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HHH Knives
12-27-2011, 07:09 PM
Im gona do a mini WIP on this one. Its my take on a Nakiri. :D

Randy Jr forged me this kick butt billet of Spirograph damascus a few months back. and I have been trying to figure out what pattern blade to make that would really show off the pattern of the damascus, A few guys on the board made some suggestions and after doing some research, I settled on a Nakiri.

This will have a western/Wa handle Ala Delbert Ealy (I asked him if I could try his method and he graciously said I could) Hope I do it justice.

The specs so far.

OAL 358mm or 14 1/8 inches.
BLADE 210mm or 8 3/8 inches
Thickness 2.5mm ish Thinking I may surface grind this down to about 2mm Open to suggestions.
Heel height 56mm or 2 3/16 inches. tapering slightly to50mm one inch behind the front of the blade.
Handle will be 130mm ish long with the front at 24mm and the back tapering to 28mm

This is my first attempt at this pattern blade and I gota say, It went against every fiber in my being to not have a tip or a point on this.. lol Yet after looking at hundreds of pictures and reading everything I can find about the knife. I had to give it a try!

So far I have the Blade Heat treated and rough profiled. I may still make some minor changes to the profile to make the knife better, and am open to suggestions. Currently it feels good on the board, with a very gentle roll from the front to the heel.

I have a few questions??

For the main bevels, I was thinking flat grinds. Taking them a little over half the height of the blade. But may take the grinds all the way to the spine. :cool2: Should the grind and cutting edge continue up the flat at the tip/front of the blade?

Would 2mm thickness be preferable? or should I leave it at 2.55mm?

Any and all other suggestions of changes or modifications that will make this a better cutter are welcomed! :wink:


Im gona wait a couple days to see what you guys think and if any changes are in order B4 I move forward on this project..

Thanks for looking. and stay tuned. Ill be adding WIP pics and info.

Stay Sharp
Randy, HHH knives

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3320&d=1325030517

TB_London
12-27-2011, 07:36 PM
Looking funky :D
I'd put in some distal taper keeping it around 2.5 at the handle down to 1mm towards the tip. On my nakiri the bevels go just under halfway up the blade face and I like the way it cuts, haven't tried a fully ground one though so I may like that more.......
The edge doesn't extend up the flat front of the knife, when I've seen this it's on meat cleavers/butchery knives.
Hopefully someone with a carter or a shige nakiri will chime in, they seem to be the best regarded

echerub
12-27-2011, 08:07 PM
Totally funky! :D

2.5 at the heel is perfectly good. The front doesn't need an edge. As for the bevel height .... I might be thinking the wrong thing or getting my terminologies mixed up, but I think you'll probably end up with something that feels better in the hand if you have a spine to edge taper going the whole way with the actual "cutting bevel" (that could well be a flat bevel) starting at 5mm out from the edge itself. I hope I'm not making things worse with my kludgy description :)

If you're thinking about going flat faced for the top half, with a "shinogi" kind of separation between top and bottom half... that'd be pretty different from what I've used. Might work a-ok in terms of cutting, but I wonder if the extra mass would do something odd with the feel and handling.

bcrano
12-27-2011, 08:19 PM
Whoa Randy that looks awesome. What a piece of steel. I like the shape and geometry also. Really nice... Color me unsurprised!

HHH Knives
12-27-2011, 10:27 PM
Thanks guys! Funky sounds about right!!! :D

OK so basically spine thickness of 2.5mm at the heel tapering down to 1sh near the front .. Got it.. :)

Len, I think you saying full grinds. Thats what It seems like your describing? In most of the photos I have seen, The grind or main bevels are about half height. Yet I think most of the pics were showing single bevel knives. So the half height grind makes sense..

echerub
12-27-2011, 10:50 PM
I think I'm describing a full grind :) Gradual taper from spine to edge, but still with a slightly more obtuse final bevel nearer to the edge. Gotta love the imprecision of laymen trying to communicate :D

A nakiri is definitely a double-bevel knife, though. A single bevel would mean a usuba, a very different beast in terms of geometry and behaviour. Nakiri are great knives to use anyhow, in my opinion :)

HHH Knives
12-27-2011, 10:57 PM
Got it, Your description is right on, Just making sure. IMO having a full grind will make for a better cutting tool with less drag.. :) Thanks Len for your input.

