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welshstar
09-11-2011, 12:18 PM
Hi

I just recieved my new Konosuke HD 270 gyuto from Mark and i am absolutely delighted with it. I debated the gesshin ginga, tad and several others and decided on this knife.

Anyways, i have now sold a few high street knives so im looking for a new ultility/small gyuto to match the Kono, i would like something that is 165/180, nice and thin, yo handled, supersharp, but the profile i would like is a gyuto profile, petty would be too narrow and santoku would be too high.

What would the suggestions be please ?

Alan

kalaeb
09-11-2011, 12:52 PM
In many/most situations a "small gyuto" and a petty are the same thing. Finding that with a Yo handle makes it difficult in this size. I am having a hard time thinking except for the Henckels Kramer or a Miyabi. Have you thought about a nakiri?

The Edge
09-11-2011, 01:06 PM
I know the handles aren't that attractive, but i would personally go with the Carter Funayuki with the riveted handle. I know there are other options out there with better handles, but with the profile you speak of, I'm not sure much out there can beat it. He's got a few for sale on his site that are around 5.0 to 5.3 sun in length. But I'm sure there are more experienced members that can chime in here as well...

welshstar
09-11-2011, 01:06 PM
I have thought about a nakiri but they seem to unwieldy to me, they seem to be like a bigger Santoku. My lack of knowledge might be insulting so forgive me.

BTW what is the difference between a nakiri and a usaba ? they look so similar

oivind_dahle
09-11-2011, 01:10 PM
Carter funyaki :)

welshstar
09-11-2011, 01:18 PM
I assume you mean something like this ?

http://www.cartercutlery.com/japanese-knives/new-products/52-sun-stainless-fukugozai-funayuki-riveted-handle-0

What are the main differences bewteen the blue steel and white in practice ? does teh blue steel justify the extra $30 ?

kalaeb
09-11-2011, 01:22 PM
Respectful of the Carter lovers out there, IMO I find them over-hyped. Not a bad knife...just way over exaggerated on their performance.

The Edge
09-11-2011, 01:24 PM
IMHO it doesn't, but then again, I do most of my cooking at home now. The blue steel should be able to hold its edge a bit longer than the white, but most would say that white steel takes on a sharper edge. Again, there are more than a few here that I'm sure will chime in. What's interesting to me, and probably has no bearing on this discussion, but Carter says that his favorite steel to work with is white #1 (which I've also seen stated by other makers as well). Should account for something...

echerub
09-11-2011, 01:27 PM
A nakiri doesn't feel like a santoku because the edge is almost flat while a santoku still has a bit of curvature for a bit of rock-cutting.

While a nakiri is conceptually a "double-bevel usuba", it handles and feels completely differently. Personally I think nakiri are great for small jobs with veggies - things that I really don't think any of my petties aren't well suited for. The nakiri is great for chopping veggies, herbs and the like, but I don't find it as multipurpose as a petty. Having said that, I wouldn't want to use a petty for going through a small pile of veggies.

oivind_dahle
09-11-2011, 01:37 PM
Well either you love Carter or you hate Carter - I love my Carter. But Im more of a wa man than a ho man when it comes to carter. His handles are not really that impressive, so I rehandled mine :)

IMO his funyakis are top preformers. Its a amazing cutter, and Im waiting for my second Funyaki now :) I also love cladded knives, best of both world ;)

:D

SpikeC
09-11-2011, 01:38 PM
Kalaeb,
Just out of curiosity, what is your experience with the Carters?

kalaeb
09-11-2011, 01:54 PM
I have a 7.9 sun Funyaki HG with white steel. The profile is awesome. I don't know what the RC is. The knife looses its edge incredible fast. I have put on less steep angles tried microbeveling and it still does not hold up against even light use. That is the biggest gripe, and the biggest dissapointment.

Fit and finish, well it...its a Carter...I thought by buying the high grade it would make a difference as it claims to be hand finished on whetstones to a mirror polish. It is clearly finished with a belt sander or a very low grit stone as there are still very obvious vertical (perpendicular to the edge) deep scratches. Even the makes mark is half ground off, there is a definate lack of attention to detail, even in stepping up to the HG.

This knife sits next to my Fuji at work and when I need to get to work I grab the Fuj because I know I will be able to get through the prep list without switching knives.

As stated before, the knife is not horrible...but IMO over exaggerated.

Just out of curiousity, are there any pros who use a Carter on a regular basis?

unkajonet
09-11-2011, 01:56 PM
+1 on Carter. I didn't believe the hype until I bought one (funayuki in White #1). Outstanding cutter that gets a really sharp edge.

Lefty
09-11-2011, 02:17 PM
Kalaeb, I can think of a few people who would likely love to buy your Carter, if you don't like it.
No knife works for everybody, so it's definitely fair to say it's not a good knife for you. I know you know a quality knife when you see one, so it's obviously just a matter of personal taste.
Out of curiosity, which gyuto is your favourite?

kalaeb
09-11-2011, 03:11 PM
Am I really the only Carter dissenter? No worries, to each their own. :2cents:


Out of curiosity, which gyuto is your favourite?
Currently, the DT ITK, I know it seems like a stock answer, but the knife really does rock!. I keep on taking it out of rotation to give the others a chance, but it always ends up back in. That is for now...there may be some others comming in soon. :D

mhlee
09-11-2011, 03:26 PM
But Im more of a wa man than a ho man when it comes to carter.

