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View Full Version : I'm addicted! I did it again....Help



Andreas
01-15-2012, 09:59 PM
Well, since joining this forum I have become addicted to Japanese knives. I bought my first knife a Carter 6.6 hd fun just 1 week ago and now today I bought a Zakuri as 240 gyuto. Also, now I have an appointment to get a knife tattood on my inner arm. Please help me stop or at least slow down. I don't even know how to sharpen yet. I did buy my last knife from Jon so I know I will at least be getting some advice. Thanks P.S. what should my next knife be?

unkajonet
01-15-2012, 10:04 PM
Stones. You need stones.

stevenStefano
01-15-2012, 10:08 PM
What's the rush? Use the ones you've bought for a while and decide what you like and don't like about them. That should help you decide what the next one to get should be like. And yes if you haven't already you need to buy sharpening stones

labor of love
01-15-2012, 10:18 PM
I would like to hear a review of that zakuri. Particularly how a knife in that weight class performs in the kitchen.

Cadillac J
01-15-2012, 10:19 PM
Agree with both the comments above. Buying knife after knife isn't really isn't the answer right now, especially considering you don't have the experience to know what you really like in a knife yet, let alone how to bring out the best in these knives by learning to sharpen well.

Being proficient at sharpening is much more important than acquiring more knives.

SpikeC
01-15-2012, 10:48 PM
Your next knife should be a tuna sword on your forearm!

Eamon Burke
01-15-2012, 11:22 PM
Stones!

Andreas
01-15-2012, 11:30 PM
You are all right! Any advice on stones? That's we're my money needs to go for now. Thanks

schanop
01-15-2012, 11:59 PM
You'll love Zakuri. I like mine a lot a a thicker counter part to masa ks.

Andrew H
01-16-2012, 12:20 AM
You are all right! Any advice on stones? That's we're my money needs to go for now. Thanks

I know where you're coming from, it was hard for me to buy stones instead of knives in the beginning. There are plenty of great stones out there but the Gesshin line Jon sells is very popular right now. There is also the standard setup of the Beston 500 grit, Bester 1200 grit, and Suehiro Rika 5000 grit.

Mingooch
01-16-2012, 12:22 AM
I can only base my stones suggestion based on my similarities to your addiction a few years back. When I was new to the great jknives, people suggested certain starter stones. I bought those, practiced, improved, etc. But later put those away and bought a set of choseras. I certainly use some more than others in the full set, but love those stones. I have also since bought an edge pro, pro. I love that as well. As a home cook, I quickly improved using both freehand and the EPP. I am lately playing with natural stones, but wouldnt suggest them to start with. However the chosera, I love. Pricey tho.

AFKitchenknivesguy
01-16-2012, 01:31 AM
Damn dude, I've laid down some dough on some pretty sweet knives, but getting a tattoo of one? You got it bad.

Jason

mc2442
01-16-2012, 01:37 AM
Yeah, I would see if the addiction sticks for a while before applying ink. If you were actually serious that is.

Bryan G.
01-17-2012, 02:25 AM
Well if he "sticks" around here that addiction isn't going anywhere. You have to get the thought out of your head to stop addiction and certainly you are in the wrong place for that. That's like an alcoholic hanging out with Anthony Bourdaine in a bar all day, ***?! Get the tattoo and embrace it or leave now while there is a glimpse of hope.

You need to learn and sharpen at some point but I can counter my friends argument about buying stones first ... man if he buys another knife he'll have 3 and they are all made from great steel so he's got AT LEAST a month (if not more if just a home cook) before he even needs to think about sharpening. Buy a knife and 30$ ceramic steel and don't let these guys talk you outta getting another knife. Hey I warned you.

Kind Regards

Bryan

PS ... Jon is a great dealer, you're in good hands. He's not going to stop you but he won't let you end up in a back alley naked with two gyutos from China made out of iron like some dealers might. Again just keeping folks informed around here. Responsible addiction is the best kind.

Johnny.B.Good
01-17-2012, 02:32 AM
I agree with others. Buy some stones.

I also agree with Bryan. Get a nice 270mm sujihiki, and maybe a 150mm petty.

And a bread knife.

And a Boardsmith.

Bryan G.
01-17-2012, 02:36 AM
Ok see now we're back on track. Thanks Johnny

bieniek
01-17-2012, 03:28 AM
just realize more knives aint make you any cooler or fancy, get mature and have your own brain, instead getting excited over reading forums.

Can you use your knife properly? Learning will take you two hard years of practice.

If youre job is example construction-masonery, are you buying snooker cues ?

El Pescador
01-17-2012, 05:17 AM
just realize more knives aint make you any cooler or fancy, get mature and have your own brain, instead getting excited over reading forums.

Can you use your knife properly? Learning will take you two hard years of practice.

If youre job is example construction-masonery, are you buying snooker cues ?

I'm glad I'm not the only one who drinks then posts!

Lefty
01-17-2012, 12:12 PM
Yeah, that post was pure bullsh!t. This is coming from a guy who doesn't tend to get annoyed too easily too.

Bryan G.
01-17-2012, 01:43 PM
I don't know, I think there are some pretty F*%&ing cool guys here with a hell of a collection. I don't know if their collection has anything to do with how f*&%ing cool they are, but i don't see any lame knives in their collections, I'm just making an observation. Also I am certain I have superior knowledge in knife skills then many of them, again find them none the less cool. Just a another observation.

One last observation or question would be, how is it possible to learn a certain technique or style of knife without actually HAVING the knife?