Its a KNIFE LIFE!
Randy

JohnnyChance
12-28-2011, 03:59 AM
You don't need a cutting edge on the front edge.

2.5mm at the spine above the heel is fine, just have plenty of distal taper towards the tip and thinner towards the cutting edge. It can even taper drastically at the spine in the first inch or so from 2.5mm to 2mm or less. Convex/blended bevels the entire blade face from spine to edge. The single bevel knives you saw with a tall bevel on the right hand side of the knife is for a usuba. Similar overall shape, but very different in grind and use. You basically want to grind this the same as you would a gyuto/chefs knife.

Profile looks good and choil looks comfy!

HHH Knives
12-28-2011, 04:43 PM
Thanks for the input guys. If theres no other info you guys feel will be important, I can move to the next step on this one! :)

echerub
12-28-2011, 04:55 PM
Randy, I just checked 3 of my nakiri to check on their geometries.

1 is basically flat ground from spine towards the edge, then pretty abruptly about 1cm from the edge changes to the actual cutting bevel. It's not a smooth transition at all on this one. It doesn't sound great, but this is actually the one I use most often, so it still works well.

The other 2 are similar to each other in that they are very gradually full-ground convex. There's no abrupt transition, but the "apex" of the convex, as it were, is about 2/3 or 3/4 of the way to the edge and you can see a very different angle on that last 1/3 or 1/4. One of these two is, in fact, a Shigefusa.

There is no appreciable difference in their spine widths over the heel. In any case, all three taper as you move towards the "tip".

Hope that helps!

Len

TB_London
12-28-2011, 06:26 PM
The picture of c-dawg's nakiri shows the cutting bevel and the blade face bevels quite well IMO! Though not sure how much taper has been forged in to the top part


Shigefusa Nakiri
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a109/eceipretsam/1000th/DSC05470-1.jpg


It may just be personal preference but I like a more robust nakiri as I use it for a lot of tougher veg, kabocha squash, rutabaga, sweet potato etc

Whatever you come up with I'm sure will excel though, it's a case of finding what works for what you have :D

echerub
12-28-2011, 08:11 PM
I don't know if that's the stock geometry, but it looks like it ought to cut nicely :)

HHH Knives
12-29-2011, 10:00 AM
That mirror bevel is SWEET!

Im ready to grind some bevels in this blade! Thanks guys for the input!

HHH Knives
12-31-2011, 05:49 PM
Made some progress on this today. I ground the main bevels and have the blade hand rubbed and etched ready for handles!!!

Thanks Len and everyone for the info and pics and stuff! Made a huge difference on the grind..

Here are a few pics of the progress.

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3390&d=1325371549

Heres a shot of the tip, What ya think? thin enough???? :) Yea, I know my hands are dirty, I wouldnt want it any other way!! lol

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3386&d=1325371524

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3387&d=1325371530

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3389&d=1325371542

WildBoar
12-31-2011, 08:02 PM
absol-freakin'-awesome!

HHH Knives
12-31-2011, 11:07 PM
:D

Now I just gota figure out my handle materials. and layout. Im thinking something subtle. or at least subtle for me. :)

echerub
01-01-2012, 02:44 AM
I think this thing is gonna be a niiiiice cutter :)

HHH Knives
01-01-2012, 10:08 AM
Len, I think your right!!!
This is the craziest knife I have ever ground. I have a feeling that with the taper and bevels on this thing are gona make it one of the sharpest knives I have ever made! :)

HHH Knives
01-01-2012, 01:13 PM
Iv spent the last couple hours in mind warp. looking at woods and handle materials trying to figure out a combination that works with this blade.

Im thinking Black G10 or horn for the furrel, and something subtle in figure and light in color like some of the Royal mahogany. OMG I just dont know..

heres my delema. The blade pattern is SO BOLD I want it to stand as the center point for the knife, So Subtle and plain handle seems the logical choice.. Yet, subtle and plain is so NOT WHAT I DO! lol.. Which is making this harder then it should be.. OK so here I go.. Im asking you guys for some suggestions.

Either a Dark handle with smallish light color furrel, Or a Light color handle with a dark/black furel? Or should I go supercutom, and use some of my sickest cocobolo burl and some ebony for the furrel?

Andrew H
01-01-2012, 01:18 PM
The customer left it up to you? I would let the spirograph stand out, but that's just my opinion.

