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monty
03-29-2011, 02:49 PM
Hi Jon,

I'm in the market for a knife that will be good for trimming chciken thighs for competition bbq. I won't be breaking chickens down with this knife, but I will be using it to trim and shape the meat and scrape skin. Right now I am using the practice yanagi that Dave used to sell. It's a lot of fun, but I'm looking to upgrade. Any ideas?

Nate

jjparkinson
03-29-2011, 03:02 PM
I bought a western handled konosuke honesuki from john in white steel. It's a really nice knife for chicken.

Eamon Burke
03-29-2011, 04:09 PM
A Honesuki is a Japanese knife for fowl specifically. Yanagis are specifically for sashimi. You can use them for anything you want, but they serve their original purpose fantastically.

So what about your Yanagi is not to your liking? Do you want a blade that is shorter, lighter, flat profile, more belly, nicer looking, longer edge holding, better biting through skin, less wedging, less sticking, more ergonomic, more finger clearance, handle heavy, etc etc etc.

monty
03-29-2011, 05:37 PM
So what about your Yanagi is not to your liking? Do you want a blade that is shorter, lighter, flat profile, more belly, nicer looking, longer edge holding, better biting through skin, less wedging, less sticking, more ergonomic, more finger clearance, handle heavy, etc etc etc.

I love the yanagi and have no problems using it at all. Really, is a perfect knife for what I'm doing. I'm buying more knives because I have this crazy itch to have more :thumbsup: I want to experience sharpening a different knife, and I want to have a better frame of reference in terms of what's available. This is definitely a want, not a need.

ThEoRy
03-29-2011, 08:21 PM
Honesuki or Garasuki.

FryBoy
03-29-2011, 08:24 PM
Kitchen shears are hard to beat for cleaning up chicken:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/3150BR4JPNL._SS400_.jpg

JBroida
03-30-2011, 03:25 AM
For me, it would really help to have a better idea of what you mean with regard to what you will be doing... i'm kind of split between a honesuki and petty for you in my mind right now.

On shears, i rarely use them... i just like knives better... Faster and easier for me.

Anyways, can you explain a bit more about what you will be doing with the knife?

monty
03-30-2011, 08:43 AM
For me, it would really help to have a better idea of what you mean with regard to what you will be doing... i'm kind of split between a honesuki and petty for you in my mind right now.

On shears, i rarely use them... i just like knives better... Faster and easier for me.

Anyways, can you explain a bit more about what you will be doing with the knife?

I'm actually thinking about two different knives - and I'll need to settle on one. It would be nice to have a suji for slicing brisket and pork. I also love what the yanagi does to chicken and if I can find a knife that's even better suited for chicken then I'll go that route. For the chicken, I trim thighs to use in competition. I need to remove fat and trim to shape while leaving the skin intact. Thus, I need a knife that will allow me to make the most precise cuts possible.

Eamon Burke
03-30-2011, 10:05 AM
I think you should consider a long, blade heavy Gyuto. Might do all of it.

EdipisReks
03-30-2011, 08:20 PM
i bought a cheap and cheerful white steel 120mm deba off of eBay for breaking down and dressing chicken. cost me $35 shipped (http://cgi.ebay.com/Japanese-Mikihisa-ko-deba-chef-knife-Houchou-Sashimi-31-/200544096101). works great for my uses, but i don't need to worry too much about presentation when i'm cooking at home.

Citizen Snips
03-30-2011, 08:35 PM
i would say that if you are going to be doing trimming or anything more intricate, go with a 150mm petty. they are a little more precise but need a bit more experience as they are not going to go through bone as well.

if you are looking for something to fabricate a whole chicken to 5 piece fried chicken cuts or something similar, go with the honesuki. its more of a butchers knife than a precision tool

in my experience, i prefer the petty and even sold my honesuki. i like precision :D

mhlee
03-31-2011, 11:53 AM
If by trimming and shaping chicken for barbecue, you're talking about cutting the pockets of fat off thighs and trimming extra skin so that when it cooks it shrinks to the size of the thigh, I would recommend a small petty. That's what I use - a Sakai Takayuki 120 mm petty. Although I don't compete, I cook for practice to eventually compete; I'm an avid home barbecuer and KCBS CBJ.

I've never owned a honesuki, but certainly am interested in one, but since you're talking about lifting the skin to remove fat, but leaving the skin intact, you'll need a nimble, small knife to get into those places. A honesuki has a tall profile at the heel, midway, it still might be taller than a petty. So it may be hard to get under the skin without pulling it off, and then cutting out the pockets of fat. If this isn't what you're doing, and you're talking more about breaking chicken down into parts, then a honesuki could be exactly what you're looking for.

