. I wasn't joking or evading, she really is hot.lol

I see, my apologies. At least you were able to turn a bad situation into a positive one.



A buddy of mine worked for Chang back when Momofuku was first getting attention. Said he was a pompous prick, and would show up in the middle of service, stoned/drunk, walk on the line push people off their stations and start making food, completely screw up the flow and ruin the expediter's ticket picks, then saunter off and let everyone pick up the pieces...

It was probably a good thing that you didn't end up there Son...

Although I partly agree with you at the end, lets be honest. If I can't be a pompous prick, what is the point of owning my own business, or in this case restaurant. And it has nothing to do with any principles or character with regards to how a business owner treats his or her employees, so leave that out of it. I'm talking about the very right to be how evil or nice you wish to be because YOU own it.

It's like Dave Chappelle said regarding the Monica Lewinsky Scandal...and I'm paraphrasing, "If I can't get some **** every now and then in the oval office, then I don't want to be president".

Jmadams13
02-19-2013, 12:21 AM
Not to sound like a jerk Doom, but have you ever owned a business, or been in a situation where you make the calls?

I am part owner of a bicycle shop around here, it's five of us that own it, and have 4 employees. If anyone of us acts that way towards one of our guys, he would have every right to walk. So what if I have the right to get trashed in the middle of the day, and come into the shop and start wrenching, screwing up the workflow. It is my right, as I own part of the company, but is it fair to my guys who count on me to set an example of how to treat the customers, investors, employees, other owners, reputation of our shop (very much like restaurants, bike shops are very customer loyal.)

No it's not right. My guys look up to me as a boss and a mentor. It's my duty to give them an example that's worth following. It makes for a better business, employees, and product/service.

This is even more so true when you are not in the shop/kitchen everyday. I have a full time baking job, only in the shop on Sundays and Monday mornings, besides the random stop in. Chang is not in the kitchen every day, he's at the other places, on tv, travel, what have you. When he does show up, he should show respect to the people giving him his reputation. If I was in his kitchen, had him walk in drunk or f'd up during shift because he can't wait till after like the rest of us, I'd say FU, finish my shift, clean up, and walk.


Whew... Sorry about that guys, and Doom, I mean no offense and apologize for calling you out, and acting like a jerk. There are just some things that get to me, and expecting respect when non is shown is one of those things. Lead by example. It's why some chefs are mentors to the crew, and others are the pain in the ass they make fun of at the bar after shift.

Chef Doom
02-19-2013, 01:29 AM
No problems Jmadams13, and no, I have never owned a business. Was about to start one, but never went through with it. Although I did work for a guy who although was great to hang out with, was a jerk as a business owner. As in he would go play golf at his favorite country club the day before checks were sent out, thus causing checks to bounce when you cashed them. Now as far as being wrong, it most definitely was, but at the same time he was in his rights to handle and budget his company as he see fits. Sure I was upset at the time, but I learned a valuable lesson from the experience. Although I don't talk about the specifics a lot, I do half way reference it in light joking. Anytime someone asks me how my current job is doing, my response is always "They pay me on time. No complaints here".

People who work for Chang have a right to complain, but being right, and having the right to do something are different. My theory is that an employee who complains about their treatment on the job isn't getting paid enough. In fact, I would say what Chang does is worse than others because from what I read, what he does is random, so the unpredictability would obviously suck. It was funny when I was still watching Hell's Kitchen before I cut myself off from cable, where the contestants would complain about Ramsey's treatment towards them. DID YOU NOT WATCH SEASON 1 THROUGH WHATEVER?????

Chef Doom
02-19-2013, 01:34 AM
And no, you didn't sound like a jerk at all. I don't have a weak stomach, so I never fire back at person for having attitude or passion in their speech. Gotta stand firmly behind what you believe in. I just dislike it when people try to twist or alter something I said into a meaning that didn't fit the words I chose. Not that you did, just for future reference.

mr drinky
02-19-2013, 09:49 AM
In a slightly different direction, I understand members not wanting to go to a restaurant that has wronged one of our members here. I can understand that, but for the most part I can't say that a person behaving badly is going to keep me from their restaurant unless it reflects in the overall quality of their food -- unless they went all Michael Vick on us and started dog fights. I assume that in most restaurants I eat there are chefs, sous chefs, pastry chefs etc who are douche bags. Just as your bank manager might be a dick head, and your dentist might beat his wife.

Just throwing that out there.

k.

