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Dave Martell
11-30-2011, 11:13 AM
So going back more than a few years ago Ryan asked me if I'd ever etched damascus with copper and I of course said no. He then said that we'd have to try it sometime and I said sure but never did. He mentioned it every so often again and again over the years but I never had a damascus knife that I could try this on so I never did it. Finally he sent me one of his Carter neckers to "go for it". Here's the results....


http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2730&d=1322669578

Dave Martell
11-30-2011, 11:14 AM
So who wants to send in a full size kitchen knife to try this on? :D

kalaeb
11-30-2011, 11:19 AM
Holy crap that is cool. I have a large copper san mai funny with copper accents in the handle that you are welcome to try but no damascus pieces.

Dave Martell
11-30-2011, 11:25 AM
Holy crap that is cool. I have a large copper san mai funny with copper accents in the handle that you are welcome to try but no damascus pieces.

I'm not sure how/if it'll work on that knife. I tried it on a Hiro AS and it did nothing besides temporarily turning the cladding red.

chazmtb
11-30-2011, 12:41 PM
That's awsome!

Just a question though, would it be food safe to have a copper etched knife? It would probably be, because people cook and distill things in copper all the time.

tk59
11-30-2011, 12:43 PM
Cool. Definitely a unique look.

Dave Martell
11-30-2011, 12:51 PM
That's awsome!

Just a question though, would it be food safe to have a copper etched knife? It would probably be, because people cook and distill things in copper all the time.


I had the same question and all I can come up with is that it should be.....but what do I know about that? :)

WillC
11-30-2011, 01:04 PM
Looks really cool! I've done it by accident before from all the accumulated acid in the etchant from using copper coated welding wire to dandle stuff in. Will be interesting to see what happens with patina, copper is said to accelerate the corrosion steel, though i'm sure moisture would have to be present on a long term basis for it to cause a problem. I would think treated as a normal carbon blade it could be less reactive, other than a darkening of the copper. Ammonia and salts and things like that tend to cause the blue/green patina on copper.

bcrano
11-30-2011, 01:58 PM
I'm really interested, Dave. Just have to quickly sort out which knife.

bcrano
11-30-2011, 02:23 PM
Would it work on a Mr. Itou R2 damascus? If so I'm way in!

Eamon Burke
11-30-2011, 02:28 PM
Would it work on a Mr. Itou R2 damascus? If so I'm way in!

whoa. We need pics of that

bcrano
11-30-2011, 02:43 PM
Subtle it would not be. But maybe subtle is over rated? :doublethumbsup:

Eamon Burke
11-30-2011, 02:50 PM
Subtle it would not be. But maybe subtle is over rated? :doublethumbsup:

Mr. Itou is not for subtlety.

Dave Martell
11-30-2011, 03:42 PM
Would it work on a Mr. Itou R2 damascus? If so I'm way in!


There's only one way to find out. :)

bcrano
11-30-2011, 04:00 PM
You game to try it?

Dave Martell
11-30-2011, 04:10 PM
You game to try it?


Sure, it's your knife at risk, LOL :D

bcrano
11-30-2011, 07:56 PM
So Dave the knife is on it's way! Its going to be a Mr.Itou Gyuto 180mm "Abalone Handle" for copperization!!!

http://japanesechefsknife.com/Gyuto180mmAbalone2.jpg

Prepare to ooooooh and ahhhhhhh

Dave Martell
11-30-2011, 08:07 PM
So Dave the knife is on it's way! Its going to be a Mr.Itou Gyuto 180mm "Abalone Handle" for copperization!!!

http://japanesechefsknife.com/Gyuto180mmAbalone2.jpg

Prepare to ooooooh and ahhhhhhh


Now that's gonna be one loud knife! :D

bcrano
11-30-2011, 08:09 PM
You think? I got Pierre working on something classy, so why not throw a little confetti on this one? My small collection needs a spotlight hog.

kalaeb
11-30-2011, 08:10 PM
Just out of curiosity, what steels does Murray do his damascus out of, and which steel took on the copper properties?

Dave Martell
11-30-2011, 09:33 PM
Just out of curiosity, what steels does Murray do his damascus out of, and which steel took on the copper properties?

I don't know what Murray uses in his mix.

It looks like the copper got snagged by the core steel for sure as well as something in the damascus mix too.

PierreRodrigue
11-30-2011, 10:44 PM
There is a smith up here on the west coast, that actually blends pure copper in his damascus, gives a ribbon effect. More ornamental than practical! But looks cool!

Delbert Ealy
12-01-2011, 12:11 AM
There is a smith up here on the west coast, that actually blends pure copper in his damascus, gives a ribbon effect. More ornamental than practical! But looks cool!

I did this once kinda by accident, I was using monel 400 which has a significant amout of copper, the copper migrated into the steel, and it made the steel "funky" Don't ask me to be more clear on this, it just felt wrong. I think, but cannot prove that the copper migrated into the boundries of the crystal structure of the steel. I do know that it broke easier than my regular damascus, and it did feel funky when grinding it.

