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theo59
06-21-2013, 03:02 PM
I am in for one, great news!

Lefty
06-21-2013, 04:02 PM
Oh, you guys are in for a treat! :D

Here they come....

PierreRodrigue
06-21-2013, 04:32 PM
Hey guys. Thanks for the patience. These went through their initial paces, and I called it off, and started over. A couple things went sideways that I wasn't pleased about, so here is the first, sharp and branded, so you know I'm pleased.

Now... It is a prototype, and as such isn't "Custom Perfect" This is a piece to get out to a few of you to test, and to report back. I have one more blank from Lamson that I will tweak if necessary.

As discussed earlier this spring:

O1 blade at HRC 62 (went a tad harder) machine finish (cork belt and emery compound) rounded spine and choil
Full distal taper
G10 bolster, cocobolo scales, copper pins. It feels good in hand. Lots of grip, and comfortable in different grips. Handle is waxed and buffed.

http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0588_zpsead37ea9.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0588_zpsead37ea9.jpg.html)
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0589_zpsf0491339.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0589_zpsf0491339.jpg.html)
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0590_zps51b1d0ea.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0590_zps51b1d0ea.jpg.html)
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0591_zps388fdeb7.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0591_zps388fdeb7.jpg.html)

Don Nguyen
06-21-2013, 04:33 PM
Hot damn!

skiajl6297
06-21-2013, 04:53 PM
This is fantastic. Very excited to hear how the testers feel about this in heavy use!

Vision....executed. Great job guys.

pleue
06-21-2013, 05:12 PM
looks good, great job. The g10 really stands out. I'd love to see tester photos regarding how it patinas as well.

Mucho Bocho
06-21-2013, 05:23 PM
So exciting thanks Lefty and Pierre!

kpeddie2010
06-21-2013, 06:54 PM
Can I get in on one

PierreRodrigue
06-21-2013, 10:16 PM
different angle/light...
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0595_zps1465000e.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0595_zps1465000e.jpg.html)

wellminded1
06-21-2013, 10:21 PM
wow

Von blewitt
06-21-2013, 10:32 PM
Looks great guys!!!

dough
06-21-2013, 10:33 PM
wow. it looks great and the shape of the handle looks comfortable.

marc4pt0
06-22-2013, 07:19 AM
Looking like a work-horse! Very nice

franzb69
06-22-2013, 08:57 AM
it has taken shape of a really really nice knife.

Dusty
06-22-2013, 10:26 AM
Yep. This looks awesome. How thin does it get behind the edge?

Notaskinnychef
06-22-2013, 10:30 AM
damn, looks good guys, when is the final say on when we can get one? I was in at the start but as posted a while back that with my newborn i wasn't sure that id be able to do it, but who knows, i might be able to scrap something together. Either way, good work guys, I look forward to reviews

berko
06-22-2013, 10:52 AM
what will it cost?

toddnmd
06-24-2013, 03:05 PM
I think the original discussion was hoping the price would be somewhere around $200. Part of the idea would it would be an easy first gyuto to recommend.

I think it looks great, guys.

I'm curious about any specs you have in terms of weight, thickness, etc. If you are still tweaking and want to wait until everything is finalized, that would make sense as well. As long as you guys know we're interested in hearing and seeing more!

Lefty
06-24-2013, 03:17 PM
Yup, the goal is $200, which should be doable. As for specs, we are still tweaking (the prototype will be starting its journey very shortly). Once we hear from the testers, we'll have a better idea.

DSChief
06-25-2013, 07:51 AM
Hey guys. Thanks for the patience. These went through their initial paces, and I called it off, and started over. A couple things went sideways that I wasn't pleased about, so here is the first, sharp and branded, so you know I'm pleased.

Now... It is a prototype, and as such isn't "Custom Perfect" This is a piece to get out to a few of you to test, and to report back. I have one more blank from Lamson that I will tweak if necessary.

As discussed earlier this spring:

O1 blade at HRC 62 (went a tad harder) machine finish (cork belt and emery compound) rounded spine and choil
Full distal taper
G10 bolster, cocobolo scales, copper pins. It feels good in hand. Lots of grip, and comfortable in different grips. Handle is waxed and buffed.

http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0588_zpsead37ea9.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0588_zpsead37ea9.jpg.html)
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0589_zpsf0491339.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0589_zpsf0491339.jpg.html)
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0590_zps51b1d0ea.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0590_zps51b1d0ea.jpg.html)
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0591_zps388fdeb7.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0591_zps388fdeb7.jpg.html)

Are my eyes deceiving me or is the taper on the tip way more extreme than on the blanks shown in post 3207 of 4/15/2013. This latest incarnation
does not trip my trigger

PierreRodrigue
06-25-2013, 08:38 AM
It is a tad different on this one. I lost 8 mm of the tip after HT, so I had to reshape on the fly. Is isn't as bad as the photo portrays, its the angle of the photo, it makes it look narrower than it is.

Lefty
06-25-2013, 08:39 AM
I'm not sure what you mean. Maybe send me a pm and we can discuss it.

Lefty
06-25-2013, 09:14 AM
Wow, good eye! I didn't spot it....

eaglerock
06-25-2013, 01:20 PM
I like those pointy tips :D

Lefty
06-25-2013, 09:09 PM
No wonder I didn't notice. Here's a picture of the blank and the fully ground knife, side by side. I asked Pierre for a comparison shot, and here it is:

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/BA4EB79D-57E6-4B7A-BE87-ABBDA06F8710-4837-0000057379AC4C20.jpg

It must have been the angle!

ar11
07-05-2013, 01:19 AM
Im late on this, but would love to get in on one

Lefty
07-12-2013, 10:09 PM
Just letting you all know I've been using the prototype pretty hard for a few days now. I'll be bringing it with me on vacation, and then it will be sent on to the awesome panel!

So far, I've spotted some minor things I'd tweak, to my preference, but it's a beautiful knife, and boy is that throwback handle COMFY!

Here is a pick of me trying to make it a new leisure suit:

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/DCFBA61A-660A-4881-9396-4090F0DED74B-8338-00000A7E28168C56.jpg

And one of some patina...not the best pic, but I'm packing! :D

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/AA187135-0B16-4BB5-A707-0CB420517566-8338-00000A7E3C2D6498.jpg

I'm gonna have lots of fun with this one, all week long!

franzb69
07-13-2013, 01:02 AM
it's looking real good. would love to see a saya for it as well. lol. =D

since it looks like you're making one for it, or does it already have one?

eaglerock
07-13-2013, 02:58 AM
Yea maybe a discount for a saya if some one wants one :D

brainsausage
07-13-2013, 03:11 AM
Woah- slow down guys... I'd rather just get an awesome mid range priced knife. Throwing a saya into the mix is just getting into the way of Tom making sayas for all my other knives...

apicius9
07-13-2013, 03:20 AM
Looks nice. What's the height a the heel again?

Stefan

Mucho Bocho
07-13-2013, 09:11 AM
So pumped about this knife thank again Pierre and Lefty!

labor of love
07-13-2013, 10:04 PM
guys,that is an amazing looking knife. especially for the price. i cant wait. my only concern would be the height at the heel.

PierreRodrigue
07-13-2013, 10:47 PM
Heel height will be 50 mm

Notaskinnychef
07-15-2013, 02:56 AM
this thing looks good. I sold a few things around the home so i hope to be able to get one when the time comes. I hope that we can do a bulk shipment from canada so that we can avoid crossing the border and upping costs :)

Justin0505
07-15-2013, 07:24 AM
Just letting you all know I've been using the prototype pretty hard for a few days now. I'll be bringing it with me on vacation, and then it will be sent on to the awesome panel!

So far, I've spotted some minor things I'd tweak, to my preference, but it's a beautiful knife, and boy is that throwback handle COMFY!

Here is a pick of me trying to make it a new leisure suit:

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/DCFBA61A-660A-4881-9396-4090F0DED74B-8338-00000A7E28168C56.jpg

And one of some patina...not the best pic, but I'm packing! :D

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/AA187135-0B16-4BB5-A707-0CB420517566-8338-00000A7E3C2D6498.jpg

I'm gonna have lots of fun with this one, all week long!