HHH Knives
01-01-2012, 01:23 PM
This one is not spoken for yet. Its more of a Just because I can knife.. It will be available on my web site when done, or if anyone is interested in this sweet blade, Let me know.. :) (shameless plug)

So your thinking is in line with what I was thinking, subtle and under spoken handle allowing the blade to be the boss! Thanks for your input

Paco.McGraw
01-01-2012, 01:29 PM
I am interested in it. PM on the way to you.

HHH Knives
01-01-2012, 02:02 PM
Paco, PM inbound.. Thanks for your interest.

HHH Knives
01-01-2012, 02:48 PM
Round Wa handle or octagon? Being my first Wa style shaped handle, Im just curious as to what everyone's preference is and why?

HHH Knives
01-01-2012, 04:46 PM
Made some progress on this today. I ground the main bevels and have the blade hand rubbed and etched ready for handles!!!

Thanks Len and everyone for the info and pics and stuff! Made a huge difference on the grind..

Here are a few pics of the progress.

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3390&d=1325371549

Heres a shot of the tip, What ya think? thin enough???? :) Yea, I know my hands are dirty, I wouldnt want it any other way!! lol

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3386&d=1325371524

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3387&d=1325371530

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3389&d=1325371542








You would think having all the wood that I have amassed over the years that choosing a handle material would be easy. Its not! lol I spent many hours and sometimes days until something speaks to me, may sound crazy, but its how I work. Here is what I came up with as a handle combination after all day in the shop looking through literally hundreds of pieces of what I would consider the finest examples of each species and in some cases multiple of each species. Trying to pic just 2 that will complement this blade and be subtle yet all HHH in its flair and beauty..
What ya guys think?

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3408&d=1325454272

echerub
01-01-2012, 05:54 PM
I think that would be quite nice. The near-vertical pattern in the main handle wood goes nicely with the spirograph pattern. It keeps the whole thing coherent, as it were.

Andrew H
01-01-2012, 08:36 PM
Octagon wa, you want the edges rounded off though obviously. I like them, and they are snazzy. :viking:

HHH Knives
01-01-2012, 11:04 PM
Well, After much consideration, and a little inspiration from the fish thread. I chose a handle.. Buckeye Burl.

Sry about the bad pics. Ill get better ones after I finish hand sanding this and polishing it out. :)



[IMG]http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3417&d=1325476923]/IMG]

Andrew H
01-01-2012, 11:13 PM
Beautiful work, Randy.

echerub
01-01-2012, 11:17 PM
Beautiful, man - it's beautiful :)

SpikeC
01-01-2012, 11:18 PM
It's nice, but a cast bronze bolster with the pattern engraved in it would really top it off!


:justkidding:

99Limited
01-01-2012, 11:24 PM
I'm kind of sad to see this piece go. It is my favorite piece of damascus that you guys have done. If I had been quicker on the draw I would have grabbed this for myself. Even though buckeye burl is one of my favorite choices, I have a nice piece of black dyed maple burl that I'd use for me.

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 12:40 AM
Thanks! :) Ill post the specs and some better pics tomorrow.

Mike Davis
01-02-2012, 03:36 AM
Man that is awesome...Great job Randy, this is going to make someone REAL happy :D

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 08:14 AM
Thanks Mike, I think you are right!! :D

Im going to take it to the stones today and work on the edge. This thing is gona be Screaming sharp. Its the thinnest cross section of steel I have ever ground.

Then Ill try and get some better pics and final specs for this one.. B4 I post it on the web site..

Eamon Burke
01-02-2012, 09:19 AM
great job! Looks like a great success.

TB_London
01-02-2012, 09:36 AM
That is a sweet looking knife, the wood is almost iridescent

tk59
01-02-2012, 11:27 AM
I really like what you did with the handle. :thumbsup:

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 11:41 AM
I just finished putting the edge on this and HOLY CRAP.. Its the sharpest knife I have ever held! Im amazed at the edge I was able to achieve off a 5k stone and a strop. Scary sharp at a NEW level for me.. Again....... WOW! :eek2::bigeek::pirate1:

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 01:27 PM
Some parting shots.. The sun came out today after at least 4 days. :) It stayed out a total of about 3 minutes!! lol, But I was ready and managed to get a few pics.

Thanks guys for all the great comments on the knife and following this thread!