Aren't you a female and a lesbian?

tk59
09-11-2011, 03:45 PM
I haven't tried to test my Carters' edge retention but I can certainly tell the edge retention is better than a lot of other knives I've tried. When I tout their performance, I am referring to the ease of cutting. I recently acquired a small Carter. At this point, it hasn't gotten much use but it cuts well. I just use 210 mm+ sizes a lot more.

Lefty
09-11-2011, 03:47 PM
Am I really the only Carter dissenter? No worries, to each their own. :2cents:


Currently, the DT ITK, I know it seems like a stock answer, but the knife really does rock!. I keep on taking it out of rotation to give the others a chance, but it always ends up back in. That is for now...there may be some others comming in soon. :D

I wouldn't say it's a stock answer. I'd call it honest. I've heard almost nothing but great things about the DT ITK, especially for pros. I haven't tried one yet, but one is on the way to my house (or will be soon) to give a whirl. I'm interested to see why they are so highly regarded. I'm sure it's warranted, but I want to see for myself.
The funny thing about me being a Carter fan is before I tried one, I 100% disagreed with everything about them. Then I tried one and it works perfectly FOR ME.
It's funny how we all offer our opinions and insight, chasing after the same thing, yet all anyone really agrees on is that we all have different ideas of what poor, acceptable, and exceptional are.

kalaeb
09-11-2011, 03:51 PM
Welshstar, how about something like this for a gyuto/petty.

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1564&d=1314902218

SpikeC
09-11-2011, 03:58 PM
I wonder if you just got a lemon? Doesn't Carter eyeball the HT? If he does that would allow for some variation in results. Considering how many seem to have different results I have to wonder if something is amiss with your particular knife.

Lefty
09-11-2011, 04:01 PM
I'd write him and tell him you aren't pleased. Last time someone did, well, we all remember the awesome outcome.

wenus2
09-11-2011, 04:47 PM
To bring this thread back on topic......

Hiromoto G3 180m gyuto might fit what you are asking for, at a reasonable sum.
http://japanesechefsknife.com/Page4.html

I don't have a G3 myself, I would like to though. People who own them seems to like them, can't recall ever reading any negative press.

Timthebeaver
09-11-2011, 07:39 PM
Respectful of the Carter lovers out there, IMO I find them over-hyped. Not a bad knife...just way over exaggerated on their performance.

Carter seems to have come back into "vogue" as of late.

welshstar
09-11-2011, 11:49 PM
Hi

What about thiese guys, they seem to look the part

http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives/1963.html

http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives/western-style/1146.html

The second one particularly looks good

Thanks

alan

James
09-12-2011, 02:34 AM
I don't have a G3 myself, I would like to though. People who own them seems to like them, can't recall ever reading any negative press.

+1 on the g3; I have one and it's absolutely wonderful

Rottman
09-12-2011, 09:46 AM
How about a Hiromoto AS 180 (http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/TenmiJyurakuSeries.html) gyuto? It's 42 mm at the heel.

welshstar
09-12-2011, 02:07 PM
Thanks

I think im going to go with this one unless there is any major issue im not thinking of

Minamoto Kotetsu Gyuto 185mm http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives/...tyle/1146.html

Thanks

Alan

oivind_dahle
09-12-2011, 02:08 PM
I still would have gone for a Carter.....

karloevaristo
09-15-2011, 02:01 PM
My carter SGFZ 5.0 sun blue lasts for weeks in a pro kitchen without sharpening... it's super sharp at first then it kinda stays at 80% for a looong long time, which is still very sharp... I had a DT ITK, and still have a Hiromoto AS, Takeda... and I kinda don't use them anymore because of the carter... just my 0.02... and I just bought a 6.2 HG carter.... can't wait!!!

I use to think it was a hype, but not anymore... the carbon edge is not reactive at all after it takes on a patina, which is kind of a big deal for me... and I don't need to baby it... :)

mhenry
09-16-2011, 04:02 PM
190 bucks stays sharp forever, Watanabe 180mm pro

Timthebeaver
09-16-2011, 05:48 PM
Thanks

I think im going to go with this one unless there is any major issue im not thinking of

Minamoto Kotetsu Gyuto 185mm http://japan-blades.com/chef-knives/...tyle/1146.html

Thanks

Alan

That's a good choice, a well regarded knife with good steel. A bargain, you might say.

Cadillac J
09-16-2011, 07:50 PM
Anyone have experience with Teruyasu Fujiwara's smaller gyutos? The Nashiji series is relatively affordable for a handmade, white#1 knife, so I wonder how it compares to a Carter.

http://www.japanwoodworker.com/dept.asp?s=JapanWoodworker&dept_id=13175

Lefty
09-16-2011, 09:47 PM
Weird. My reply got lost somewhere. Oh well...
What I was trying to get out is that I really like the profile on the Gyutos. Caddy, you always find blades that suit my eye.
I'd like to learn more about these too.

Seb
09-16-2011, 10:02 PM
I always thought that Tanaka's Nashiji-Ginsanko series and Damascus-cladded Blue#2 series were fun and affordable high-performance options. But they seem to have undergone a price hike thanks to the USD/YEN exchange rate. Ditto the Honsho-Kanemasa E-series.