Looks really good... and I can tell that you get no pleasure at all from being the first to fondle it and show off pics while everyone else sits and drools. I'm sorry that your position in this process doesn't have a more immediate reward than the joy and utility that the knives will bring to others once they're done.

So how much of the work was done by Lamson? I know one of the original goals of this project was to help them remember how to make good knives and to hold them accountable where some other vendors may have let things slide either out of ignorance or apathy.
Is this knife a sample of what Lamson is capable of or a 1-off mid-tech done by Pierre to serve as a reference for the production run. The plan for the final run is to have Lamson doing 100% of the work and Lefty and Pierre just running QC, right?

labor of love
07-15-2013, 11:42 AM
lefty, i know this is just a prototype, but do you think we could see a choil shot?

labor of love
07-17-2013, 09:31 AM
okay...instead could somebody remind me what grind it is we decided on? i know its 50/50 but what else?

Lefty
07-17-2013, 09:53 AM
Sorry for the delay. I'm out of town....

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/8B4E2E5E-DC91-4B0D-9253-3CB269ECC72F-9561-00000DAB149352B0.jpg

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/364A7362-C061-4B29-9856-3181EF06DED4-9561-00000DAB7B961A3D.jpg

The bottom one is just a cool pic of the "cottage knives".

Mucho Bocho
07-17-2013, 09:58 AM
Is it me or does the heel look softened at the tip a bit? If so that makes me very happy, cause I was already pretty happy with it. ;-)

PierreRodrigue
07-17-2013, 10:20 AM
Grind is convex to aid in food release. Convexing is greater in lower portion of the blade, but not excessive to prevent wedging. Tom will get a choil shot when he returns to the land of the living. He is at the cottage for some R&R.

labor of love
07-18-2013, 02:34 PM
thanks for the choil pics, looking good!

Lefty
07-20-2013, 05:39 PM
Just got home. Here are two pics of the patina, after one week of use. :D

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/B4862472-E9CB-4963-9AB0-471EE8135210-296-0000001D002DDEE9.jpg

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/DAF7DB8E-8E91-44F4-A360-22C332F9B8CD-296-0000001D0A56FBE7.jpg

I'm too tired to write anything else, but I will say this: I really like this knife....

Lefty
07-20-2013, 09:47 PM
Just finished this up. It's not perfect, and I might work on it a bit more before I send this knife out to the panel of testers. With that being said, I know you guys (some) might be curious to see the leisure suit. I worked with the cocobolo, and opted for lacewood for the saya. The handle photographed darker than it really is, and the oranges in the cocobolo compliment the saya pretty dang well (or vice-versa):

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/DD2F26E4-EFD7-43DF-A46E-874D90DAAD68-375-0000002D9A1061D3.jpg

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/590BE503-B4AB-419A-ACA6-65E5AD7DE236-375-0000002D8E69A86C.jpg

Thanks guys, and comments welcome. :)

brainsausage
07-20-2013, 10:02 PM
Very sexy patina, and nice work on the saya. I stil have to send you some pics in regards to my cimiters and such. Really looking forward to these knives...

marc4pt0
07-20-2013, 10:10 PM
That looks great! Nice work

eaglerock
07-21-2013, 04:40 AM
Really hoping the passaround will come by the EU :)

jigert
07-21-2013, 05:30 AM
Both the knife and the saya looks stellar! The finished product can't come soon enough...

franzb69
07-21-2013, 06:23 AM
looks like i'm gonna need to start saving up for these babies. sheesh, lol.

77kath
07-21-2013, 06:26 AM
It feels like I'm seven years old and waiting for Christmas.

cheflarge
07-21-2013, 10:14 AM
In for one.

Notaskinnychef
07-21-2013, 03:13 PM
looking good. I also noticed that lovely costco backsplash, got that in my downstairs suite too :)

bear1889
07-22-2013, 01:39 AM
Grind is convex to aid in food release. Convexing is greater in lower portion of the blade, but not excessive to prevent wedging. Tom will get a choil shot when he returns to the land of the living. He is at the cottage for some R&R.

Doesn't convex grind require a different sharpening technique? Instead of using stones you use sand paper and a softer material underneath for sharpening?

ThEoRy
07-22-2013, 08:02 AM
Doesn't convex grind require a different sharpening technique? Instead of using stones you use sand paper and a softer material underneath for sharpening?

Grind is referring to the shape of the blade face, not the edge.

bear1889
07-22-2013, 10:20 AM
Grind is referring to the shape of the blade face, not the edge.

See, if you don't ask you won't learn, thanks for the explanation.

brianlsx
07-22-2013, 12:46 PM
Might be a little late. But can I be in for one? Thanks

toddnmd
07-22-2013, 01:06 PM
I don't think anyone is too late yet. Unless there is some maximum number that are going to be made (but can't recall hearing that in the first 31 pages of this thread! ;-)

Lefty
07-22-2013, 01:56 PM
Rick, thanks for jumping on that. As usual, he's right. :D

Nobody is too late. We'd love to make 200 of these! It means more QC checks and shipping for us, but it also means a successful project, that resulted in a great knife for even more people. After using this for over a week, I can say I'm very pleased with the initial result. I know it will just get better with the help of our amazing testers!

GConcept999
07-30-2013, 09:08 PM
Sweet knife, and sweet collaboration group buy!

I'd totally buy one if I had the money and was in the market for another gyuto!

I have a question about the profile. How is this knife's profile compared with a Masamoto KS? I've scanned through most of the posts on this collaboration, and know it was collective decision on a Sabatier profile, but the choice was on one of three Sabatier that seemed like it is slightly modifed from the factory profile. I'm just wondering how it compars to the Masamoto KS Wa-gyuto profile.

Lefty
07-30-2013, 09:19 PM
This knife is sent out to Rick (Pemsacola Tiger) and from there it'll be going to our man Theory. If I still had it on hand, I could do a side by side pic, and get in depth with it...maybe Rick can do it for us :D

Pensacola Tiger
07-30-2013, 09:21 PM
This knife is sent out to Rick (Pemsacola Tiger) and from there it'll be going to our man Theory. If I still had it on hand, I could do a side by side pic, and get in depth with it...maybe Rick can do it for us :D

Tom, I'll be more than happy to compare it to the Masamoto KS.

Rick

Lefty
07-30-2013, 09:55 PM
Where's PeMsacola?

Thanks, Rick!

ThEoRy
07-31-2013, 12:09 AM
This knife is sent out to Rick (Pemsacola Tiger) and from there it'll be going to our man Theory. If I still had it on hand, I could do a side by side pic, and get in depth with it...maybe Rick can do it for us :D

Cool, it has to pass the two Ricks test first. I think that's the 37th chamber of Shaolin.

sachem allison
07-31-2013, 12:45 AM
hey, what about me?

Lefty
07-31-2013, 06:26 AM
Son, I think you're Raiden....

Chuckles
07-31-2013, 08:35 AM
I thought so. This is how I've been picturing Son the whole time. :clown:

ThEoRy
07-31-2013, 08:52 AM
I thought so. This is how I've been picturing Son the whole time. :clown:

Soooo...... he's a white boy with a corny Halloween costume on?.. Got it.

Chuckles
07-31-2013, 09:06 AM
Sounds like you actually know what he looks like. And didn't play mortal combat. Got it.

Lefty
07-31-2013, 09:28 AM
Here's an actual picture of Son, just to settle this. Chuckles, you were pretty close. I think the picture you have is of a Son impersonator at the last ECG

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/90B92167-B95B-425A-B5CB-5CDE4067CCBB-5001-0000079FB543B00B.jpg

Chuckles
07-31-2013, 10:05 AM
Lefty, everytime you post in this thread I get more excited about this knife.

Justin0505
07-31-2013, 12:11 PM
I think you're both wrong. Think: a more tan version of Christopher Lambert from the movie:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtNba0XmMAg

PierreRodrigue
07-31-2013, 06:11 PM
Here's an actual picture of Son, just to settle this. Chuckles, you were pretty close. I think the picture you have is of a Son impersonator at the last ECG

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/90B92167-B95B-425A-B5CB-5CDE4067CCBB-5001-0000079FB543B00B.jpg

This one reminds me of Salty. He's just missing a sheet of paper!

