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View Full Version : Hyper-decanting - Anyone try it?



DeepCSweede
08-22-2013, 05:33 PM
I just read an article in the Chicago Tribune about decanting wines in a blender to aerate evenly through the whole batch in just a few minutes. They stated that they did a blind taste test with wine industry professionals and sommeliers and they wholeheartedly preferred the hyper-aerated ones. Just wondering if anyone has tried it?

brainsausage
08-22-2013, 05:38 PM
I've been meaning to since I read about it in Modernist cuisine a couple years back, but always space it off.

JohnnyChance
08-22-2013, 05:40 PM
Never tried it, don't drink wine. But if I did, I would, just because it seems like it would be such a faux pas to wine snobs.

Originally from Nathan Myhrvold I believe:

http://pursuitist.com/nathan-myhrvold-hyperdecanting-wine-blender/

bikehunter
08-22-2013, 06:44 PM
Never tried it. Tho' the idea of putting a great wine in a bloody blender offends my sensibilities and sense of, probably dated, propriety. Makes perfect sense tho'.

mr drinky
08-22-2013, 06:50 PM
I haven't tried it, but I will the next chance I get. I guess the Mollydooker shake is basically the same thing, just a bit less extreme.

k.

Mucho Bocho
08-22-2013, 08:53 PM
Do it all the time in the Blendtec. Maybe hit it with a 10 second very high blast of the blender. It creates an effervescent mix in the wine for a few seconds. Definitely opens the wine and softens the tannins a bit. I think it it oxygenates the wine vs oxidizes the wine. None of my wine friends/snobs go for it though. They think I'm a nut blending my 2000 Haunt Bergey

brainsausage
08-22-2013, 09:30 PM
Another case of 'How it's done', as opposed to a different -and probably-better way of doing it. It's more 'refined' to put it in a crystal decanter and wait an hour, and then portion it into a Reidel glass shaped according to the varietal, then swirl and cup and inhale before every taste... I'm all for revering the time, effort, aging, subtlety, nuances, blah blah blah- but dammit- it's supposed to get you drunk!

Eric
08-22-2013, 10:12 PM
I use an aerator a lot, but the idea of putting a nice wine in a blender-- I think not.

EdipisReks
08-22-2013, 10:15 PM
I use an aerator a lot, but the idea of putting a nice wine in a blender-- I think not.

why not?

brainsausage
08-22-2013, 10:54 PM
Exactly.

Eric
08-22-2013, 11:10 PM
Tradition, Tradition!! Seriously I doubt that it actually oxygenates, and I don't care for overly oxidized wines. That's why red wines go bad after a day unless surrounded by inert gas. But please do whatever you want with yours.......

apicius9
08-22-2013, 11:31 PM
A friend of mine does that when he kills Aussie Shiraz in its infancy and I thought he had gone mad, but he swears by it. I never tried it myself. If I only knew in what storage box the blender was...

Stefan

brainsausage
08-22-2013, 11:47 PM
Obviously if you're going to use this method it involves ingesting the wine within hours of using said procedure. Excess oxidation kills wines overnight. Not within hours. If you're only cracking a bottle for a glass or two, the gas method of preservation is best in my opinion.

EdipisReks
08-22-2013, 11:55 PM
Seriously I doubt that it actually oxygenates

I'm guessing you don't have a strong science background...

brainsausage
08-23-2013, 12:01 AM
I'm guessing you don't have a strong science background...

Gonna have to side with Jacob on this one.

panda
08-23-2013, 12:41 AM
this is awesome, thanks for exposing me to this method!

Baby Huey
08-23-2013, 12:50 AM
I wonder how that process would work with some Wild Turkey 101?

ecchef
08-23-2013, 01:00 AM
I wonder how that process would work with some Wild Turkey 101?
Well, if we're going to throw tradition to the wind....bourbon enema anyone? I'll take mine on the rocks.

JohnnyChance
08-23-2013, 01:19 AM
I wonder how that process would work with some Wild Turkey 101?