Jmadams13
02-19-2013, 10:48 AM
My "chef" (I say that loosely, as to me, the statue as chef is more than a title, it's earned) is a douche. And I go there daily, lol.

franzb69
02-19-2013, 10:57 AM
i know how you feel jmadams13

i can never call myself a chef, but as i am a cook? i am proud to call myself that.

Jmadams13
02-19-2013, 11:10 AM
I've been a chef, and a cook, and a baker. One thing that really bothers me is when I hear cooks call themselves chef. Chef is a position of authority, not only meaning you cook. My "chef" is chef in title only. He doesn't act like one, can't run his crew (luckily I don't answer to him, I'm my own boss) and can't handle the stress. He fell into the position when the old chef (a real one) moved on, but instantly started calling himself chef to everyone. Call me an ass, but I don't call him chef, and won't until he earns it. In his case, that probably won't happen.


This actually does relate to the original topic. I saw a authors at google interview with Chang the other day, after reading this thread, and he did have that attitude he didn't have to really work anymore. As a comparison, the complete opposite of Keller. I've known cooks that have worked with him, and said if he was in town, he would be right there in the kitchen, guiding, mentoring, and helping out. Even went into the dish room to help when it got busy. To me, that's the sign of a real chef.

knyfeknerd
02-19-2013, 11:17 AM
Jmadams13, empty out your inbox. I'm trying to send u some PIF info.

Jmadams13
02-19-2013, 11:19 AM
There's room now Chris

sachem allison
02-19-2013, 04:34 PM
In a slightly different direction, I understand members not wanting to go to a restaurant that has wronged one of our members here. I can understand that, but for the most part I can't say that a person behaving badly is going to keep me from their restaurant unless it reflects in the overall quality of their food -- unless they went all Michael Vick on us and started dog fights. I assume that in most restaurants I eat there are chefs, sous chefs, pastry chefs etc who are douche bags. Just as your bank manager might be a dick head, and your dentist might beat his wife.

Just throwing that out there.

k.

That's why I said, go to his restaurant and eat his food.
My issue is personal not professional.

mr drinky
02-19-2013, 07:17 PM
That's why I said, go to his restaurant and eat his food.
My issue is personal not professional.

Sorry Son, missed that reply.

k.

labor of love
02-19-2013, 08:04 PM
on the issue of food being "his". didnt chang just popularize a bunch of stuff that was around already? i could be way off base here, but every now and again even in his momofuku book he will admit hes just ripping off something some noodle shop was already doing down the street. i look at chang and i see a guy who just built a sucessful name brand, and the intrigue behind his "bad boy" image partially fueled his sucess. that being said, i really do like his cookbook.

mr drinky
03-04-2013, 02:30 PM
After watching four or so episodes, I must say that I really like the format, but -- having said that -- I am also a bit less impressed with David Chang. Half the time he looks stoned, drunk, or both. And in most of the episodes there is invariably one shot of him with a vacant look on his face where -- how should I say this -- he looks borderline learning disabled.

He also tends to make broad statements that are kind of stupid IMO. He hates beets because of the '90s beet salad cliche. Then as Chef Daniel Patterson makes an interesting beet dish -- Chang flies in with his wisdom and offers this: "So, you are taking beets to a level." It sounded so stupid that I rewound it for my wife.

Oh yeah, he also hates turkey because -- admittedly -- 90% of Americans mess it up, and he also hates chicken soup. I can understand having a negative gut reaction against these dishes that define American food mediocrity, but making pronouncements that imply you have given up an an ingredient or style of food seems somewhat silly.

I guess I find the other chefs on the program more interesting: Patterson, Sean Brock, Wylie Dufresne to name a few. Of course, in the Kentucky episode he was drunk, and I thought that was pretty funny at times. The egg episode was cool too I thought.

k.

Salty dog
03-04-2013, 02:53 PM
This subject is almost too complex for me to comment on. I've composed three posts and deleted each one of them before saying "I give up".

slowtyper
03-05-2013, 12:17 AM
on the issue of food being "his". didnt chang just popularize a bunch of stuff that was around already? i could be way off base here, but every now and again even in his momofuku book he will admit hes just ripping off something some noodle shop was already doing down the street. i look at chang and i see a guy who just built a sucessful name brand, and the intrigue behind his "bad boy" image partially fueled his sucess. that being said, i really do like his cookbook.