Justin0505
08-01-2013, 07:25 PM
This one reminds me of Salty. He's just missing a sheet of paper!

and hes wearing a shirt

Pensacola Tiger
08-05-2013, 08:07 PM
The prototype was delivered this afternoon, and I had enough time between storms to take a few photos.

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsf5137132.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsf5137132.jpg.html)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsd99ec4ad.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsd99ec4ad.jpg.html)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps3fd13a86.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps3fd13a86.jpg.html)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps39f64375.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps39f64375.jpg.html)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps82ad5cab.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps82ad5cab.jpg.html)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps8813abde.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps8813abde.jpg.html)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps7eb9dbb0.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps7eb9dbb0.jpg.html)

This evening, it made short work of a pound of carrots, cutting them cleanly with no trace of wedging. The grind is convex enough to reduce stiction, as the carrot slices fell cleanly after being cut.

I'll have measurements, comparisons of the profile to other knives and more impressions tomorrow.

Rick

skiajl6297
08-05-2013, 08:16 PM
Awesome! :popcorn:

Lefty
08-05-2013, 08:37 PM
Nice pictures! I can't wait to read your thoughts, Rick.

bear1889
08-07-2013, 10:30 AM
Not to sound impatient but this is more of a fiscal planning question, any idea what the timeline is? Are we looking at early 2014 for putting money down or are we talking like October or November 2013?

jm2hill
08-10-2013, 02:39 AM
I've come back to the forums and I already want to buy things this can't be good for my wallet again. :)

Great looking knife and collaboration.

Notaskinnychef
08-11-2013, 02:16 AM
Pierre's summary here:
http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/10987-Possible-Lamson-Collaboration-Line-of-Knives?p=188701&viewfull=1#post188701

Though a few decisions were still needed at that point. For the open questions, it's square heel, convexed, no spacer.

Profile is here:
http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/10987-Possible-Lamson-Collaboration-Line-of-Knives?p=186529&viewfull=1#post186529

Spec is here:
http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/10987-Possible-Lamson-Collaboration-Line-of-Knives?p=186641&viewfull=1#post186641

Okay, Pierre and Lefty can correct me if I got it all wrong :)

Just bringing this forward so those asking question from time to time won't have to go as far to search them out :)

PierreRodrigue
08-15-2013, 09:56 PM
So Rick ( Pensacola Tiger ) Had a run with the knife, and passed on his thoughts. We are planning to make public all comments after the testers have had a chance to put their thoughts together. This way the next testers opinions aren't biased. I will say I am quite pleased with Ricks comments. Thanks Rick!

turbochef422
08-15-2013, 10:56 PM
Did we say its possible for no handle or are they all coming with the same one?

Pensacola Tiger
08-18-2013, 08:18 PM
The prototype is now in the hands of the next tester. Although I am reserving my critique until after testing is complete so not to bias the other testers, I will say that I am very positively impressed by the prototype. I can't wait for the production knives to become available.

Earlier in the thread questions were raised about the profile, and I made tracings of the prototype against three knives that may be familiar to members: the Masamoto 24 cm KS wa-gyuto, the Misono Swedish 24 cm gyuto and the Forgecraft 10" chef's. The prototype profile is in red; the other knife in black.

Masamoto KS

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsc45c1e3a.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsc45c1e3a.jpg.html)

Misono

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps53fd68cb.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps53fd68cb.jpg.html)

Forgecraft

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps002084a7.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps002084a7.jpg.html)

I'll also share a few photos of the saya Tom made for it. It's a really nicely fitting saya, in every way equal to Eamon's sayas.

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsa0b56fc1.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsa0b56fc1.jpg.html)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps6269f5f6.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps6269f5f6.jpg.html)

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps3c0aac8c.jpg (http://s758.photobucket.com/user/Pensacola_Tiger/media/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zps3c0aac8c.jpg.html)

marc4pt0
08-18-2013, 08:32 PM
Very nice. And thanks for the sketches, certainly answered some thoughts/curiosities I've been pondering

don
08-18-2013, 08:56 PM
Thanks for the sharing the profiles! I'm concerned about the thick neck, I tend to find thinner neck knives more comfortable.

brainsausage
08-18-2013, 09:04 PM
Thanks for the sharing the profiles! I'm concerned about the thick neck, I tend to find thinner neck knives more comfortable.

That's funny, I'm completely the opposite! Different strokes for different folks...

Pensacola Tiger
08-18-2013, 09:10 PM
Thanks for the sharing the profiles! I'm concerned about the thick neck, I tend to find thinner neck knives more comfortable.

The prototype measures 23.45 mm; the Misono Swedish is 23.10 mm. I think the hybrid handle is throwing your eye off.

Notaskinnychef
09-06-2013, 07:09 AM
sorry if this is posted elsewhere, but where do we stand at this time for the knife? How far are we from getting production rolling?

Paradox
09-12-2013, 05:31 PM
Some kind of an update on this would be awesome! ;)

Lefty
09-12-2013, 08:22 PM
Sorry guys. Still gathering information from our testers. We're onto 4 of 6. :D

franzb69
09-13-2013, 06:05 AM
i'd like to have an idea on how much this thing would cost so i could actually start saving up for it. i don't make a lot of money and the cost of my standard of living is much different from you guys so i'd like to know whenever possible.

toddnmd
09-13-2013, 10:22 AM
i'd like to have an idea on how much this thing would cost so i could actually start saving up for it. i don't make a lot of money and the cost of my standard of living is much different from you guys so i'd like to know whenever possible.

If I remember correctly, the cost was going to be around $200 . . .

Von blewitt
09-13-2013, 10:39 AM
Yep it's in the first post of this thread ^

franzb69
09-13-2013, 10:53 AM
sorry. last time i checked in on the first page on this thread, a lot of stuff was different. so i didn't know. thanks for clarification.

Lefty
09-13-2013, 01:18 PM
Yup, that's the target price. We should be in and around there, once everything is said and done. :)

Baby Huey
09-13-2013, 03:47 PM
Will these be available to ones who were not around when it started?

toddnmd
09-13-2013, 05:35 PM
Will these be available to ones who were not around when it started?

Yep, no one is on any official order list yet. Right now it's just a bunch of us who have expressed interest.

RoanRoks29
09-13-2013, 06:31 PM
I am in for 1!!

Baby Huey
09-13-2013, 07:05 PM
Same here. In for 1 if the list is still going.

toddnmd
09-14-2013, 05:22 PM
I think the plan is to get feedback from the testers, make refinements, and then finalize the specs for the knife. Then, Lefty will start doing the official orders.

Baby Huey
09-14-2013, 05:32 PM
Ahh ok.

PierreRodrigue
09-14-2013, 07:31 PM
That is the plan. There isn't an "upper limit" as far as number of pieces in the order. But the higher the piece count, the easier it will be to place the order. There may be a little tweaking to final shapes based on tester reviews. Although it will be impossible to please everybody 100% we will strive to please the largest number possible with this design.

Notaskinnychef
09-16-2013, 12:54 PM
Awesome, thanks for the update. I hope that there will be a US and Canadian distributor so that those of us in Canada won't have to deal with crossborder stuff. I assume that a chunk will be mailed to either Pierre or Lefty, while the remainder will be sent to someone within the US. Either way, I think I have been able to get enough pennies collected to make this knife buy happen :) Cheers all for working on this

sachem allison
09-16-2013, 03:41 PM
This one reminds me of Salty. He's just missing a sheet of paper!

He looks more like Mattrud. this is me

Notaskinnychef
10-02-2013, 08:39 PM
been a few weeks, update if possible please/thank you :)

Lefty
10-04-2013, 04:01 PM
All I've got is that it's been to four testers now, and we're getting good feedback. I'll admit, it's dragging a bit, and I'm getting as impatient as you guys are. Unfortunately, we need this step, so it'll keep gong like this for a little bit longer. Thanks for not losing interest!

