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View Full Version : How much do lower grit stones affect the finished knife edge?



slowtyper
04-15-2013, 12:31 PM
Say you finish with the same 5K stone. Does the 1K stone used make a difference? Lets say you use a 1K king, and a 1K Bester stone. No doubt you would get different edges with different qualities.

But then you take both edges to the same 5K stone. Aren't you left with a 5K edge specific to the 5K stone? Or what if you skipped the 1K stone, and just used the 5k stone (it would take a lot longer I assume to get to the same edge), would the edge be the same?

K-Fed
04-15-2013, 01:24 PM
Depends on how much you polish out the scratch pattern from the 1k. I usually try to leave a little of the scratches from each stone in the progression. I've found that you can take an edge to a relatively high polish and still retain a good bit of aggressiveness this way.

labor of love
04-15-2013, 01:52 PM
I dont think which stone you choose to use matters as much as what kind of edge you have after finishing on a 1k. The quality of the 5k finishied edge is atleast partially determined by the 1k finish. That's why I try and create a screaming sharp edge the best i can before i progress pass 1000-1200 stones.

memorael
04-15-2013, 02:04 PM
Quite a bit depending on how much time you spend on the 5k. If you use a stone that is really aggressive and continue to your 5k and polish out all the scratches you end up with a 5k edge with the qualities of that stone. If you polish just enough you end up with a hybrid 1k, 5k edge. There are some crazy cases in which the previous stone can cause micro chipping up to really bad chipping. If you take a dmt xxc and then do a progression up to 10k without removing all the scratches on the 1k sometimes you will get a real chippy edge depending on the metal. The reason is that the scratches are so deep, that you cause micro fissures on your knife, this could be a real problem if you thin out your knife with a dmt xxc.

zitangy
04-15-2013, 02:45 PM
Quite a bit depending on how much time you spend on the 5k. If you use a stone that is really aggressive and continue to your 5k and polish out all the scratches you end up with a 5k edge with the qualities of that stone. If you polish just enough you end up with a hybrid 1k, 5k edge. There are some crazy cases in which the previous stone can cause micro chipping up to really bad chipping. If you take a dmt xxc and then do a progression up to 10k without removing all the scratches on the 1k sometimes you will get a real chippy edge depending on the metal. The reason is that the scratches are so deep, that you cause micro fissures on your knife, this could be a real problem if you thin out your knife with a dmt xxc.

++1
and compound that with steels that has large carbides or not so fine grained.. you get a micro chip like a grain of sand just appears after all your polishing. Learnt this the hard way with Globals. Does'nt pay to uss rough grits at lower angles on this type of steel. IF need to abrade for a new profile, do it at higher angles.

After 1K grit, I prefer not to over polish. I may jump to 5k and 10k grit but each with little time on it. I prefer to leave " lines of defense of striations " as the smaller striations ( 10K) will be the first to go adn leaves the 5K and 1k grit striations for the bitey feeling...... That;s the theory anyway...

hv fun and stay sharp...
d

stevenStefano
04-15-2013, 02:56 PM
I think the main qualities people look for in 1k stones are how fast it cuts or how much it dishes, rather than what kind of an edge it gives so that is why some are recommended over others. I think there would be a bit of variation in terms of the edge the 1k stones give so in some ways you could go cheap, but you're gonna pay for that in how much the stone dishes and how slow it will cut

labor of love
04-15-2013, 04:21 PM
Ultimately you can achieve the same screaming edge off a 1k no matter which stone you use, that is if youre capable. I think of stone progressions as simply "enhancing" the edge i created around 1k-1200. This is what Murray Carter preaches sorta. That's why he uses kings right?

jaybett
04-15-2013, 06:01 PM
Say you finish with the same 5K stone. Does the 1K stone used make a difference? Lets say you use a 1K king, and a 1K Bester stone. No doubt you would get different edges with different qualities.

But then you take both edges to the same 5K stone. Aren't you left with a 5K edge specific to the 5K stone? Or what if you skipped the 1K stone, and just used the 5k stone (it would take a lot longer I assume to get to the same edge), would the edge be the same?


A few years ago, there was an interest on the forums to find the best combination of stones. Early on, it became apparent that if you stuck to a manufactures line up of stones, that the stones complimented each other nicely. The problem arose, that one makers 1000 grit stone, may not work so well with another makers 5000 grit stone. The only way to find out was through trial and error.

Unless a person is willing to buy a lot of stones, which KCMA, did for a year, the next best thing was getting the opinion of a professional sharpener. Dave made plenty of posts about his findings. Slowly that information led to consensus, on a good stone line up. Jon Broida used that set of stones, until he raised the bar with the Gesshin line.

Jay

El Pescador
04-15-2013, 06:24 PM
What type of edge are you looking for? a 5k edge or a 1k edge that been slightly polished?

slowtyper
04-15-2013, 06:35 PM
What type of edge are you looking for? a 5k edge or a 1k edge that been slightly polished?

How would you describe the differences between the two?

El Pescador
04-15-2013, 06:39 PM
I like a 1k edge that has been slightly refined on a 5k stone (a couple of light passes). a 5k edge means (to me) that you've polished out the 1k edge. The 1k edge is really toothy.