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View Full Version : list of possible 1st japanese/japanese style knife.



red49er
02-02-2012, 05:43 PM
I am another knife newbie looking to get started. I'm sure there will be a few purchases that I will scratch my head over down the line but I'll worry about that later. Right now I'm looking to buy a very good quality knife - without really knowing what I want. As a general rule of thumb really dislike buying the same thing twice when I should have just sucked it up, paid a few more dollars up front. Style will be japanese, type is gyuto and length is 240mm. I prefer generally plain/classical looks as opposed to fancy (damascus is too busy for me for the most part). I will take care of it but not be fanatical, so I have been thinking along the "semi-stainless" lines but definitely not limited to this type of steel. I will learn to sharpen but again it won't take up a whole afternoon or become an obsession. I am relatively unskilled in the kitchen but have a growing interest. So, after breaking a Chicago Cutlery knife last month I decided to retool the kitchen hardware. I've narrowed it down a bit and would like everyones comment, rankings or any other input. Additional recommendations are appreciated. Here it is... (in no certain order)

1.kikuichi warikomi gold vg10 steel hrc 60
2.ryusen blazen
3.hattori (from JCK) FH-7E solid vg-10 hrc 60-61
4.ohishi migaki aogami #2 hrc 60-61
5.******** remedy cpm154 hrc 61
6.akifusa PM

Thanks to everybody who take the time to give me some input. Just a side note I think the ironwood handles D. Markell used is incredible!

Mint427
02-02-2012, 08:15 PM
I like the Hattori - have the paring knife w/Ebony handle...super knife. Have fun!

Pensacola Tiger
02-02-2012, 08:55 PM
How did you manage to break your Chicago Cutlery knife? I ask because you have listed several knives with hard steel cores that will not tolerate much in the way of abuse. The edges chip and look like this:

4148

Rick

red49er
02-02-2012, 10:10 PM
How did you manage to break your Chicago Cutlery knife? I ask because you have listed several knives with hard steel cores that will not tolerate much in the way of abuse. The edges chip and look like this:
4148

Rick

Rick, I just leaned on it a bit. Strait downward pressure and it broke where the handle meets the blade. While I don't think this is abuse, it may have been the wrong knife for the job. Also it was inherited from family so it may have suffered from some less than desirable care. the good news is it has opened up a whole new world. what would be your pick?

Dave Martell
02-02-2012, 10:21 PM
Welcome to KKF and thanks for the kind words. :)

red49er
02-02-2012, 10:27 PM
I looked through all of your pics, and while there were many that were very cool, the ironwood just stood out. the only one i would probably pass on is the one that is dyed blue, though of course pics and real life can be two different things. if and when i wanted to customize the knives i'm going to buy (exact ones obviously undetermined) how long does it take and what kind of ball park $ are we talking about? oh, and if you had to pick one from the list i through out which would you pick?

Pensacola Tiger
02-02-2012, 10:43 PM
Rick, I just leaned on it a bit. Strait downward pressure and it broke where the handle meets the blade. While I don't think this is abuse, it may have been the wrong knife for the job. Also it was inherited from family so it may have suffered from some less than desirable care. the good news is it has opened up a whole new world. what would be your pick?

Just asking. Some people have been known to try to use Japanese knives to chop through chicken bones or even king crab legs.

I've owned or used five of the knives you listed. I'd rank them in descending order like this:

Akifusa PM - Superior edge retention. Excellent fit and finish. Excellent geometry and profile. PM steel may be difficult for a novice to sharpen well.

Blazen (Bu-Rei-Zen) - Excellent edge retention. Superior fit and finish. Excellent geometry and profile. PM steel may be difficult for a novice to sharpen well. Includes a saya.

Hattori FH - Very good edge retention. Excellent fit and finish. Excellent geometry and profile.

Kikuichi Warikomi Gold - Very good edge retention. Above average fit and finish. Good geometry and profile.

(He who must not be named) Addict - Very good edge retention. Average fit and finish. Fair geometry and profile.

So, for me (maybe not for you, though) the top two choices are the Akifusa and the Blazen, but for someone starting out, I would recommend the Hattori FH, from the list you gave me. It is a more forgiving knife to use and to maintain, and its performance is within a hair of the Akifusa and Blazen in a home environment.