Paradox
10-04-2013, 09:42 PM
I'm afraid it is dragging too much. In March I never would have thought I would not have one of these in my hand by October 1st. :(

brainsausage
10-04-2013, 10:53 PM
I'm afraid it is dragging too much. In March I never would have thought I would not have one of these in my hand by October 1st. :(

I honestly didn't think I'd see one of these until sometime in 2014. Not due to Tom or Pierre, but more the process of finalizing the production side of things. This isn't a few custom knives made by one guy. Not to say that is an easy endeavor, by any means. But organizing an assembly line to produce a very specific item, takes a good amount of planning beforehand. Not to mention all the R/D that needs to happen to appease this group of knuckleheads;)

chinacats
10-05-2013, 12:06 AM
How about some reviews from the testers?

franzb69
10-05-2013, 12:25 AM
How about some reviews from the testers?

yes would like to hear more about it

ThEoRy
10-05-2013, 02:05 AM
Why? It's not finished yet.

toddnmd
10-05-2013, 09:40 AM
While I'd be happy to hear from testers, it seems like their charge is to give feedback to help Lefty and Pierre make the knife even better (rather than provide the eager masses with updates). I'll wait patiently and respect their process of offering a great knife at a great value.

Lefty
10-05-2013, 10:36 AM
Todd, that means a lot. We're trying to keep this process as honest and unbiased as possible, in regards to the testers' comments. Unfortunately, we've had to keep everyone a bit in the dark in order to not affect our testers opinions. For example, if Rick were to post, "I really like the aogami super, but the cladding is more reactive than I expected it to be". The guys after him would inevitably focus their thoughts on the cladding, while subconsciously accepting that the core steel was performing well enough to almost ignore it all together. One thing I would love to see more of is pictures from our "panel" of the knife in use, and even a video should anyone be interested.

I will say, however, that we've had many positive comments, and any negatives have been both consistent (for the most part) and a very good solution as been decided upon by Pierre and myself.

Again, thanks for all of the interest and support with this project.

Dusty
10-05-2013, 11:10 AM
I hope the testers are being brutal in their appraisal of the knife. That wil only serve to make it better.

Lefty
10-05-2013, 11:23 AM
We've had a couple brutal ones.... Haha. But, as you said, it's going to make this knife even better. Even the brutally honest comments have been matters of taste, or something that we immediately agreed with. Again, the overall feeling has been very promising.

Notaskinnychef
10-07-2013, 07:44 PM
Excellent, thanks for that update. I understand this is a long process, and wasn't expecting a boatload of information, but its always nice to get a snapshot of the process and see where it currently stands. Cheers

marc4pt0
10-22-2013, 09:15 AM
http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a520/marc4pt0/forum%20knife/20131009_141837_zpse4ca93e3.jpg
http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a520/marc4pt0/forum%20knife/20131009_141856_zpsa20e6637.jpg
http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a520/marc4pt0/forum%20knife/20131009_142132_zps241063f5.jpg
http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a520/marc4pt0/forum%20knife/20131009_141825_zpsf249fdcd.jpg
http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a520/marc4pt0/forum%20knife/20131009_142115_zpsc9176a07.jpg
http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a520/marc4pt0/forum%20knife/20131009_143621_zps1154b7d0.jpg
http://i1281.photobucket.com/albums/a520/marc4pt0/forum%20knife/20131009_143713_zpsdbcc9b42.jpg

I took the liberty to compare it to Rodrigue Mid tech knife solely for a bit of contrast. In the pic above, the mid tech is on the left. Those who have seen the mid tech know that this knife is like tin foil thin. The project knife, though obviously not as thin throughout, does offer an excellent distal taper.

And I'm also a big fan that Rodrigue is stamped INTO the blade, not painted on.
Also, hats off to Lefty for his saya! Solid work which I suspect he'll be soon be flooded with requests for once this knife hits "the shelves".

PushCut
11-01-2013, 01:08 AM
I think I'd like to get in line for this. How long are the blades going to be?

skiajl6297
11-01-2013, 08:52 AM
...In the pic above, the mid tech is on the left. Those who have seen the mid tech know that this knife is like tin foil thin. The project knife, though obviously not as thin throughout, does offer an excellent distal taper.

Did you mean in this pic the midtech is on the RIGHT? The midtech is the thinner of the two, on the right side, correct?

marc4pt0
11-01-2013, 09:45 AM
Yessir! Thanks for pointing that out.

Lefty
11-01-2013, 10:03 AM
The blades are going to be 240mm, but we've actually been discussing a few things along the way, and there is still one tester to use it, review it and then give us some "back and forth".

As it stands right now, there are many great attributes with this knife, and a few that we will be tweaking. My goal really is to have this in the top tier of $200 production knives. I'm particular, and as a result sometimes things take a while to get done. These are important steps, and I appreciate everyone's patience. :)

stereo.pete
11-03-2013, 10:55 AM
The blades are going to be 240mm, but we've actually been discussing a few things along the way, and there is still one tester to use it, review it and then give us some "back and forth".

As it stands right now, there are many great attributes with this knife, and a few that we will be tweaking. My goal really is to have this in the top tier of $200 production knives. I'm particular, and as a result sometimes things take a while to get done. These are important steps, and I appreciate everyone's patience. :)

Did Pierre grind the distal tapers in those knives, if so good god man, he is a master?!

CoqaVin
11-03-2013, 12:21 PM
Did Pierre grind the distal tapers in those knives, if so good god man, he is a master?!

would this knife be considered a workhorse type knife"?

Pensacola Tiger
11-03-2013, 12:29 PM
would this knife be considered a workhorse type knife"?

What do you mean by "workhorse"? The term "workhorse", just like the term "laser" is so vague as to be useless in describing a knife.

CoqaVin
11-03-2013, 12:33 PM
I really don't know why I asked that that way

I should of asked if it will stand up to the pro environment on a daily basis whats the geometry like what are the specs?

Pensacola Tiger
11-03-2013, 02:40 PM
I really don't know why I asked that that way

I should of asked if it will stand up to the pro environment on a daily basis whats the geometry like what are the specs?

Tom spelled out the general specifications in this post: http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/10987-Possible-Lamson-Collaboration-Line-of-Knives?p=185491&viewfull=1#post185491

It is intended to be used by a pro in a pro environment.

Based on my week of testing, the prototype has very good geometry, but is likely to be "tweaked" before actual production.

More details would have to come from Pierre or Tom.

CoqaVin
11-03-2013, 02:48 PM
did you test it at work?

Pensacola Tiger
11-03-2013, 04:04 PM
did you test it at work?

No, I don't work in a professional setting. My impressions are based on a week of use in a home environment.

ThEoRy
11-04-2013, 12:00 AM
I tested it at work.

CoqaVin
11-04-2013, 11:09 AM
I tested it at work.

How wasthe edge retention

Mucho Bocho
11-04-2013, 11:22 AM
Here we go, Just what Lefty was trying to NOT let happen. Folks, the knifes going to be bad-ass, give it a chance to go through its paces without expectation at this point. Just enjoy the ride and wait till the fat-lady sings. No offense to fat ladies ;-)

CoqaVin
11-04-2013, 12:36 PM
Here we go, Just what Lefty was trying to NOT let happen. Folks, the knifes going to be bad-ass, give it a chance to go through its paces without expectation at this point. Just enjoy the ride and wait till the fat-lady sings. No offense to fat ladies ;-)

I was not trying to start a debate on how good its going to be obviously if Pierre and Lefty are making it it has to be good right ;)

I just want some feedback thats all and I am sure that is what Lefty wants/wanted no?

Notaskinnychef
11-04-2013, 12:56 PM
I was not trying to start a debate on how good its going to be obviously if Pierre and Lefty are making it it has to be good right ;)

I just want some feedback thats all and I am sure that is what Lefty wants/wanted no?

it was mentioned earlier on in this thread by Lefty that he did not want the testers to give public feedback until everyone was done, since he didn't want it to influence each subsequent tester. Each tester is giving their feedback directly to Lefty and Pierre and they will address each testers concerns therefore we shouldn't really worry about it.

ThEoRy
11-04-2013, 02:26 PM
How wasthe edge retention

Someone cut through a shoe with it on the floor. Then I diced some onions. :)

PierreRodrigue
11-04-2013, 08:22 PM
Lol!! Thanks Rick, I still laugh when I think about that! I will step in, Tom can back me up. The testers have been blunt and honest. Some critiques were not an issue for others and vise versa, and there were some common points. The reviews will be touched on in public, and the corrections explained. We want to make this to please as many as possible, but will not be able to please all.