As far as the copper colored etch, this has happened to me many times, and is usually followed by the sort of reation that follows hitting ones thumb with a hammer. The copper adheres to both types of steel in the damascus and is usually a very thin layer which is not stable. if the knife sees any sort of use the copper coloring will be gone in very short order. Copper is much more reactive than steel.
Del

Chef Niloc
12-01-2011, 06:37 AM
I don't get it? Is there copper in the Damascus, or are you adding the copper somehow your self? I.E. how did you do this?

mainaman
12-01-2011, 07:36 AM
I always thought those are made by mixing copper and iron, I have seen many on japanese sites.

sudsy9977
12-01-2011, 09:00 AM
Wow looks awesome Dave.....cant wait to see if it actually stays with use....Ryan

99Limited
12-01-2011, 09:33 AM
Bang my head against a wall, but I don't get it. That copper etched blade looks like someone dipped the blade in a bottle of Pepto-Bismol. That knife would make a great gift for a Mary Kay associate.

mr drinky
12-01-2011, 09:41 AM
I'm with 99 on this one. Not only do I not understand etching enough to be slightly confused by this thread, but the look also doesn't do it for me. I also have a type of color blindness, so maybe that is it. Anyhow, good luck with the experiment, and I am interested to see how it comes out.

k.

Dave Martell
12-01-2011, 10:56 AM
The process is to add copper to etchant and soak until desired results are obtained then finish blade to the appropriate level. The copper is in the surface of the steel enough that it'll stay put but how it wears is anyone's guess. Normally when this is done it's not on purpose, it's an accident that occurs when etchant gets tainted. Some people do use it for effect on damascus bolsters or endcaps, etc. Normally you don't get the strong coloring effect that this blade took on as it's usually streaks of copper seen only. The copper will patina quickly and turn dark. It's not a look for everyone. :)

bcrano
12-01-2011, 11:16 AM
Any ideas on maintence Dave?

Dave Martell
12-01-2011, 11:21 AM
Any ideas on maintence Dave?

I hate to say this but I have no idea.

add
12-01-2011, 03:07 PM
Kinda gives it a circuit board effect.

Perhaps this would also look good on a Hattori damascus clad, with the black handles as contrast ?

sudsy9977
12-04-2011, 06:40 AM
Got the knife late last night....looks awesome.....it looks a lot different in person....the pics don't look as good as the knife in your hand.....as far as ho it'll look after use that will tell in time.....the handle looks awesome as well....Dave must have buffed it...man does it shine!....murray really needs to start buffing his handles....Ryan

Dave Martell
12-04-2011, 05:34 PM
Got the knife late last night....looks awesome.....it looks a lot different in person....the pics don't look as good as the knife in your hand.....as far as ho it'll look after use that will tell in time.....the handle looks awesome as well....Dave must have buffed it...man does it shine!....murray really needs to start buffing his handles....Ryan

Glad you got it Ryan. You'll have to give me an update on how it wears over time.

ThEoRy
05-15-2012, 09:36 PM
So Dave the knife is on it's way! Its going to be a Mr.Itou Gyuto 180mm "Abalone Handle" for copperization!!!

http://japanesechefsknife.com/Gyuto180mmAbalone2.jpg

Prepare to ooooooh and ahhhhhhh

Whatever happened here... Pics?

Dave Martell
05-15-2012, 10:34 PM
Whatever happened here... Pics?


The Itou didn't take to the copper - it was a big let down.

ThEoRy
05-15-2012, 10:38 PM
That's a bummer. :(

ecchef
05-16-2012, 05:30 AM
Wanna try a Moritaka Dave?
Don't worry...you won't have to sharpen it. :eyebrow:

Dave Martell
05-16-2012, 11:26 AM
Wanna try a Moritaka Dave?
Don't worry...you won't have to sharpen it. :eyebrow:


You have a damascus versions Dave? I'd give it a go.....as long as I don't have to sharpen it...LOL :D

ecchef
05-23-2012, 05:00 AM
Sure...what the hell. I'll send you a surprise box! :spiteful:

You'll recognize it; you did the rehandle. It's the most reactive thing I've ever seen. Never patinas, just rusts. Hoping coppering will alleviate that a bit.

I'll throw in some of the other stuff we discussed as well for your consideration. That oughtta make your elbow hurt even worse! :tease:

Dave Martell
05-23-2012, 09:21 AM
Sure...what the hell. I'll send you a surprise box! :spiteful:

You'll recognize it; you did the rehandle. It's the most reactive thing I've ever seen. Never patinas, just rusts. Hoping coppering will alleviate that a bit.

I'll throw in some of the other stuff we discussed as well for your consideration. That oughtta make your elbow hurt even worse! :tease:


Cool - thanks Dave :)

more4dan
01-21-2014, 05:03 PM
The Itou didn't take to the copper - it was a big let down.

There is another option for adding copper, electro plating with low voltage and copper sulfate solution. Then carefully polish the copper off the high points of the pattern. Just dipping carbon steel into the copper sulfate solution will plate copper, but stainless steels and those with high nickel content won't plate without electrical current. Copper disolved in acid etchant acts much like copper sulfate solution but the copper sulfate won't further etch your blade or damage the handle materials.

Copper is also anti-microbial.

Notaskinnychef
01-25-2014, 01:07 AM
love to see some other pictures of those knives that took the copper. Any pics anywhere?