Probably not Wild Turkey. But I was thinking about trying it with a wheated bourbon, which often benefit from some air. Maker's Mark, Larceny, Old Weller Antique, Weller 12 year old, Jefferson's Presidential Select, any of the Pappy Van Winkles, William Larue Weller, some of the Vintage and older Michter's releases, etc. Probably should try it with some OWA or W12 first though, just cost wise. A common practice for Weller 12 is to save the empty bottle of the one you just finished and when you get a new one, put half of it in the empty bottle. Then let them sit for weeks or months or whatever and let them oxidize or oxygenates or whatever it is that happens to them. Then consume.

Eric
08-23-2013, 01:32 AM
Whatever! Instead of needless rude childish comments, perhaps you could try simply being ok that someone has a different opinion.

FYI. I graduated with distinction from an Ivy League College and majored in molecular biology followed by a top medical school.

brainsausage
08-23-2013, 01:34 AM
Probably not Wild Turkey. But I was thinking about trying it with a wheated bourbon, which often benefit from some air. Maker's Mark, Larceny, Old Weller Antique, Weller 12 year old, Jefferson's Presidential Select, any of the Pappy Van Winkles, William Larue Weller, some of the Vintage and older Michter's releases, etc. Probably should try it with some OWA or W12 first though, just cost wise. A common practice for Weller 12 is to save the empty bottle of the one you just finished and when you get a new one, put half of it in the empty bottle. Then let them sit for weeks or months or whatever and let them oxidize or oxygenates or whatever it is that happens to them. Then consume.

Woah... First I've heard of oxygenating high spirits in this manner. Very intriguing...

JohnnyChance
08-23-2013, 01:54 AM
I have not heard of it either, but when I read this thread today I thought of wheated bourbons. Like I said, I will try it with something cheap like Makers, OWA or Larceny before moving on to the expensive stuff.

brainsausage
08-23-2013, 02:08 AM
I have not heard of it either, but when I read this thread today I thought of wheated bourbons. Like I said, I will try it with something cheap like Makers, OWA or Larceny before moving on to the expensive stuff.

It makes sense, I always throw a small splash in my single malts. Literally a splash. Brings forth the back notes, and tones down the fiery frontness, that tends to overwhelm the full palate experience.

apicius9
08-23-2013, 02:19 AM
So, should I bring my 1975 Arbeg with a splash of water to drinking temperature in a Vitamix? ;) Not that I have a Vitamix, and I might have to sell the Ardbeg to afford one...

Stefan

Eric
08-23-2013, 07:15 PM
Oxygen saturation in water will occur somewhere between 6 and 8 parts per million (this number depends upon temperature, salinity and elevation). This means that the water molecules have absorbed as much oxygen as they can easily hold under the present conditions. Any oxygen added beyond this point will be released back into the atmosphere with the least amount of disturbance in the water. Thus I doubt that putting wine in a blender adds more oxygen than a usual aerator. It will however, oxidize the wine and potentially heat it up. Unless there are specific molecules in the wine that have an affinity for oxygen, like hemoglobin in our blood, any oxygen added above the saturation point will just bubble up.

brainsausage
08-23-2013, 07:23 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the whole point is to oxidize the wine(after a certain point the oxidation starts to produce a negative result obviously), which is why a flat bottom decanter is typically seen as the preferred method for decanting. If you put said wine into a blender you're effectively folding the wine at high speeds and exposing a greater amount of the wine molecules to oxygen at an accelerated rate...?

EdipisReks
08-23-2013, 09:02 PM
Oxygen saturation in water will occur somewhere between 6 and 8 parts per million (this number depends upon temperature, salinity and elevation). This means that the water molecules have absorbed as much oxygen as they can easily hold under the present conditions. Any oxygen added beyond this point will be released back into the atmosphere with the least amount of disturbance in the water. Thus I doubt that putting wine in a blender adds more oxygen than a usual aerator. It will however, oxidize the wine and potentially heat it up. Unless there are specific molecules in the wine that have an affinity for oxygen, like hemoglobin in our blood, any oxygen added above the saturation point will just bubble up.

polyphenoloxidase. that is just one compound. fermentation products are very complex.

EdipisReks
08-23-2013, 09:02 PM
Whatever! Instead of needless rude childish comments, perhaps you could try simply being ok that someone has a different opinion.

