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ajhuff
05-27-2012, 10:57 AM
Why do so many of you like them? I don't. I'm probably alone in that I know. I'm not asking you to change my mind but please explain to me what you see in them that you find beautiful.

-AJ

oivind_dahle
05-27-2012, 11:05 AM
You are probably alone :)

The effect of the different hardening is stunning. All from wavy pattern to a mix of skies meeting the blade :)
Guess you don't like sanmai either then?

Lefty
05-27-2012, 11:07 AM
It's just a something different for your eyes to look at. It creates interest. The hardening thing is cool too, I guess.

Andrew H
05-27-2012, 11:10 AM
I don't know if I can explain why I like something. It's just visually pleasing. Kind of like how three pins in a handle looks better than two; I can't explain it but I prefer the way three look.

DevinT
05-27-2012, 11:21 AM
Make a knife with one and see if you like 'em then.

Hoss

NO ChoP!
05-27-2012, 02:00 PM
I think its a status symbol. Kind of like having a crown on your watch....

kalaeb
05-27-2012, 02:07 PM
cosmetics for me. I think they look bad A.

oivind_dahle
05-27-2012, 02:13 PM
Honyaki knives got hamon line and is much more difficult to make than the kasumi knives.
Hamon line stands for quality! :)

I like it :)

tk59
05-27-2012, 02:22 PM
+1 to Andrew and Lefty. Hamons are cool although 99% of the ones I like have been on honyaki or Bill Burke's blades.

Burl Source
05-27-2012, 02:23 PM
My primary reason for liking is cosmetic.
With that said, a few will look lots better than most.
My thinking is that if the maker takes the time to produce a beautiful hamon,
he probably took a lot of time to get the rest of the knife just right as well.

99Limited
05-27-2012, 02:35 PM
... My thinking is that if the maker takes the time to produce a beautiful hamon,
he probably took a lot of time to get the rest of the knife just right as well.

+1

but after a while though, won't the patina mask the hamon and it becomes a faint memory?

kalaeb
05-27-2012, 02:35 PM
7513

Like I said...Bad A...

sachem allison
05-27-2012, 03:14 PM
I used to be in different to Hamons, mostly because I never really saw anything I liked then I began to see some pieces that caught my eye. I guess hamons are like women, you got to look at a lot of them until you find the one that tickles your fancy.http://www.fototime.com/0970C8419FA7A91/orig.jpg

Eamon Burke
05-27-2012, 05:32 PM
I never really get into Hamons on kitchen knives, because the patina often covers it up.

But the big appeal of it is that it visually breaks up what is otherwise a uniform flat plane. If a uniform flat plane were visually captivating, there'd be art galleries full of blank canvases.

Mike Davis
05-27-2012, 06:37 PM
A hamon displays not only the makers patience, but his ability as well. Hamon's, when developed properly, are one of the most beautiful things in all of blade making. They display the skill levels of a maker, and as a maker, they are sometimes a pain. There is a lot of polishing involved in creating one. I personally love them.

tk59
05-27-2012, 07:04 PM
Yeah. Some of those Wheeler hamons are pretty freaking cool.

ajhuff
05-27-2012, 07:37 PM
Very interesting. They look unfinished to me but beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

-AJ

Lucretia
05-27-2012, 09:10 PM
I used to be in different to Hamons, mostly because I never really saw anything I liked then I began to see some pieces that caught my eye. I guess hamons are like women, you got to look at a lot of them until you find the one that tickles your fancy.http://www.fototime.com/0970C8419FA7A91/orig.jpg

Wow. There is nothing about that knife that I don't like.

DevinT
05-27-2012, 09:43 PM
Two words, Don Hanson.

Hoss

sachem allison
05-27-2012, 09:48 PM
Two words, Don Hanson.

Hoss

+1 I have always loved his Bowies, too bad I don't have the funds to collect bowies anymore.

Lucretia
05-27-2012, 09:49 PM
Two words, Don Hanson.

Hoss

:bigeek:

So little time and money. So many knives...sigh.

Mike Davis
05-27-2012, 09:50 PM
Don is beyond amazing. Without a doubt one of the best in the biz...Good call Hoss!!!

Marko Tsourkan
05-27-2012, 10:02 PM
I like hamon as it falls into a category of unknowns, like B&W photography and other things, where do you don't quite know what it will look like until you see it.

I haven't experimented much with hamon, but did get a wavy pattern often seen on a honyaki knives. Been thinking about doing some more, this thread makes me want to give it another try.

