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View Full Version : Miyabi FC61 steel. Anyone know what this is?



bkdc
07-24-2013, 02:26 PM
Sur La Table is about to start selling the 'Evolution' line from Miyabi which uses a steel that Zwilling designates as FC61 with a hardness of HRC61. It is a fine grained stainless steel. Does anyone know what this is?

"Revolutionary FC61 Steel pairs Fine Carbide distribution with an astonishing 61 Rockwell hardness and has never before been used for kitchen cutlery—despite many attempts"

The geometry itself appears to have washed down from Morimoto's prior association with Miyabi, and it appears similar to the Morimoto series, which, in my opinion, is excellent geometry.

Timthebeaver
07-24-2013, 02:36 PM
Henckles/Miyabi like to use their own descriptors for steel. MC66 was confirmed as being Hitachi ZDP-189 for example.

I seriously doubt it's anything "revolutionary".

bkdc
07-24-2013, 02:38 PM
I'm going to guess that it ends up being a stainless Swedish steel. It looks like the knife will be a monosteel knife.

Timthebeaver
07-24-2013, 02:45 PM
I'm going with VG-10 or derivative thereof :biggrin:

Justin0505
07-24-2013, 03:40 PM
I'm going with VG-10 or derivative thereof :biggrin:

That would seem most likely.
The MC in MC66 stood for "microcarbide" didn't it? And the 66 was the target HRC.
Sooo, I wonder what FC stands for? But IIRC, most VG-10 Is targeted around HRC61

bkdc
07-24-2013, 03:45 PM
The only thing is that the Miyabi designation for VG-10 is CMV60. Which suggest that FC61 may be something other than VG-10. FC may stand for 'fine carbide' rather than 'micro carbide'? :)

Ruso
07-24-2013, 03:57 PM
AEB-L if I have to guess.

NO ChoP!
07-24-2013, 04:09 PM
FC = fine carbide...

edit. Someone beat to it....

Timthebeaver
07-24-2013, 07:21 PM
The MC in MC66 stood for "microcarbide" didn't it? And the 66 was the target HRC.
But IIRC, most VG-10 Is targeted around HRC61


Yes, yes and and yes. I think they will stick with Japanese steel (Even though there was a cheaper Miyabi made with the usual German stuff @58. 600 series?)

Timthebeaver
07-24-2013, 07:22 PM
The only thing is that the Miyabi designation for VG-10 is CMV60

Maybe it'll be VG-10W then. VG-12? :biggrin:

EdipisReks
07-25-2013, 12:41 AM
AEB-L if I have to guess.

That would be my guess, as well.

JBroida
07-25-2013, 12:52 AM
i would guess not that, as its not a steel commonly used in the area they produce knives in

EdipisReks
07-25-2013, 12:54 AM
i would guess not that, as its not a steel commonly used in the area they produce knives in

oh, so it's Q102.

JBroida
07-25-2013, 12:56 AM
honestly i'm not 100% sure what it is, but i know what steel types are commonly used in that area and what kinds of things are available to this kind of knife making process. I've got some suspicions, but no solid knowledge one way or another.

EdipisReks
07-25-2013, 12:57 AM
honestly i'm not 100% sure what it is, but i know what steel types are commonly used in that area and what kinds of things are available to this kind of knife making process. I've got some suspicions, but no solid knowledge one way or another.

Q102 is a crappy radio station in Cincinnati, so I doubt it's that. ;)

brainsausage
07-25-2013, 02:49 AM
Too many cultural curve balls.

Ruso
07-25-2013, 10:49 AM
honestly i'm not 100% sure what it is, but i know what steel types are commonly used in that area and what kinds of things are available to this kind of knife making process. I've got some suspicions, but no solid knowledge one way or another.

Taking in consideration that Henckels is multimillion or even billion corporation they pretty much can get any steel in any place of the world. One benefit of having tons of money. But said this, I do not know how things are run in Japan and may be there are some established rules or traditions that prevent this kind of things - then scratch my comment.

Mrmnms
07-25-2013, 10:51 AM
Kryptonite?

jared08
07-25-2013, 01:23 PM
"Fusionable carbon 61"

JBroida
07-25-2013, 04:00 PM
Taking in consideration that Henckels is multimillion or even billion corporation they pretty much can get any steel in any place of the world. One benefit of having tons of money. But said this, I do not know how things are run in Japan and may be there are some established rules or traditions that prevent this kind of things - then scratch my comment.
I'm aware of how big they are and also well aware of how things tend to work in that region. As I said before, it's an educated guess.

bkdc
07-25-2013, 04:06 PM
The official photos are available on the Sur La Table website, and the blade looks much wider than the original Miyabi Fusion or Morimoto profile. And although it describes 'sand blasted' appearance, it does look like a 3-layer kasumi construction with acid etching.

dmccurtis
07-25-2013, 04:35 PM
Is anyone else not seeing these on SLT's site?

bkdc
07-25-2013, 04:41 PM
http://www.surlatable.com/product/PRO-1251248/?affsrcid=Aff0001&mr:trackingCode&mr:referralID=NA&mr:adType=pla&mr:ad=30153266381&mr:keyword=&mr:match=&mr:filter=24156051701&origin=pla

The photos are no longer available. They are not yet for sale so it must be some website update.