Notaskinnychef
11-05-2013, 05:03 PM
Sounds great Pierre, thanks also to Lefty and all the testers who took the time to break down their experiences with the knife

quantumcloud509
11-07-2013, 01:24 AM
Wow, just found this thread. Def something to look forward to.

Chuckles
11-07-2013, 11:23 AM
Just the tip. Rader, Prototype, Fowler.

CoqaVin
11-07-2013, 12:16 PM
Just the tip. Rader, Prototype, Fowler.

looks like a cool grind

tomsch
11-09-2013, 10:55 PM
Just found this thread. I'm in!

PushCut
01-04-2014, 07:57 PM
Any idea what's happening with this project at the moment?

Pensacola Tiger
01-04-2014, 08:14 PM
Any idea what's happening with this project at the moment?

AFAIK, testing of the prototype is ongoing.

rdmalak
01-04-2014, 09:06 PM
This testing seems to be taking quite some time. Far longer than anticipated.

Pensacola Tiger
01-04-2014, 09:17 PM
This testing seems to be taking quite some time. Far longer than anticipated.

“You can have it cheap, fast or good. Pick any two.”

Mrmnms
01-04-2014, 09:20 PM
“You can have it cheap, fast or good. Pick any two.”

I think I'll use that !

Fran Rendina
01-04-2014, 09:27 PM
I'm in

greasedbullet
01-04-2014, 09:28 PM
I will take cheap and good please.

PierreRodrigue
01-04-2014, 10:30 PM
Thats the goal. I spoke with Lefty(Tom) yesterday, The knife is on route to one more tester. I think the last one. Then we will finally sort out any upgrades, revisions. The last thing we want to do is pick a crap profile, push it to production, and crank out a couple hundred letter openers!! We are going slow for a reason, testing and reviewing in an effort to not make a dud. It ain't happening if it ain't worth doing right.

turbochef422
01-04-2014, 11:13 PM
I actually think you should do a second round of testing after the knife is upgraded or changed. You might as well make sure it's right before it gets produced.

brainsausage
01-04-2014, 11:59 PM
I imagine a lot of the old knife knuts here are shaking their head at the impatience of some of their fellow forumites. I know some of you guys have waited YEARS, PLURAL, for custom knives.

Miles
01-05-2014, 01:40 AM
I concur. Testing following any revisions is important. Yes, I've waited multiple turns of the calendar. I really don't think that rushing the development and testing process will generate the end result I think we're all looking for.

rdmalak
01-05-2014, 11:58 AM
I agree that creating something that is not a worth while product does no one any good. I guess the expectation put in place of when it would be complete just needs an update.

Lefty
01-05-2014, 06:03 PM
Guys, I appreciate all of the patience, but honestly, this has stalled because I'm not attaching my name to something that I'm not proud of. The comments have been really solid, all around, but not good enough for me. I'm a demanding SOB, and until this is what I want it to be, it's not happening...at least not with my name on it. Pierre and I have talked pretty in depth about the whole thing, and we don't feel putting a knife that we don't 100% believe in, for the sake of making a knife, is smart. In fact, it's flat out stupid, and not what I do. It's not what Pierre does either. Period.

I have redesigned the knife with many tweaks, and I'll be sharing it with a few testers before I throw it on here. As I said - the reviews have been good, but good is not great...thus, I'm not ok with it.

Also, to be perfectly candid, I'm contemplating seeking out another maker so I can be sure you guys get what you deserve after being so patient with this project. You deserve a knife that makes you wonder why you spent $500 on that Carter, when you could have spent half and gotten a knife that makes you feel like a god damn champ.

Thanks for your understanding, and yeah, I'm a dick-headed dictator when I need to be...sorry. :)

toddnmd
01-05-2014, 06:47 PM
Lefty, I appreciate your approach and commitment to making a great knife that's a great value.

Please take the time you guys need to do it right!

Dardeau
01-05-2014, 06:53 PM
After reading that I want everything to make me feel like a god damned champ, and everything I do to make everyone else feel like a god damned champ. Well said

Notaskinnychef
01-05-2014, 07:45 PM
I WANNA BE A CHAMP!!! I've always been the chump so this excites me :)

Good work you two on keeping this moving forward and keeping the standards high, cheers

JHunter
01-05-2014, 07:53 PM
After looking all of this over it is very intriguing and look forward to seeing something amazing out of a serious commitment to exceptional standards. And I want one whenever they may come to fruition.

rdmalak
01-05-2014, 08:01 PM
Guys, I appreciate all of the patience, but honestly, this has stalled because I'm not attaching my name to something that I'm not proud of. The comments have been really solid, all around, but not good enough for me. I'm a demanding SOB, and until this is what I want it to be, it's not happening...at least not with my name on it. Pierre and I have talked pretty in depth about the whole thing, and we don't feel putting a knife that we don't 100% believe in, for the sake of making a knife, is smart. In fact, it's flat out stupid, and not what I do. It's not what Pierre does either. Period.

I have redesigned the knife with many tweaks, and I'll be sharing it with a few testers before I throw it on here. As I said - the reviews have been good, but good is not great...thus, I'm not ok with it.

Also, to be perfectly candid, I'm contemplating seeking out another maker so I can be sure you guys get what you deserve after being so patient with this project. You deserve a knife that makes you wonder why you spent $500 on that Carter, when you could have spent half and gotten a knife that makes you feel like a god damn champ.

Thanks for your understanding, and yeah, I'm a dick-headed dictator when I need to be...sorry. :)

Thank you for the honest update. I have no trouble waiting but it's very nice to be informed as to why. It sounds like you both are putting a lot pressure on yourselves to get this knife right and have it be a resounding success. I'm very glad to hear that. I might be in for two on that basis. :)

Chef Andy
01-05-2014, 08:12 PM
Is it still possible to get in on this? The thought of a Canadian collaboration sends shivers down my spine. Needed something to fill that void anyways since the cold snap we were having in ottawa just broke yesterday.

toddnmd
01-05-2014, 08:44 PM
Nobody is officially "in" on this. They'll take orders after the design is finalized.

And I believe they're going to let demand determine production.

Chef Andy
01-05-2014, 08:50 PM
Nobody is officially "in" on this. They'll take orders after the design is finalized.

And I believe they're going to let demand determine production.

Ok good to hear. Thanks for letting me know.

EdipisReks
01-05-2014, 09:23 PM
a knife that makes you feel like a god damn champ.

Can you make a knife that makes me feel like a chimp, instead?

NO ChoP!
01-05-2014, 09:30 PM
Wait Champ's? So I get some wings with my knife? Awesome....I like them extra hot with blue cheese.

Lefty
01-05-2014, 10:28 PM
Jacob, I'm sure I can come up with something. You start by peeling your bananas upside down....

Chris, I think you may or may not be drunk. :D

EdipisReks
01-05-2014, 10:30 PM
ook! ook!

PierreRodrigue
01-05-2014, 10:49 PM
Tom and I are beating around some changes, that will elevate this build. Some slight changes to profile and ergonomics, maybe compromises on materials. No changes will be for the sake of settling for something, but adding to the knife as a whole.

Tom mentioned some changes based on feedback, and some from personal preference. As a maker, I feel these changes are solid, and worth the effort. It amounts to millimeters here and there, and will add to geometry, comfort, and aesthetics.

This whole process may seem long winded, tedious, maybe over the top, but we feel pretty strongly that it will be worth it. This will not be a "house knife" but it will be a piece designed from the ground up, for professionals and home users alike. No bling, no bull$#!t. Just a solid affordable knife.

Lefty
01-05-2014, 11:02 PM
Pierre is bang on, as usual. I think we got busy/frustrated with feeling stuck/etc, and the we talked it over multiple times and we are more excited about it now than ever. The knife will be a bit different than you all saw before, but based on comments and preferences (as Pierre mentioned), we feel the changes are for the best. The panel has been immeasurably helpful, and while it's already a very good knife, we're confident that with the input of our guys, it will be great.