I like the cookbook a lot as well, but aboslutely do not come to the same conclusion you just did. In the book he lists where inspiration comes from, or what he ripped off. But much of the book is about innovation and how things came to be. Much more of the book is like that, than "steamed buns are good with meat..duh".

labor of love
03-05-2013, 12:28 AM
fair enough.

mhlee
03-05-2013, 12:37 AM
I got my dvd of this series today. :)

Drumjockey
03-11-2013, 01:16 AM
I've been a chef, and a cook, and a baker. One thing that really bothers me is when I hear cooks call themselves chef. Chef is a position of authority, not only meaning you cook. My "chef" is chef in title only. He doesn't act like one, can't run his crew (luckily I don't answer to him, I'm my own boss) and can't handle the stress. He fell into the position when the old chef (a real one) moved on, but instantly started calling himself chef to everyone. Call me an ass, but I don't call him chef, and won't until he earns it. In his case, that probably won't happen.


This actually does relate to the original topic. I saw a authors at google interview with Chang the other day, after reading this thread, and he did have that attitude he didn't have to really work anymore. As a comparison, the complete opposite of Keller. I've known cooks that have worked with him, and said if he was in town, he would be right there in the kitchen, guiding, mentoring, and helping out. Even went into the dish room to help when it got busy. To me, that's the sign of a real chef.

I so agree with all of this post! One of my new guys calls me chef- has me in his phone as chef, for pete's sake- and it just makes me uncomfortable. I'm a cook, a kitchen manager, a guy who's not so long removed from being just another hourly line cook, and I strongly believe that if I'm not working harder than the guys I manage, I'm not doing my job and deserve no respect from them. If that means coming in for two hours on my day off so one guy on a double can take a break or washing dishes or closing solo so someone can go to his son's birthday party, well hell yeah I'm all about it. And it comes back around, always has:)

Drumjockey
03-11-2013, 01:41 AM
sorry for the hijack...

labor of love
03-11-2013, 02:08 AM
sorry for the hijack...
no worries! it was a much needed hijack!

franzb69
03-11-2013, 02:18 AM
been watching a couple episodes of this and i have to say the show is interesting but i have been starting to have a great dislike for david chang, specially after what i've read the stuff on here.

Chef Doom
03-12-2013, 12:56 AM
Technically, the terms chef and cook can and are interchangeable. The concept that only the head cook can be called chef is the equivalent of "Heavyweight Champion of the World" or playing in the "World Series". Basically American fantasies with no real historical basis. If you don't believe me, then I would like to take you to enjoy a Kobe beef burger at your local Applebees and sip on some Champagne made with authentic California grapes.

sachem allison
03-12-2013, 01:04 AM
Chef means chief and there can only be one chief in the kitchen. A chef is a cook but, a cook is not necessarily a chef.

Chef Doom
03-12-2013, 01:22 AM
Actually, a cook is a chef. It's just that the original phrases had too many syllables. With Americans generally being lazy in all things foreign, it was easier to culturally split up the words chef and cook in their singular forms. Chef does not mean chief directly. America simply loves one word titles, and will hammer away at a trend until it becomes normal regardless of it's incorrectness.

Chef Doom
03-12-2013, 01:40 AM
Man I was so backwards on this. The original term was I think more like "head of cuisine" or kitchen. I think it was more of a term people thought sounded foreign, cool and important, and was adapted to normal terminology. Chef never directly meant cook at all. I was half right, half wrong. My mistake.

Jmadams13
03-12-2013, 09:36 AM
Either way, IMO and many others, Chef is a term or respect. Someone who leads the kitchen, leads the crew into doing the best they can, creates new dishes and keeps the quality of food up, and at times runs the front of the house (I had to when I was Chef at Fox Briar Inn) and is a mentor to the team. They should lead by example. Some chefs get respect in different ways, some with anger and whatnot, but its still a form or respect.

From the things I've heard about Chang, here and otherwise from past employees, I would have a hard time calling him chef and meaning it.

Chef Doom
03-13-2013, 10:44 PM
The funny thing is, based on the original term of the word "chef", as it has nothing to do with putting a fire to anything, you don't even techinaclly have to be the best cook in the kitchen, or even that good. You just have to be the person in charge in the kitchen giving orders and running the show. If I were to open a restaurant and Anthony Bourdain was foolish enough to let me hire him, he would still have to call me chef, regardless of the light years between our cooking abilities. Just because people feel that something is wrong or right doesn't make it so.

It's kinda like a general in the army. Sure he receives respect, is the thought to be the creme de la creme of soldiers, every soldier salutes and follows their orders without word or complaint. But would you really want General Dempsey or John F. Kelly shoulder to shoulder with you in an actual fire fight?