Personally, for barbecuing, specifically cutting fat off of briskets and pork butts and shaping ribs, I've felt that a very straight and short (height) blade about 270 would be perfect for these tasks, something like a straight sujihiki (but shorter) and almost like a salmon slicer, so you can really carefully cut the fat down to the right height so that when it cooks, it will leave the just the right amount of fat left on the finished product. This would also be a great knife to separate the flat from the point on briskets and to trim the fat between the point and flat (and all that weird, tripe looking fat there).

SpikeC
03-31-2011, 02:02 PM
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_R-BA0-S2VKk/TY-RVDPWH9I/AAAAAAAAAHw/yLR7iqxSWcE/s912/PICT0429.JPG

I'm finding this great for working with chicken. The balance is right at the front edge of the bolster.

Audi's or knives
03-31-2011, 05:07 PM
Not to hijack but for those using honesuki's do you prefer a western or wa handle. I'm thinking the beefier western handle would provide better grip but the wa may be more nimble in the hand. Any suggestions/input since I am also in the market for one.

SpikeC
03-31-2011, 05:51 PM
I made mine with a beefy wa handle. It gives a secure grip butt does not get in the way, it works well for MY hands!

Audi's or knives
03-31-2011, 11:38 PM
Good idea on the thicker wa handle, just trying to imagine what would provide the most secure grip. I do like the wa D shaped handle on my Konosuke HD petty, maybe a thicker version of that.

JBroida
04-01-2011, 12:57 AM
We ended up going over a bunch of options on the phone, but for the purposes of this thread, i like the following kinds of knives (in no particular order) for trimming chicken-
Petty 150-210mm
Honesuki
Hankostu

Other things to consider... as long as you arent hitting a bone, it doesnt need to be a thicker knife. However, thicker isnt going to hurt too much on foods like this because wedging isnt a problem. If you know you wont be hitting hard bone or working on hard poly boards, something between 60-62 hrc might be nice. However, if the knife is going to be hitting bone a bit or woking on crappy boards, 58-59 is nice. Stainless will have better toughness in many cases, so that also should be considered.

FWIW, i've used a 210mm yanagi for this task before and it worked just fine. However, i would probably pick a petty at the end of the day.

Citizen Snips
04-01-2011, 10:22 AM
well, i didn't mention that i personally use the 210 mioroshi (previously 180 hon deba) along with the gc 150 petty. i find that when the task is a friend chicken type cut the debas work great. i use the petty for work that needs to be accurate and trimmed such as boneless airline half chickens for roasting with the skin on. that would be way to hard for a deba.

Kyle
04-01-2011, 06:19 PM
Jon,

I'm thinking of getting a new honesuki, I see your site only lists one and it's out of stock. Is this something I'd need to special order or are you planning on getting more in the future?

JBroida
04-01-2011, 07:51 PM
I have more on the way... these last two months have been way busier than i had expected and it takes us a little time go get caught back up... so sorry about that.

Eamon Burke
04-01-2011, 09:23 PM
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/_R-BA0-S2VKk/TY-RVDPWH9I/AAAAAAAAAHw/yLR7iqxSWcE/s912/PICT0429.JPG

I'm finding this great for working with chicken. The balance is right at the front edge of the bolster.

Spike, I keep seeing this knife, and the first time, I thought it was funny looking. But it keeps drawing my eye. I really like it now! Especially the patina contrast on the edge, and it looks well balanced. I bet its great.

Chef Niloc
04-02-2011, 11:40 PM
Don't forget This one
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/celtic2174/Chef%20Nilocs%20Knives/81ab5553.png

monty
04-07-2011, 09:26 AM
After some conversations with Jon, here's what I went with.
http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/kitchen-knives-by-type/petty-knife/konosuke-150mm-white-2-wa-petty.html

stereo.pete
04-07-2011, 10:08 AM
Monty,

Great choice, I have the same knife albeit with the old silk screened kanji and I love it.

Pensacola Tiger
04-07-2011, 04:47 PM
After some conversations with Jon, here's what I went with.
http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/kitchen-knives-by-type/petty-knife/konosuke-150mm-white-2-wa-petty.html

That knife should sharpen up to a razor. I've got the 24cm gyuto.

Josh
04-17-2011, 09:19 AM
This is a fantastic looking knife - can you share some details about the knife?

UglyJoe
04-17-2011, 02:44 PM
Josh, I just got one of these knives as well and will post a mini-review after I've had time to play with it a little more... and yes, it is a FANTASTIC knife.

Kyle
04-17-2011, 02:50 PM
Don't forget This one
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/celtic2174/Chef%20Nilocs%20Knives/81ab5553.png

Is that a Watanabe honesuki?

JBroida
04-17-2011, 03:24 PM
Custom heiji