Just because I respect the hell out of him, I should also say that my earlier comment is not a knock on Murray Carter. He's the man - I'm just saying we hope our knife gives you amazing performance at a very reasonable price.

tomsch
01-17-2014, 09:13 PM
Sign me up! Any timeline?

Erilyn75
01-21-2014, 04:30 AM
Beautiful profile. Can't wait to see the finished product. If it was AEB-L I'd totally take one. Keeping my fingers crossed ;)

Paradox
03-25-2014, 01:44 PM
Is this in the shitcan now?

toddnmd
03-25-2014, 03:52 PM
Is this in the shitcan now?

I sure hope not! And I'd kind of doubt it, considering all the interest, and time/energy investment so far. Though maybe a couple comments here will prompt an update . . .

Dusty
03-25-2014, 05:25 PM
Gee, I sure do wonder what's happening with this knife now!

:crossfingers:

(... ...that should do it.)

77kath
03-25-2014, 05:38 PM
Me, too! I'm saving up.

brainsausage
03-25-2014, 05:41 PM
Not a good idea to poke The Bear(have you guys seen how big Pierre is...?)

PierreRodrigue
03-26-2014, 12:16 AM
When last I spoke with Tom, the knife went to a final tester. At that time, it had not returned, nor was Tom able to get a response from the tester. I spoke with Tom a bit ago, and we still want to go ahead with this, but this turn of events, kinda was a kick in the nuts. This is the second time a pass around piece of mine disappeared. It quite discouraging. The whole point of the pass around was two fold. One to get feedback, and two to get the knife back to examine it. To see how the materials held up... It is a set back, I now have to build another to have Lamson a place to work from.

tchan001
03-26-2014, 01:01 AM
I just found this forum recently. Is it still ok to express an interest in this project? If so, I'm in.

ThEoRy
03-26-2014, 02:36 AM
When last I spoke with Tom, the knife went to a final tester. At that time, it had not returned, nor was Tom able to get a response from the tester. I spoke with Tom a bit ago, and we still want to go ahead with this, but this turn of events, kinda was a kick in the nuts. This is the second time a pass around piece of mine disappeared. It quite discouraging. The whole point of the pass around was two fold. One to get feedback, and two to get the knife back to examine it. To see how the materials held up... It is a set back, I now have to build another to have Lamson a place to work from.

Are you ******* serious?!! I really hope there were extenuating circumstances involved here and not nefarious intentions. I remember the last time it happened, I gave your knife to someone and then poof, off the radar for months. I tried calling, went to his house, nothing. I think hurricane Sandy may have been a factor but I'm not sure. I had some thoughts about something else happening behind the scenes but I couldn't confirm. Or maybe I'm just paranoid. If you are interested in these thoughts Pierre, send me a PM and put your tin foil hat on.

toddnmd
03-26-2014, 08:48 AM
When last I spoke with Tom, the knife went to a final tester. At that time, it had not returned, nor was Tom able to get a response from the tester. I spoke with Tom a bit ago, and we still want to go ahead with this, but this turn of events, kinda was a kick in the nuts. This is the second time a pass around piece of mine disappeared. It quite discouraging. The whole point of the pass around was two fold. One to get feedback, and two to get the knife back to examine it. To see how the materials held up... It is a set back, I now have to build another to have Lamson a place to work from.

That is really disappointing. It really bothers me when people's personal knives aren't returned in a passaround, but this one particularly stings. I'd assume the testers were senior and known members, and it bothers me even more that someone would abuse the trust of Tom & Pierre, as well as the entire community.

PierreRodrigue
03-26-2014, 08:52 AM
Are you ******* serious?!! I really hope there were extenuating circumstances involved here and not nefarious intentions. I remember the last time it happened, I gave your knife to someone and then poof, off the radar for months. I tried calling, went to his house, nothing. I think hurricane Sandy may have been a factor but I'm not sure. I had some thoughts about something else happening behind the scenes but I couldn't confirm. Or maybe I'm just paranoid. If you are interested in these thoughts Pierre, send me a PM and put your tin foil hat on.

I forgot about that one. It did come home however, so no harm, no foul. The other I refereed to was a straight razor, not technically a knife, but same result. Maybe some people like my knives enough to consider signing a pass around with intent...

WildBoar
03-26-2014, 11:29 AM
Hopefully there is a good explanation, like the guy got thrown in jail for 60 days and when he gets out he will finish his review and send on the knife, along with a matching shiv he made himself in the jail shop.

ThEoRy
03-26-2014, 11:39 AM
Hopefully there is a good explanation, like the guy got thrown in jail for 60 days and when he gets out he will finish his review and send on the knife, along with a matching shiv he made himself in the jail shop.

Take a bunch of cigarette pack cellophane wrappers, melt them down into a block then sharpen it against concrete and wrap electrical tape around the base for a handle.

turbochef422
03-26-2014, 02:50 PM
im guesing if this person was doing a review for a prototype knife and it was sent to professionals only he must be someone that most people here know. If its in new york let me know and i'll see if I can go get it for you

PierreRodrigue
03-26-2014, 03:42 PM
It appears to be in Minneapolis. If the person currently in possession of this knife is on this board, please contact Tom or myself, and make an effort to return it. I will even pay shipping, if that is the issue.

Lefty
03-26-2014, 04:27 PM
Pierre and I have tried taking the high road, but now it's beyond that. I hope it can get returned without any further measures needing to be taken....

cheflarge
03-26-2014, 05:05 PM
Sucks! If we don't look out for each other, then whom will? The chef & knife nut community is very special, almost sacred & when someone defaces our trust & brotherhood, well it just SUCK!!!

turbochef422
03-26-2014, 08:34 PM
I really wanted to go get it bc I've been itching to get in a little trouble. Probably all for the best it's far away

Lefty
03-26-2014, 09:25 PM
I still have faith that this will turn up. The member who has/last had it is a solid guy, from what I know. I hand picked the list, and really doubt I'd be that off on my judgement.

gavination
03-27-2014, 03:24 AM
I still have faith that this will turn up. The member who has/last had it is a solid guy, from what I know. I hand picked the list, and really doubt I'd be that off on my judgement.

Time to handpick an elite retrieval task force...

brainsausage
03-27-2014, 08:22 AM
Time to handpick an elite retrieval task force...

That's Zweifel's job.

PierreRodrigue
03-27-2014, 08:31 AM
Covered! :happymug:
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/4063115200828d741ff202a69705c7a5_zps6c3819d4.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/4063115200828d741ff202a69705c7a5_zps6c3819d4.jpg.h tml)

WarrenB
03-27-2014, 09:10 AM
Covered! :happymug:
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/4063115200828d741ff202a69705c7a5_zps6c3819d4.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/4063115200828d741ff202a69705c7a5_zps6c3819d4.jpg.h tml)

:Ooooh: Just return the knife whoever has it:scared4:

gavination
03-27-2014, 01:16 PM
Covered! :happymug:
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/4063115200828d741ff202a69705c7a5_zps6c3819d4.jpg (http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/4063115200828d741ff202a69705c7a5_zps6c3819d4.jpg.h tml)

Can I drive the tank?!?! I've always wanted a tank...

And a fighter jet... :D

WildBoar
03-27-2014, 02:33 PM
You're sending ChucktheButcher after him?!?

toddnmd
03-27-2014, 05:17 PM
Chuck and his brother!

Lefty
04-19-2014, 07:13 PM
Alright, guys. After a lot of back and forth, and tons of coversation with Pierre, and a fair bit with the testers, I came up with a tweaked design. As you can see, this was sketched a couple months ago, but I've been pretty busy, and Pierre and I have been trying to figure out the best way to go about this all.

We had lots of great comments, and a few of the same "this could be tweaked, but I like it" type of comments. Of course, we had some little negatives that I feel we have tackled with this design. Mind the edge profile (it will stay pretty much the same), and I have added a few stylistic points that are my "flavour".

We realize this is for our guys here, first, so I want everyone's opinion. Please, let us know honestly, if you like this direction.

As always, thanks in advance. :)

http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/485C82FC-7AA4-4597-AEC7-6A7CABFCB2F0-19109-0000196225AD7CB7_zpsec67952c.jpg

Lefty
04-19-2014, 07:24 PM
I should add that this version is only a possibility, depending on how it is received.