Justin0505
07-25-2013, 05:26 PM
Photos working for me.
They actually dont look half bad. I like tall gyutos... Not my 1st choice of tips, but not terrible.

This made me lol a bit though:

Revolutionary FC61 Steel pairs Fine Carbide distribution with an astonishing 61 Rockwell hardness and has never before been used for kitchen cutlery—despite many attempts

...Hazaah!! at long last a fine carbide staibless steel @61RHC.
Pshhh, 'Henkel please... Where do you think we are? Germany?

EdipisReks
07-25-2013, 05:29 PM
The pics don't work for me, can you post them?

stereo.pete
07-25-2013, 10:03 PM
What's the average RC of your typical German Knife (Wustorf/Henckels)?

Benuser
07-25-2013, 10:11 PM
Traditionally, 54-56HRc. Recently, Wüsthof has gone up to 58, and has changed its geometry accordingly. All to be taken with a grain of salt, as always.

Justin0505
07-26-2013, 09:23 PM
The pics don't work for me, can you post them?

It's because SLT is using this stupid flash applet to display the pictures where you can't r-click and get a URL and the only way to zoom is to mouse over the image.
I had to go to the mobile site on my phone to get an actual image address.
See if this works for ya:

http://www.surlatable.com/images/customers/c1079/PRO-1251248/PRO-1251248_detail/main_variation_Default_view_4_426x426.jpg

Amon-Rukh
07-27-2013, 02:36 AM
Profile definitely seems to have more belly than the fusion/morimoto line. More similar to their artisan/kaizen line maybe?

Justin0505
07-27-2013, 07:05 PM
Profile definitely seems to have more belly than the fusion/morimoto line. More similar to their artisan/kaizen line maybe?

It's weird. Cover the last 1/3- 1/4 (from tip back) of blade on the 270 and it looks like the edge profile is actually pretty flat. There edge rises/ is at an upward angle relative to the spine, but there doesn't look to be only a very slight arch. Personally, I like this. The dramatic rise from about 2/3 - 3/4 for the heel is what gives it the impression of a big belly.

I'd actually be curious to try one. Being that I don't see Miyabi signing up as a vendor and doing a passaround anytime soon, I guess I'll end up visiting SLT and wasting some poor salesperson's time.

ajay
10-29-2014, 07:50 PM
I have been curious about this as well... I called Miyabi, but they wouldn't give out any more info.

What about: Sandvik 14C28N?

and... would it be possible to use an airplane steel for this? Because QuesTek makes: Ferrium® C61™ Alloy Steel which, at least in name, could easily be FC61.

LKH9
10-30-2014, 02:30 AM
So misleading and a gimmicky company. It works on ordinary people without any exposure to steel types. For knifenuts, nope.

keithsaltydog
10-30-2014, 06:17 AM
In one of the Executive Chef stores in an upscale Mall here were pushing these knives. They had a professional sharpener showing how to put an edge on them using the special Miyabi double sided stone.

I observed and listened to his information about sharpening to the general public. He made some good points that I agreed with. His technique (I'm little biased) not as efficient as what I teach at the culinary school. To me those knives have too much rise at the tip, even for rocking the knife.

Knifefan
10-30-2014, 12:28 PM
Used my contacts to Henckels. Usually they create their own steel names, so that they are not tied to using steel from one mill. FC61 seems to be either 13C26 or of the same chemical composition.

Lefty
10-30-2014, 01:23 PM
It's 13c26

AllanP
10-30-2014, 01:38 PM
is 13c26 basically the same as AEB-L with like a 0.01 percent difference in carbon content

Timthebeaver
10-30-2014, 04:08 PM
is 13c26 basically the same as AEB-L with like a 0.01 percent difference in carbon content

AEB-L is a proprietary steel made by Uddeholm. 13c26 is the same formulation, made by Sandvik.

cheflarge
10-30-2014, 05:28 PM
I have an eight inch gyuto that Greased Bullet did a kiritsuke tip/wa handle conversion on and I absolutely love it.

JBroida
10-30-2014, 06:41 PM
It is not 13c26... More like vg10

Lefty
10-30-2014, 07:31 PM
Are we talking the steel in the new Kramer line?

JBroida
10-30-2014, 07:54 PM
Are we talking the steel in the new Kramer line?

i could easily be wrong... posted from my cell without taking the time to get context... sorry

Lefty
10-30-2014, 08:31 PM
So could I, Jon. If you and I are at odds, my money is on you. Haha. The new Kramer line is 13c26. I know this for a fact. But, I could have sworn they had one with a similar name that is basically vg10, so I could be mistaken.

Knifefan
10-30-2014, 09:11 PM
The steel on the Miyabi Evolution and the new Kramer line is both called FC61, thus 13C26 or equivalent. For their older lines they use a steel called CMV60, quoting their website: "CMV60 stainless steel, containing cobalt, molybdenum and vanadium". So obviously this is VG10.

JBroida
10-30-2014, 09:41 PM
makes sense to me... i was thinking about the cmv60 anyways when i posted