Rick

red49er
02-02-2012, 10:57 PM
really cool response - exactly what i am looking for... I have to say the akifusa has been the #1 choice from my research. the ohishi migaki looks very interesting as does the hattori. i didn't realize i couldn't mention the other maker by name. why is this? seems like there are a lot of people selling their goods here.

red49er
02-02-2012, 11:01 PM
looks like i should invest in another german knife ( i gave a henkel pro s to my brother) for the heavy work. Messiershmidt? ( i didn't check spelling obviously).

Pensacola Tiger
02-02-2012, 11:19 PM
looks like i should invest in another german knife ( i gave a henkel pro s to my brother) for the heavy work. Messiershmidt? ( i didn't check spelling obviously).

Forschner/Victorinox. Takes a licking and keeps on ticking. I gave one to my nephew three years ago to use at his college apartment and it's still going strong.

bikehunter
02-03-2012, 01:09 PM
Forschner/Victorinox. Takes a licking and keeps on ticking. I gave one to my nephew three years ago to use at his college apartment and it's still going strong.

Couldn't agree more. Don't mess up your good Japanese knives for lack of a 10", $30 Forschner. Thin, for a Western knife, takes a reasonable edge and dynamite for spatchcocking a chicken or turkey...and most anything else you require it to do. Even bone, getting rid of those pesky ends on poultry legs. Laughs at hard squash. Still the best bang for the buck.

You sure as hell don't want to be faced with something like that nightmare chip, posted by Pensacola Tiger, on one of your nicer knives.

Oh...just couldn't help mentioning....it's Messermeister. Had to laugh, imagining using a German fighter plane in the kitchen. ;-)

Candlejack
02-03-2012, 02:53 PM
Just asking. Some people have been known to try to use Japanese knives to chop through chicken bones or even king crab legs.

I've owned or used five of the knives you listed. I'd rank them in descending order like this:

Akifusa PM - Superior edge retention. Excellent fit and finish. Excellent geometry and profile. PM steel may be difficult for a novice to sharpen well.

Blazen (Bu-Rei-Zen) - Excellent edge retention. Superior fit and finish. Excellent geometry and profile. PM steel may be difficult for a novice to sharpen well. Includes a saya.

Hattori FH - Very good edge retention. Excellent fit and finish. Excellent geometry and profile.

Kikuichi Warikomi Gold - Very good edge retention. Above average fit and finish. Good geometry and profile.

(He who must not be named) Addict - Very good edge retention. Average fit and finish. Fair geometry and profile.

So, for me (maybe not for you, though) the top two choices are the Akifusa and the Blazen, but for someone starting out, I would recommend the Hattori FH, from the list you gave me. It is a more forgiving knife to use and to maintain, and its performance is within a hair of the Akifusa and Blazen in a home environment.

Rick




In terms of fit & finish i would rank the Addict higher than the Akifusa. My Addict had excellent fit & finish where my Akifusa had an OK f&f.
But in terms of performance, the Akifusa totally dominates the Addict.

red49er
02-03-2012, 03:06 PM
thanks for the observations. narrowed it down to two. the akifusa and the oshishi. if its the akifusa i'll rehandle it pretty quickly. so by a show of hands...option A : Akfusa or option B :Ohishi

red49er
02-03-2012, 03:07 PM
how on earth did that red cheeked little bugger get on my post?

tk59
02-03-2012, 03:38 PM
thanks for the observations. narrowed it down to two. the akifusa and the oshishi. if its the akifusa i'll rehandle it pretty quickly. so by a show of hands...option A : Akfusa or option B :Ohishi
Akifusa (HOWEVER, why would you want the Aki over the Blazen? It is thicker so it doesn't cut quite as nicely. It is cheaper by a fair amount.)

red49er
02-03-2012, 05:21 PM
we'll i know i'm onto something when i get differing #1 recommendations. I think i will opt for the Akifusa, because in my opinion, it looks better. I have also a majority of opinions favoring this one. Sure it would be nice to have an unlimited budget, but i don't so I am shopping, but saving $50.00 vs. getting what I really want is no contest. One question about the Akifusa - how "stainless" is it?

tk59
02-03-2012, 05:49 PM
It is plenty stainless.