Von blewitt
04-19-2014, 08:14 PM
I personally don't like a sloped back choil, but I can live with it, 56mm at the heel will give the knife some longevity, also the handle looks quite large? I like that you're giving it some style.

rdmalak
04-19-2014, 09:51 PM
I's really hard to tell from a non scale drawing but I still like it. Sorta looks like your 180mm Harner with the elastic band.

jai
04-19-2014, 09:53 PM
I like my knives shorter and no sloped choil aswell but it looks like a nice profile

ThEoRy
04-19-2014, 10:40 PM
I can't say I like it since the proportion is off. If the height is 56mm than the length is about 44mm short according to my super scientific "count the squares" theory. Handle seems extra tall too. I am glad to hear this is still in the works and I look forward to checking it out in it's new incarnation.

jai
04-19-2014, 10:52 PM
I didnt mean shorter in length I meant in heal height. Lol I reread what I wrote

Lefty
04-19-2014, 11:13 PM
Yeah, I literally sketched it in the cab of the firetruck, one day, and didn't use any "sure science". Haha.

cclin
04-19-2014, 11:33 PM
The profile looks a lots like my z-kramer chef knife with lower tip & sloped choil.......

Lefty
04-20-2014, 12:56 AM
Well, I don't think this is going over too well, so maybe bak to the drawing board.

Thinking more heel height (than the original)
A bit of a handle tweak
Maybe more thickness at the spine (if it works)
A tiny (and I mean tiny) bit higher tip than the prototype.

I wish I was sleeping, by the way.

ecchef
04-20-2014, 06:13 AM
Was the pass around prototype ever returned?

toddnmd
04-20-2014, 08:22 AM
I think it's hard to generate good feedback with a sketch like that. The numbers are helpful, but that drawing makes the knife look taller, in relation to its length, that it would really be. How about sharing some more accurate drawings (such as some of the ones I remember at the beginning of this project)?

Was that a year or so ago?!?

PierreRodrigue
04-20-2014, 09:39 AM
So. I took the time to review all the posts, and select some of the early discussions, as a review. I know it has been a long time since this has been on any ones mind. These quotes are a time line of what was discussed in order. Tom and I discussed tweeks. Any thing I add today will be in blue script.

"A good compromising length is 255mm, it's smack in the middle of 240-270 and I'd be willing to settle on that. O1 or 52100 hardened to 62-63, modified Sab profile, 2.5-3mm at the spine, "s" shaped grind, real thin behind the edge, 52mm height, distal taper, tapered tang, integral bolster, no fingerguard/full bolster, fully rounded spine and choil, stabilized burl handle, 1 mosaic pin."

"There are a lot of great ideas here, but as this is going to be a production knife, I would try to concentrate on things achievable in a production knife at a decent price point. It might not end up the exact knife with all the bells and whistles you wanted, but hey, that is what customs are for. We have plenty of craftsman here for that as well. Think of it as maximizing your value. Sure, you can spring for integral bolsters, but that might increase the price by 50% or end up compromising the finish or material quality. Combination or concave grinds are labor intensive in both the grinding and finishing processes. Coke bottle westerns are great, I love them, but they don't really lend themselves to mass production. Both require a skilled craftsman's work, ie, no robots. Even wood: stabilizing adds cost and there some great oily natural woods out there. Cocobolo, wenge, rosewood, etc. The supplier can also buy them in large blocks/boards, as opposed to many small pre stabilized pieces.

If you are going with a Sab/Forgecraft inspired profile, then I would use that as a basis for your theme: An updated Sab/Forge with improved steel, readily available, with no restoration needed. Any of the steels mentioned in this thread qualify. Carbon obviously fits the theme a little better than stainless. Plus it sounds like Lefty really likes O1. 10"/255mm edge. Forgecraft style handle with a natural wood, which makes for simple wa conversions. Finish would most likely be simple machine finish, not much in the way of options there. You maniacs can attack them with whatever mesh or stones or paper you have laying around. Where you put your money is the grind and distal taper. Unlike some of the examples in the first paragraph, I think a strong distal taper is something that can be achievable with this project, but it will add cost. When grinding thin, it is cheaper to start with thin stock, that simple. Thin stock does not lead to dramatic distal tapers. Starting with thick stock and distal taper kinda sorta dictates your grind, which would lend itself well to a slight convex on the upper half of the face, with most of the stock removal and convexing on the lower half of the blade face, to get thin behind the edge like everyone likes. Should be a sturdy cutter, suitable for any linecook or homecook. I think you will end up with an affordable performer that leaves the door open for plenty of tweaking and customization, but still had a fairly unique identity. "

"Damn, I made one of the first posts in this thread, but something happened and it got swallowed by the cyber-abyss.
It all worked out though and I think that people have already brought up most of my suggestions / opinions.

Aside from just talking specs, I think it's important to have a clear design philosophy for the knife:

-It should be a homage to the hay-day of Lamson / 1900's American knife making, but updated / informed by what we have learned since then from Japanese, European (French), and North American customs.

-It should be about utility, craftsmanship, and quality. I love fancy burl and mosaic pins too, but IMO they have no place on this knife. Anything that adds bling, but does not add function, performance, or value per$ should not be on this knife. All North American materials and labor.

-It should be carbon mono-steel. Not stainless, not san-mai. I like fancy cladding. I like laminate construction, but that's not what this knife is about. I think 01 sound great.

-It should be robust / rigid at the spine for at least 3/4 of the blade. Strong spine, but THIN behind the edge. I like Lefty's "almost" grind profile but it should transition from the heel to tip (in conjunction w/ the distal taper) to a flat-grind near the tip.

- Profile should be reasonably flat, flat "sweet spot" near the tip, but its important to understand that even gyutos that LOOK flat near the heal are not actually truly flat in any one spot for more than an inch or so. If any one has even used a knife that actually has big, dead flat section of edge, it feels just that: DEAD. It creates a horrible "clunk" when a big section of edge all hits board at the same time.

-It should have a full tang(distal taper) with western scales. Handle should look clean and with obvious roots in tradition, but no bolster and nice and thin before the blade. Great handles are great because of perfectly placed nuances. It should be comfortable for a full range of hand sizes. I may be in the minority here, but I think that handle should me maintenance free: resin-stabilize wood, g10, or micarta... Personally I like the simple, classy look of polished black linen micarta and simple silver pins

-This knife should be the answer to the "What knife should I buy?" question of "I'm looking for 1 good knife where I can learn about carbon steel, proper (non- rockn' chop) technique, and which I will not out grow. It must be durable enough for whatever work I throw at it, and comfortable enough for many hours of continuous use."


"Here's what we have so far. We're thinking O1 (and maybe a stainless like AEB-L if we can), hardened to Pierre's specs, to 61-62hrc. The handle design is coming, so you never know. We might be able to do a mix of western and wa.

Here's the initial drawing. This is a starting point, and way to get the ideas flowing. You can see it's a Sab, with a cool topline, dropped tip and tightened choil (compared to Pierre's). Let me know what you think.

Thanks, guys!
http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/6BD606B2-C130-432F-9673-AA477806B318-10559-00000C8E493DCB2E.jpg

Here are the specs on my rendition...

50mm high at the heel

250mm cutting edge

2.5mm spine at the bolster

1.5mm mid spine

.8mm 1 inch from the tip, give or take of course...

So raising the heel is easy. to say 53-55 mm?

Keep it frickin simple people. We're trying to make a knife for the masses, right? That is the point, correct? How do most people hold a knife? By the handle. Not with a pinch grip. I KNOW- not everyone has the same grip, but the majority of people DO(I personally use a pinch grip, but I've learned from experience- that the majority of people do not). So who are we designing this knife for? Ourselves? Pros? Semi pros? The unenlightened? The inbetweeners?

A simple, comfy handle, will help to accentuate a superior blade profile. And no- I don't think blade profiles are quite as negotiable as handles. What is a simple comfy handle? I'm not sure yet. But wa's are still a bit foreign to the majority(and this coming from someone who HEAVILY PREFERS WA'S!). Marketing can help overcome this, but that's a whole other kettle...