This one is currently available..


http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3447&d=1325528470 http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3445&d=1325528456
http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3444&d=1325528450http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3446&d=1325528463http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3449&d=1325528477

echerub
01-02-2012, 02:18 PM
Mmmm mmm mmm. That knife is verrry nice :)

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 02:42 PM
Len, Thank you, Your help and input on the grinds really made all the difference on this one! Its a laser by every definition I have ever seen. and Im really proud of it.. Grinding a blade this thin is a tricky son of a gun! Im gona grab a caliper and the Nakiri and post some measurements.

Randy

JohnnyChance
01-02-2012, 03:04 PM
That came out awesome Randy. Handle looks great, grind looks nice and thin!

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 03:21 PM
OK, Let me first say, This is the thinnest and sharpest knife I have ever ground!! :) Yep. Im really proud of this one, from the steel to the grind to the handles. Its just as perfect of a example of our work as any knife I have made!!! I hope this makes sense.. without sounding cocky or anything.. lol :D

I measured this one by first measuring the main things like OAL and Blade length, Handle and spine stuff.. Then I measured the blade at 3 points in the middle of the flats. Then again in the same 3 spots a smidge above the final bevels. First at heel, second near the midway point between the heel and tip, and finally just behind the tip.


OAL 14 1/6" : 385mm'
Blade 8 1/4" : 210mm
Handle 5" : 127mm at longest. 20mm thick : 24mm tapering to 27mm high.

Spine above the heel, then halfway between heel and edge, and then just above the edge. measured at heel midway then at tip.

2.2mm, 1.9mm, .81mm At spine
1.6mm, 1.1mm, .70mm Mid way
.33mm, .29mm, .24mm Above the cutting edge. Just for fun I took the edge measurement at the tip and converted it to inches.. Its ridiculous. lol .009" Thats CRAZY thin!! And thats above the sharpening bevel.

The handles are Stabilized Buckeye burl with copper pins and vulcanized spacers. Inspired by some of the handles that I seen in the Fish thread..

Thanks guys for your help on this.. and all the great comments. and input! This is a awesome forum!
Randy

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 06:03 PM
This one is now available.. an listed on the web site, Spirograph Nakiri custom knife (http://www.hhhcustomknives.com/spirograph-nakiri-210mm-blade/)

Also I forgot to mention the blade height. got lost in all the other measuring! lol This one measures 55mm at the heel, tapering to 46mm 1 inch behind the tip.

ecchef
01-02-2012, 06:10 PM
This is your best work yet!

Johnny.B.Good
01-02-2012, 06:15 PM
That is a special knife. Great work.

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 07:37 PM
:thanx:


Thanks guys!

Hermes7792
01-02-2012, 08:56 PM
WAIT A MINUTE!!!

$1200 and no free shipping? BAH! :razz:

HHH Knives
01-02-2012, 09:07 PM
Hermes, I was just typing a sale for KKF members, and seen your post Now no sale for you guys!! :sad0:






Just kidding,:razz:

I want to show respect and appreciation to the members on this board. And also would LOVE to see this knife in the hands of one of you guys!! So heres "the deal" 10% off list and free shipping for all KKF members! Just post here "I GOTA HAVE THAT NAKIRI" and Ill shoot you a PM..

Play fair... No biting or kicking in the groin.. just the first one to post "I GOTA HAVE THAT NAKIRI" gets it!




Thanks again guys for encouraging me in the crazy obsession!! :)
Randy

SpikeC
01-02-2012, 09:09 PM
it does seem to be a very reasonable price for the quality of e piece.

Hermes7792
01-02-2012, 09:51 PM
No disrespect intended. The shipping change just made me chuckle. Do you take motorcycles in trade? Haha

bcrano
01-02-2012, 11:44 PM
Jeez randy. That's crazy cool.

HHH Knives
01-03-2012, 06:50 AM
No disrespect intended. The shipping change just made me chuckle. Do you take motorcycles in trade? Haha

I have been know to do some horse trading. What ya got, and will ya deliver it up here to me in Michigan? lol :D Im not paying shipping.... ;)

HHH Knives
01-05-2012, 04:24 PM
Well guys, Its been a WILD week. I wont go into the details, but I find myself in a position to play lets make a deal..

I have this beauty Nakiri and it needs a new home!!

So lets make a deal!! Make me a offer.

