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Andreas
01-07-2012, 11:48 PM
Ok I think I have narrowed my selection to 3 knives and I need some help deciding, my choices are a carter 6.0sun fun not high grade, a 240 gyuto takeda AS or a Akifusa 240 gyuto. Maybe someone could explain what the different metals are and their advantages and disadvantages, thank you

Eamon Burke
01-08-2012, 12:03 AM
A 6sun wa-funayuki and a 240mm yo-gyuto are very very different things. That is not a decision we can make for you. The Takeda and Akifusa are similar, like an Accord and a Camry, but the Carter is like a Mini Cooper.

Andreas
01-08-2012, 12:06 AM
Is Carter's white steel as good as takedas AS? Thanks

MadMel
01-08-2012, 12:24 AM
Is Carter's white steel as good as takedas AS? Thanks

Can't compare it that way. Different steels, different properties. Heat treatment also makes a difference. If you'r looking for an AS, I'd go for a Hiromoto. Carter's a great cutter according to all that I have read.

On the topic of carter's knives, I'd like to ask what are the differences between the wa-bocho and the funayuki?

Andreas
01-08-2012, 01:00 AM
Carter's website has a description of blades knives and their names. I just want to know the different characteristics of the different steel and get some advice. Like does white steel #1 really loose an edge faster than AS or blue? Thanks again. That's a concern for me as I'm not much of a sharpener yet

jaybett
01-08-2012, 06:02 AM
It is hard to give advice, since we know so little about you or your needs. The only detail I've picked up on your posts, is that you work in a restaurant.

If this is going to be your main knife, then why would you want a smaller knife such as a Carter Funayuki?

Akifusa and Takeda are on the opposite sides of the knife spectrum. The Takeda is a thin knife, that are surprisingly light for there size. They are rustic knives, with the kurouchi finish and hammer marks. Also they are generally forged to shape, so each one is unique. The Takeda is a wa handled knife. Wa-handled knives are generally blade heavy. The Akifusa is a western handled knife. The balance point will be back towards the heel of the knife. From what I can gather the Akifusa is a thicker knife. My reservation is that the steel on the Akifusa is pretty hard, I'd wonder how easy it would be to learn how to sharpen on it.

The different characteristics about steel are usually generalizations. The problem is that most of the generalizations are subjective. White steel is thought to get sharper then blue. My white steel knives take a very keen edge, but so do my AS knives. I'd be hard pressed to tell the the difference. My white steel knives are noticeably sharper then my blue steel knife. The blue steel knife has the best edge retention out of all my knifes. I think its more of a testament to the maker's ability to work with the steel, rather then the steel itself.

There are so many variables when it comes to Japanese knives. Wa-handled versus Yo/western handled knives. A thin gyuto versus a thicker one. A flatter edge versus a curved one. Carbon versus stainless, versus semi-stainless. The only way to find out which of these types of knifes will work for you, is through experience. You will have to try a variety of knives to see which features you like.

To start, I'd recommend an inexpensive thicker, western handled knife, Hiromoto, JCK Carbonext, Yoshiro. Send it to Dave, to get it sharpened. Use the knife, learn what you like and don't like about it. Learn to sharpen it. After you have used the knife for a while, try a wa-handled knife or a laser. If you don't like them, you can always sell them on the forums.

One forum member who worked in a restaurant, went through I believe 14 gyutos before he found the one that was right for him. It does take time and effort to find the knife that works best you.

Jay

NO ChoP!
01-08-2012, 02:20 PM
I feel like your choices are kind of all over. A Takeda runs about $330 today. That puts you in the ballpark of Masamoto KS, Mizuno, Yoshikane, etc.... These are some serious contenders.

If sharpening is a concern for you, I would narrow out the Carter white, as edge retention is not a strong point.