Trying to take into account after market customization is limiting the end product. Presume that it's made to last. And if it succeeds- produce another line that's better suited to nitpicking.



My vision for this knife is somewhat complicated and multi-leveled. I see this knife being:

Around 7 years from now, like the Hattori Forum knife.

The answer to, "I really want a great carbon steel knife that will last and impress for a very reasonable price. What should I get"?

And the stainless version that I hope comes out as a clone, with different steel should be the answer to, "What knife should I get that is low maintenance, and pure performance"?

This knife should not need to be upgraded, nor should it have what I call a "throw away handle". These aren't Carter SFGZ knives...no offense, Murray (we all know you read this forum).

Even though the price will be very reasonable, I don't want it to appear that we cheaped out. In fact, I won't cheap out. You'd be amazed what we can get done for a difference of only a few bucks.

This knife should be one that we don't get tired of in a year; It will be designed with quality and style in mind, and not a fleeting trend, or on the premise of, "well, guys are just going to change it anyways"

To further emphasis the above point, this is a complete package and NOT a knife blank.

This knife is designed with the input of the members here, to match up with our ideals, and overall skill-set. While we aren't all knife ninjas. We most definitely do have better knife skills than many chefs out there, and 99% of the general public.

However, there's no reason an advanced knife with upscale styling, great quality and high performance can't be affordable, feel good in anyone's hand and make people look at it and think, "Now that's a knife I would like to own".



"One of the craftsmen here recently posted a photo of a Forgecraft they re-handled and I can't seem to find it. It looked outstanding and IIRC it would be a super example of inspiration for this project. Maybe someone will recall it and post a link up for us?

I think it is important for this knife to have a handle that allows it to stand firmly on it's own as a complete knife."



"Gentlemen, food for though. From a construction point of view first.

Bolsters. An issue has been raised with galvanic reaction. Copper if not cared for could likely turn dark, then green. You have voiced an objection to stainless. Fair enough. I would like to suggest bronze. It is a mix of brass and tin, as you know, and would be less likely to turn then copper, or straight brass. Thoughts?

Pins. Or as far as a produced knife goes, rivets. There are a few sizes, essentially, the smallest is .1875 in dia. Issue with the pins/rivets is color match to the bolsters. I believe there are brass, stainless, and maybe nickel/silver. No copper, no bronze.

Potential configuration. In my minds eye, I think bronze bolsters, and cocobolo would look sweet, and unique. The pin issue can be as simple as nothing visible. Blind/hidden pins are a possible answer.

The issue is... When constructing a knife in mass numbers, the more a knife, or component is handled, the cost rises. So for example lets take a knife through the steps.
1. profiles are computer fitted to a sheet to yield as little waste as possible.
2. cut out by precision laser.
3. Heat treated
4. ground, and polished to desired finish
5. in another part of the shop, the handle scales are profiled and drilled/countersunk to receive the rivets. Bolsters have been CNC machined to desired profile, and drilled to accept the pins.
6. bolsters are epoxied/pinned/pressed into place
7. Scales are epoxied, rivets placed, scales checked to ensure a tight fit, then the rivets are pressed to secure them. And laid aside to cure.
7b. scales are epoxied, pinned/clamped, by hand and laid aside to cure. (much more time and hands on here)
8. Handle is trimmed, shaped, and polished.
8b. pins are trimmed flush, handle is trimmed, shaped and polished

It doesn't sound like much of a difference, but to clamp ( 2 clamps per knife) 80 or so knives would take a considerable amount of time. Its not out of the question, but would add cost and is a PITA in terms of production.

Now this post will be a surprise to Tom, as he has been busy today. So I apologize if this post is out of turn, or not along the projects vision. Just options, and an explanation of how the knife will be built. Reading how it will come together, will dispel some ideas we may have of possible options. Remember, these are not customs. We want to build a solid, aesthetically pleasing knife, out of quality materials, for a low price, that will be acceptable to the group as a whole.

As an added FYI, I was speaking to my steel guy today, and talking of new things coming down the pipe. He informed me on the composition of the O1 we will be using, and chemically speaking, it will sit squarely between white 1, and blue 2. It is a very clean smelt, and will produce an excellent carbon steel knife. I am excited to be part of this project.

Also, Lamson is taking interest in this thread, and has read it from end to end!"



"The O1 we have procured, chemically falls between White 1 and Blue 2. As a steel, it isn't as reactive or stinky as most. It likes to patina blues and purples in proteins. Don't misread this, it can and will rust as any carbon will.

It has a great, fine grain structure, and is awesome at HRC 61-62. But "sings"
if taken higher. For this project, and for toughness sake, I recommend 61-62. Much higher increases the risk of chipping.

52100 has been coined by some as poor mans O1."



"I understand the original goal was a throwback design. A solid carbon steel (O1) A solid retro-ish profile (A tweaked sab profile) Natural stable wood (cocobolo)

The hickups were on which handle. This is where we explored new territory. Some wanted wa, some wanted western, some bolsters, some no bolsters, some one pin some 3 pins. This made it tough to please everybody 100%. Ain't gonna happen...

So Here are my thoughts, to take some of most of the wants and make a handle that when looked at is understated and different, yet embodies the spirit of what we started to create.

How can a geometric octagonal Wa, and a curvy western be combined? I tried to combine the taper of a wa, the height and width of a western, the facets of a wa, and some of the westerns curves and feel. How do we do a cross on a bolster, and no bolster... we cant. BUT, we can use materials that are visually subdued, and still aesthetically pleasing. Copper wasn't the answer, or the first mockup, so back to the drawing board. G10 shaped to match the facets on the handle.

How do we pay homage to the handles of old, yet not make a copy? To that end, we have the flats and beveled corners, slightly tapering handle, with three pins. Why not a traditional wood. No real reason, only there are other choices that have nice figure, are solid, and relatively stable. Why add G10? I think capping the end of the handle at the "food" end makes sense for cleanliness, comfort, and looks. Check out some of the 50 plus year old knives with straight wood handles out there. The fronts are stained, chipped, splitting, lifting etc. Could we have gone that route? Yes. Is there a real reason apart from historical accuracy to do it? I don't know. We are paying homage to an old style, top materials, and having it built by the oldest knife maker, I think, in North America. We have a chance to build the next classic (hopefully!) with input from a large group of knife enthusiasts who can say "we were part of that".

I don't want to sound corny (too late I fear! lol!) there is no way to please all of you who posted ideas, but we took what most of you liked, and trashed most of what you didn't like. All the while trying to keep some tradition in the design, and bring that tradition into the present.

Look at it this way. We have designed a knife from the ground up in a week that may not be historically accurate, but has its roots in history. When you look at it, you will see Sab, Forgecraft, and even Lamson.
We agreed to use a company that hasn't been given the time of day around here, give them a chance to do it our way, and generated some excitement doing it! Nearly 14000 views in a week! Either your interested in the knife, or your interested in the process of the design, but hell! Thanks for being part of it!

Now. Any other things we need to work on? We got time and resources! A prototype is next!"



http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/94B014D5-F545-4733-8727-8F924327A7FE-11094-00000BF5F79A5E7C.jpg
http://s631.photobucket.com/user/bladebuilder/media/IMG_0588_zpsead37ea9.jpg.html
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0589_zpsf0491339.jpg
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0591_zps388fdeb7.jpg
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu37/bladebuilder/IMG_0595_zps1465000e.jpg
http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc399/Lefty-T/8B4E2E5E-DC91-4B0D-9253-3CB269ECC72F-9561-00000DAB149352B0.jpg
http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/Pensacola_Tiger/Rodrigue-Lamson%20O1%20prototype%20gyuto/file_zpsf5137132.jpg



So, as discussed there are to be some tweaks. This post is a refresher on how we got here, It took a bit of time to go through everything, and I am sure you all aren't gonna do it, neither will the older members remember all that went down. This will also bring the new guys up to speed. So if this refresher brings it back to life great. What are we looking for as a final.

Tom and I chatted over the reviews, agreed on some changes. If we do a complete overhaul, we are back at stage one.

So we are raising the heel, maybe dropping the tip. Could some of you weigh in on this? Tom, if I missed anything, post it here, lets nail this down.