FYI. I graduated with distinction from an Ivy League College and majored in molecular biology followed by a top medical school.

yet you don't understand mechanical aeration. oxygen absorption by the medium is simply one aspect of aerating wine. as oxygen slowly bubbles out of suspension, compounds are liberated from the fluid, which is probably why my double-blind wine aeration experiments have shown that the greatest difference is on the nose.

I used to work for Jerry Lingrel and Peter Stambrook, for what it's worth.

EdipisReks
08-23-2013, 09:08 PM
If you put said wine into a blender you're effectively folding the wine at high speeds and exposing a greater amount of the wine molecules to oxygen at an accelerated rate...?

of course, which is why you can make mayo in a blender quite quickly, once the initial emulsion is set.

Lucretia
08-23-2013, 09:12 PM
There comes a point in the life of every process where it becomes necessary to shoot the engineers and begin production.

Try it and drink whatever you like. Sheesh.

EdipisReks
08-23-2013, 09:16 PM
Try it and drink whatever you like. Sheesh.

with that attitude, the internet would be a very quiet place. :)

brainsausage
08-23-2013, 09:21 PM
with that attitude, the internet would be a very quiet place. :)

And a very awesome place.

mr drinky
08-23-2013, 09:33 PM
Just for another version of this type of decanting. Here is the Mollydooker Shake.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xTw6nOj80k

k.

apicius9
08-23-2013, 09:59 PM
Cool. I heard that Sparky was a nice guy, looks like he does have a sense of humor and a very down-to-earth attitide toward his wines. Maybe that's why I like them ;)

Stefan

mr drinky
08-23-2013, 11:58 PM
I tried it tonight -- or more accurately -- my wife tried it as I have a cold and no ability to smell really. We also did it blind, and she thought the blended wine (I'm calling it what it is) had a better aroma, but that the other wine tasted better so it was inconclusive.

When I tried the wines (without smell have you) one did have a larger mouth feel than the other and I felt the non-blended wine was also more pleasant, BUT that was because it had some serious graphite notes and was very tannic and blending it seemed to make it taste super tannic.

So without any scientific basis, method, or knowledge I would say that this hyper-decanting probably works with some wines and not others. I think it is definitely aerating it and releasing aroma more and that affects how you taste, but also if a wine is young and tannic, you might just be enhancing the tannic side of the wine and bringing that out. Kind of like that Mollydooker video where he says that the release of nitrogen enhances the flavor compounds -- but what if you don't care for the flavor?? If I were to take a less tannic wine or one that had smoothed out through aging, then maybe some different notes would have come out (with the blending), but I definitely would not do this hyper-decanting with a young tannic wine. Blending is not going to soften the tannins -- time does that. And it sort of makes sense. You can't take a exceptionally young tannic wine and decant away the tannins.

Also, I have a tough time believing that an over-processed wine would benefit from this. It has already been robbed of life through an industrial winemaking process, so I have difficulty seeing how adding another mechanical process such as blending it would help it out any. Blended baloney is still essentially baloney.

However, a well-balanced wine with some complexity that needs a couple of hours of decanting might be the best option for blending. I have just the wine for my next blending experiment.

So, until next time....

k.

Edit: I used a vitamix on number 4 for about 30-40 seconds.

chinacats
08-24-2013, 12:06 AM
I use an aerator that I received as a gift and I think it works great...can't say that I'd want to put it in a blender though.

Cheers

geezr
08-24-2013, 03:33 AM
Just for another version of this type of decanting. Here is the Mollydooker Shake.
k.

2009 Bordeaux reputed ok for early drinking so 1st pour was decanted in-glass for 1+ hours yesterday but still not ready.
Just did the Molly shake and poured a 2nd glass tonight and the wine is way better - no "decanting' but day older in-bottle.:thumbsup:
Wonder what day 3 will be - maybe 1/2 straight from the bottle and with what remains another Molly shake :dontknow:

geezr
08-25-2013, 12:38 AM
So day 3 with 2009 Chateau Boutisse - straight from bottle - no;
Molly shake with what remains in the bottle - no. :(