Do you want wa or western?
Are you ready for carbon?
Do you want a laser or something a little more convex?
Do you like rustic/ hammered or clean/ sleek?
Are you going to buy stones and learn to sharpen?
Are you looking for a Japanese or custom American?

Phip
01-08-2012, 03:36 PM
Is Carter's white steel as good as takedas AS? Thanks

I chipped a bit of my Takeda when I first got it, then improved my technique and that problem disappeared. By the time I got the Carter I couldn't see a difference in the way the steels performed. I suspect that if you're like me, a knife nut and serious home cook, you'll never be able to either sharpen these knives to to their nth degree fullest potential or dull them fast enough to warrant sharpening as often as you'd like.

Lefty
01-08-2012, 03:57 PM
You're all over the place because it is VERY CONFUSING! Don't worry about it, trust me. Just think about these few things:
Do you have certain knives in mind because of looks? If so, you aren't the only one. What are they?
Do you want Wa or western handles? Carbon or stainless?
Ease of sharpening (Carters are great for this), or edge retention?
Do you want a bruiser of a knife, or a lightweight laser?
What other knives will be sharing the duties, or will this be taking the place of another knife (if so, what knife?)?

Don't worry, we'll figure it out ;)

Andreas
01-08-2012, 05:07 PM
I want a rustic bruiser, great edge retention, Japanese handle and I think I'm ready for carbon. Not a laser though. I think!!!

Pensacola Tiger
01-08-2012, 05:09 PM
You're all over the place because it is VERY CONFUSING! Don't worry about it, trust me. Just think about these few things:
Do you have certain knives in mind because of looks? If so, you aren't the only one. What are they?
Do you want Wa or western handles? Carbon or stainless?
Ease of sharpening (Carters are great for this), or edge retention?
Do you want a bruiser of a knife, or a lightweight laser?
What other knives will be sharing the duties, or will this be taking the place of another knife (if so, what knife?)?

Don't worry, we'll figure it out ;)

+1.

Pensacola Tiger
01-08-2012, 05:13 PM
I want a rustic bruiser, great edge retention, Japanese handle and I think I'm ready for carbon. Not a laser though. I think!!!

Zakuri 240mm Aogami Super Gyuto (http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/kitchen-knives/zakuri/zakuri-240mm-aogami-super-gyuto.html)

3519

Andreas
01-08-2012, 07:23 PM
Looks great, is this what you recommend? Can you tell me more and is it carbon, bruiser

Andreas
01-08-2012, 08:15 PM
JkI has blue #1 zakuri and AS zakuri steel. Can you please explain the difference because the 240 zakuri measures hugh. They have a smaller blue #1 but I don't know if it's as good as AS.

Lefty
01-08-2012, 08:24 PM
What about a used Watanabe 240 gyuto? That might be perfect!

SpikeC
01-08-2012, 09:59 PM
Nah, he should get the Takeda. And then order a Kramer damy.

Pensacola Tiger
01-08-2012, 10:31 PM
Looks great, is this what you recommend? Can you tell me more and is it carbon, bruiser.


JkI has blue #1 zakuri and AS zakuri steel. Can you please explain the difference because the 240 zakuri measures hugh. They have a smaller blue #1 but I don't know if it's as good as AS.

Yes, the Zakuri is carbon, and it is a "bruiser" as you call it. Look at this photo 3522 to see what I mean. This knife is not a laser. I had the opportunity to briefly use the 240 mm kurouchi version of the knife and it is a real performer.

I personally would not consider the 210 mm funayuki an all purpose knife, but you may find it perfect for your needs. That's one of the things that you can only find out by actually using it.

I'd recommend calling Jon at JKI and talking with him about the Zakuri, as well as knives in general. You'll find him easy to talk with, and he will be able to speak directly to your questions. He is a certifiable "knife knut" like the rest of us, and has made his hobby into his business, in my opinion the best kind of businessman to deal with.

Andreas
01-08-2012, 11:25 PM
Thank you and I will keep you posted