Any interested partys, Please PM me.
Thanks Guys!
Randy

HHH Knives
01-05-2012, 04:41 PM
Paper cutting has never been so easy! :D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=HS-Pqzx35SM

HHH Knives
01-06-2012, 11:46 AM
What a wild week!! :dazed: First, My refrigerator died.. :crytissue: and then Tuesday, Randy Jr's grinder started sparking and caught on fire!! :idea2: lol Thank God I didnt have to totally replace the fridge. And was able to order new parts and get it fixed.

So I have to try and make a quick sale on this knife..
Im gona mark this down and hope for a quick sale! NEW PRICE.. $875.00

Please PM me or post here "Ill take it."

Hermes7792
01-06-2012, 01:18 PM
What a wild week!! :dazed: First, My refrigerator died.. :crytissue: and then Tuesday, Randy Jr's grinder started sparking and caught on fire!! :idea2: lol Thank God I didnt have to totally replace the fridge. And was able to order new parts and get it fixed.

So I have to try and make a quick sale on this knife..
Im gona mark this down and hope for a quick sale! NEW PRICE.. $875.00

Please PM me or post here "Ill take it."

GAH! one of he best looking knives... ever!

DeepCSweede
01-06-2012, 01:34 PM
Of all the week's to cancel my newspaper subscription!!! Now I don't need a newspaper cutter anymore because I don't get the paper.:curse:

Beautiful piece - hope someone snags it up quick for you. I need to pick up some stones and actually have a fridge to replace myself, so it can't be me.:sorry:

HHH Knives
01-06-2012, 04:39 PM
GAH! one of he best looking knives... ever!

Thanks you sir. Thats a awesome complement. Made my day!! :D

HHH Knives
01-07-2012, 11:47 AM
Jeez randy. That's crazy cool.

Thanks bcrano, Were digging it.

On a side note, I just went back through the progression and resharpened the knife. I left it a little toothy rather then a stropped smooth edge. I am liking a toothy edge on this one even better!!

HHH Knives
01-09-2012, 03:48 PM
Thanks for all the help and input on this knife.. Im happy to say that this one is no longer available. ...

I gota say, Im gona miss having it here to play with and swoon over! lol :D

Stay Sharp!
Randy

WildBoar
01-09-2012, 03:51 PM
Thank god! I don't know if I would have been able to resist another post from you looking for a buyer -- that is one of the most striking knives I have seen.

Congrats on the sale, and congrats to the new owner :cool2:

Eaglewood
01-09-2012, 10:16 PM
Here it is ready to go to its new home and virgin cut!!!

http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l513/eaglewood03/DSC06787.jpg
http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l513/eaglewood03/DSC06785.jpg

tk59
01-09-2012, 11:29 PM
I'm curious to know if it performs as well as it looks. :knife:

HHH Knives
01-10-2012, 07:57 AM
This one is heading to the same gentleman who was requesting a Chinese veggie type knife. Its going to be a tested to see how it preforms under real world use. Ill let ya all know what he says after having used it in his restaurant for a week or two.

Coll box you found Eaglewood! that should make transport easy, and initial presentation very nice!! :) Thanks bro!

HHH Knives
01-20-2012, 02:10 PM
This one is back from its test drive. The verdict, Its a wicked cutter and a laser! and preformed wonderfully for him.

There were a few people who asked about this knife when I was making it as well as after it was completed.. If any of you are still interested.. PM me..

Heres the specs again and some pictures.

OAL 14 1/6" : 385mm'
Blade 8 1/4" : 210mm
Handle 5" : 127mm at longest. 20mm thick : 24mm tapering to 27mm high.

Spine above the heel, then halfway between heel and edge, and then just above the edge. measured at heel midway then at tip.

2.2mm, 1.9mm, .81mm At spine
1.6mm, 1.1mm, .70mm Mid way
.33mm, .29mm, .24mm Above the cutting edge. Just for fun I took the edge measurement at the tip and converted it to inches.. Its ridiculous. lol .009" Thats CRAZY thin!! And thats above the sharpening bevel.

The handles are Stabilized Buckeye burl with copper pins and vulcanized spacers. Inspired by some of the handles that I seen in the Fish thread..


http://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons050-1.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons053-1.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons055-1.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons060-1.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons063-1.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons064-1.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons068-1.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons086.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons057.jpghttp://i1101.photobucket.com/albums/g428/HHHKnives/featherpettyNakirispoons069-1.jpg