Personal experience talking: I spent the first 10 years of my career using lesser German and American knives and learned less then the first year of using more refined Japanese knives. I have seen 4 year old's that can name every state, country and continent and place on the globe from memory ... something I can't do at 31. I have a kid who is 18 in my kitchen who can solve literal rocket science equations who struggles with some basic prep, though in the time I've worked with him his progress is improving much faster because he likes me and we have fun. So I would say putting limits on yourself is ridiculous. Just personal experience speaking.

There is a a quote by the mastermind that scientifically states, "There is no beauty in self denial"

Just food for thought on a more un-joking note, learning comes in all kinds of ways.

Kind Regards

Bryan

ejd53
01-18-2012, 10:55 AM
just realize more knives aint make you any cooler or fancy, get mature and have your own brain, instead getting excited over reading forums.

Can you use your knife properly? Learning will take you two hard years of practice.

If youre job is example construction-masonery, are you buying snooker cues ?

My :2cents:. I don't believe that most people here think that having great knives has anything to do with being "cooler or fancy". Rather, they either (1) use them in their profession or (2) they appreciate the value of a good tool, or (3) both (most likely). From my own experience, I fall into the second category. I'm a home cook and I love to do it, and for 30 years I have used one set of Henkel 4 stars. It was only recently that I found this forum and have since learned what I was missing. Since I value knowledge (I taught college and medical school), and good tools (I still do woodworking with my grandfather's 100 year old hand tools), I value this board. Can I use a knife properly? I thought I could until I got my first good knife and quickly realized that I would be doing things a lot differently from then on, so I'm back on the learning curve. I probably will never have the knife skills to prep cases of veggies or hundreds of pounds of protein quickly, but I don't need to; I either have enough skill now to do what I need to do or will learn the necessary skills. But as Bryan so reasonably pointed out, how do I learn how to properly use a Gyuto or a Suji if I don't have one and the technique is so different than what my Henkels require?. You can't learn to sail by using a ski boat.

Andreas
01-18-2012, 09:29 PM
True!! Thank everyone

Pachowder
01-18-2012, 09:53 PM
That is well said. I would love to hear about the 100 year old woodworking tools you use. I still use hand planes and a millers falls boring "machine". I thought that was old school!


My :2cents:. I don't believe that most people here think that having great knives has anything to do with being "cooler or fancy". Rather, they either (1) use them in their profession or (2) they appreciate the value of a good tool, or (3) both (most likely). From my own experience, I fall into the second category. I'm a home cook and I love to do it, and for 30 years I have used one set of Henkel 4 stars. It was only recently that I found this forum and have since learned what I was missing. Since I value knowledge (I taught college and medical school), and good tools (I still do woodworking with my grandfather's 100 year old hand tools), I value this board. Can I use a knife properly? I thought I could until I got my first good knife and quickly realized that I would be doing things a lot differently from then on, so I'm back on the learning curve. I probably will never have the knife skills to prep cases of veggies or hundreds of pounds of protein quickly, but I don't need to; I either have enough skill now to do what I need to do or will learn the necessary skills. But as Bryan so reasonably pointed out, how do I learn how to properly use a Gyuto or a Suji if I don't have one and the technique is so different than what my Henkels require?. You can't learn to sail by using a ski boat.

ejd53
01-19-2012, 12:27 AM
My grandfather was born and raised near Glasgow Scotland. He apprenticed as a joiner in one of the shipyards (Beardmore and Sons in Dalmuir, I think), before coming to the US in 1923. I still have some of his hand tools, mainly hand planes from Malloch and Sons in Perth and some Stanleys that he apparently got when he came to this country (As far as I can date them they were made between 1925-1928). My favorites are the wooden Mallochs, which are from the early teens at the latest (Malloch sold the company in 1913). They all still work beautifully (carbon steel ftw) and I probably use them more than my more modern planes.

Bryan G.
01-19-2012, 01:02 AM
That's pretty sweet. Sometimes people fail to really progress a true classic, and sometimes the true classic is just built with more feeling and thus a deeper connection is formed with that tool that simple thought alone has not a chance of out doing no matter the statics explaining why it SHOULD be better.

This also can be applied to knives. And further delves into my point about not being afraid of starting out with something nice. It's not even just about having a Henkel western compared to a WA Gyuto or Suji ... it's about having a QUALITY tool to learn with. My friend Mr Broida is a proponent of this. I love it when he tells new guys "Who cares if you don't know how to sharpen it! What are you gonna do, scratch it, give it uneven bevels that we'll help you fix. Go for it!" that's how I remember it anyway! :P Honestly, fear is self thought.
Even if you drop $500 on a well known maker with history VS a $80 on a factory made Japanese knife there is a HUGE difference in quality. With that difference comes advantages. And with advantages, comes, well, advantages. Though you may not be able to take FULL advantage of those advantages right off the bat, you'll find them because they're there. It can simply do things a lesser knife cannot do. THE LIMITS CAN BE PUSHED, and how ELSE do we learn than by pushing the LIMITS of what we have LIMITED OURSELVES TO? And once you know what something is capable of, you know what lesser things aren't capable of in there lesser state, but you know what point you can push them too.

Not only did my knife skills dramatically improve (almost over night) after using more advanced designed cutlery, but my skills with German knives I used for 10 years improved and I can do things with those knives I couldn't before. Pretty interesting, the only thing now is I gotta buy more expensive knives or these mastermind bladesmiths must like me enough to give me a blade or two! Ha :)

Kind Regards

Bryan