PDA

View Full Version : First J-Knife, Thanks Jon!



ColinCB
11-19-2011, 11:10 PM
Came home from Australia today to find a Boardsmith board (Carolina Maple Slab), a 240mm Gesshin Ginga wa-gyuto, and the 2k Gesshin stone.

First off, let me say, holy bleep that knife is sharp.

Also, pics tomorrow as my camera is out of juice!

The knife is super light, thin, and is very nice. The board is rock solid and awesome.


So tonight, using an old Global G2 I used to use, I practiced sharpening. Here's my thoughts so far...

Sharpening is not easy! I soaked the stone for a bit, flattened it, and get it prepped. Started sharpening, and after watching Jon's videos a trillion times, I'm a bit confused. Material is not coming off as fast as I thought. Maybe not enough pressure? It seems like Jon isn't pressing hard, but I am. Secondly, angle stability. I seem to wobble a bit. And with the whole , push with the 2/3 fingers and pressure part, I can't seem to push/pull without using my angle hand. Finally, my edge at the heel is definitely way sharper than anything after the curve starts.

Guess I need to practice a lot more!

JBroida
11-19-2011, 11:16 PM
more pressure is not the answer... but with angle consistency will come faster grinding. Also, the right hand only used for the angle thing is more of a mental exercise... you should be doing 90% of the push and pull with your left hand, but of course your right hand will do some work... the idea is that in your mind it is not. This helps a lot with angle consistency.

Globals can be a bit tough as a beginner sharpening knife... they are pronounced convex edges and so, in some degree, you are flattening a bevel, and that conversion takes a bit of time.

Anyways, you know where to find me if you have sharpening questions and i'm sure plenty of people on here will also be helpful.

Thanks again.

-Jon

ColinCB
11-20-2011, 12:06 AM
I know it's a feel thing, but in general, how much pressure is enough pressure?

As for the edge, I'm pretty sure years and years of abuse have eroded the convex edge into something weird.

Assuming I do it right, and spend enough time on it, can I get the global to match the sharpness of the Ginga with only a 2k?

Finally, the fit and finish on both the knife and packaging are phenomenal. And the hand written note is truly a mark of the quality of your business.

JBroida
11-20-2011, 12:13 AM
Quoting myself from a previous post:
it turns out that for light pressure, i use between 20-80g worth of pressure
for medium pressure, i use between 200-350g worth of pressure
for hard pressure, i use between 800-3000g worth of pressure

Grab a kitchen scale and see for yourself

As far as "sharpness", there are quite a few factors that go into it. Global is a thicker knife than the gesshin ginga, so it will never move through food in quite the same way (unless you thin the global a lot). With regard to actual edge sharpness, you should be able to get pretty close on a 2k finish.

Hope that helps.

ecchef
11-20-2011, 12:20 AM
Could it be the stone? Some seem to need a 'break in ' period before they really start to work as intended...not sure if this is true with Gesshin.

Eamon Burke
11-20-2011, 01:09 AM
Yeah, the global is not a great learner knife. I think you'll have more luck matching the bevel angle on your gyuto when it gets dull. And(at least at first) you only need just enough pressure to keep the knife in constant contact with the stone. The abrasives in stones are very hard and cut very well(we can split hairs about this later).

tk59
11-20-2011, 01:12 AM
Sounds to me like one of two things:
1. The expectations are unreasonable. A fast 2k stone is never going to be a great stone for doing major stock removal (thinning, etc.)
2. The angle is not correct and the wrong part of the blade is being ground.
It is unlikely that you are using too much pressure. More pressure may not help you grind off more metal or from the right places but I've never seen a stone stop abrading because of excessive pressure.

memorael
11-21-2011, 12:52 AM
as long as you don't deform the blade while sharpening I don't think there is TOO MUCH pressure. On the other hand you don't really get much more steel abrasion by applying much more pressure, so I always go with do what works for you as long as the blade isn't deformed. Usually when I teach people how to sharpen the one mistake I constantly see on everyone is applying pressure with the hand holding the handle and this is a HUGE! no no.

If you need to abrade more steel faster I always suggest getting a rougher stone, I have never seen a stone stop cutting, but I have seen some stop cutting as fast as they are capable due to glazing, the prime example for me is the shapton glasstone 220. That stone is good for tossing at people who don't listen and thats it.

ColinCB
11-21-2011, 10:31 AM
After practicing a bit more, I've gotten the knife relatively sharp. I still need to work on the curve-tip part, but the flatter edge of the knife is pretty sharp.

On a side note Jon, the Global is actually nearly as thin, or thinner than the Ginga. I'll grab a picture later today.

JBroida
11-21-2011, 10:36 AM
what kind of knife is the global (and what size)?

Benuser
11-21-2011, 11:11 AM
G2 is a 210mm gyuto. I use a Chosera 800 as one and only stone with my Globals after some serious thinning.

Cadillac J
11-21-2011, 07:40 PM
the Global is actually nearly as thin, or thinner than the Ginga. I'll grab a picture later today.

Globals are thin knives overall--I still have a G2 that my gf uses--but they aren't thin behind the edge like most Japanese knives we discuss regularly.

The steel is tough, so I'll most likely always keep mine as a beater.

memorael
11-21-2011, 07:57 PM
I used to own a Global, the chinese pattern chef knife (looks kinda like a kiritsuke) and that thing got pretty sharp, took a nice polish too and the only problem I had was deburring a bit, the metal is kinda gummy but it kept the edge well and was tough. The metal would bend rather than shatter, I know cause some retard banged it against a shin bone once.

ColinCB
12-29-2011, 05:30 AM
Okokokok, so I disappeared for a bit, but now I'm back!

I've managed to get the global to a pretty sharp level, except a part of the curve, which I'm working on. One thing I noticed was that I was grinding at a higher degree than I thought instead of the very low angle necessary.


I'm much more stable as well with my angle control, but obviously not perfect.


Finally, the Ginga has been great. Still pretty sharp as I haven't used it nearly as much as I'd like.

One question about sharpening the Ginga. I can't seem to find the right angle for it. It's so thin and the finish so homogenous that I can't seem to find the right level. Any tips on sharpening it?

JBroida
12-29-2011, 05:45 AM
pick an angle and try it (just stay consistent).. if the edge holds up and you want it to feel "sharper", go more acute. If the edge doesnt hold up, go less acute. If it works out perfectly, stick with that angle ;)

TB_London
12-29-2011, 06:05 AM
Have you tried putting black marker pen on the bevel you're trying to match? It will really help you see which parts of the bevel you are hitting so you can adjust the angle to match.

ColinCB
12-29-2011, 06:56 AM
pick an angle and try it (just stay consistent).. if the edge holds up and you want it to feel "sharper", go more acute. If the edge doesnt hold up, go less acute. If it works out perfectly, stick with that angle ;)

Ah, ok. I figured this was the answer.

On a side note, Jon, isn't it real late over there, around 4am (when you posted)?


Have you tried putting black marker pen on the bevel you're trying to match? It will really help you see which parts of the bevel you are hitting so you can adjust the angle to match.

Haven't tried this yet. It seems to be a very small bevel so I'll try!

JBroida
12-29-2011, 07:00 AM
yup... 4am... trying to catch up on work before i go out of town