M

JohnnyChance
05-27-2012, 10:25 PM
+1

but after a while though, won't the patina mask the hamon and it becomes a faint memory?

Not always.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-6P4kB7E56Fk/Tzi_03pEvxI/AAAAAAAABX0/iZKP2sGVpus/s1024/IMG_1465.JPG

kalaeb
05-27-2012, 11:47 PM
Hmmm, that patina on that MR is comming along very nice.

JohnnyChance
05-27-2012, 11:55 PM
It helps that it sees proteins almost exclusively.

Mike Davis
05-28-2012, 03:52 AM
The hamon will react differently on the hardened area of the blade as it will on the sifter steel. It is basically a really slow etch that causes patinas. It will not "hide" the patina, but it will be a different look than that of a fresh, highly polished on a blade with hamon.

Salty dog
05-28-2012, 05:30 AM
Because of the tradition of Samurai and their swords.

kazeryu
05-28-2012, 02:33 PM
They are pretty.

Burl Source
05-29-2012, 10:03 PM
Here is a video of a hamon on a Japanese sword being made.

http://youtu.be/o_voOugYgag

SpikeC
05-30-2012, 04:11 PM
So how does he get the Hamon without clay?

Messy Jesse
06-04-2012, 09:58 PM
Hamons are pretty badass... hard to deny that.

ajhuff
06-04-2012, 10:48 PM
So how does he get the Hamon without clay?

During the water quench the edge chills faster than the back of the blade.

-AJ

ajhuff
06-10-2012, 06:37 PM
Soooo.... I am gathering that hamons and differential heat treating are intimately related. I can see no valid purpose for differentially heat treating a kitchen knife. Seems like it is more in the category of neat trick.

-AJ

sachem allison
06-10-2012, 07:02 PM
Soooo.... I am gathering that hamons and differential heat treating are intimately related. I can see no valid purpose for differentially heat treating a kitchen knife. Seems like it is more in the category of neat trick.

-AJ

Remember most of these guys came from a long line of sword makers, when the Samurai were banned there were thousands of unemployed sword makers and nothing for them to do with there skills. Kitchen knives were made by the village blacksmith and were rudimentary at best. Making farming implements and kitchen knives was looked at as beneath them, consequently they began to starve. Someone swallowed his pride and set up shop and started making knives using the techniques he used to make swords, because that is the only way he knew how to do it. He made better kitchen knives then anyone else and people started to come from all over to get the knives with the Hamon, because that was a sign of quality, That's how you knew you got the real deal and the knife was made properly. I mean didn't this guy make swords for the Shogun or something, he must make the best knives. I think it probably started like that and then stayed on as a traditional sign of quality more than anything else. It is done that way, because it has been done that way for 17 generations or more. Not so much a trick, but marketing, it serves a real purpose.

ajhuff
06-10-2012, 08:30 PM
I get that. But seems rather archaic now.

-AJ

sachem allison
06-10-2012, 08:42 PM
yep

GlassEye
06-10-2012, 09:04 PM
I get that. But seems rather archaic now.

-AJ

One could say the same about making any knife without the use of robots in a factory. Or steel that can rust or discolor. Or sharpening by hand on natural stones. Or using wood to make handles or cutting boards in the age of anti-microbial super plastics. Most of what we discuss on this forum might seem archaic by modern standards.

ajhuff
06-10-2012, 09:10 PM
Yeah, but that's not my point. What benefit does differential heat treating serve in a kitchen knife? I can't think of any. But it seems a lot of people here are willing pay extra for it.

-AJ

JasonD
06-10-2012, 10:49 PM
I always thought the idea was that you can get a harder usable edge if you have a soft spine to absorb some of the stress of use? So perhaps you could have a 65 HRC edge rather than a 63 HRC blade without the differential temper.

ajhuff
06-10-2012, 11:31 PM
I can't think of any action in the kitchen where you would need ductility in the spine of the knife. A sword, yes, a kitchen knife, no. Well except for maybe opening cans of olive oil. My Chef uses the back of a knife for that. :)

-AJ

SpikeC
06-11-2012, 01:50 PM
How about breaking down a big ass tuna?

ajhuff
06-11-2012, 02:03 PM
How about breaking down a big ass tuna?

I don't know, why?

-AJ

SpikeC
06-11-2012, 06:07 PM
The deep cuts seem to make the blades flex from some of the vids that I have seen. A flexible back coupled with a razor like edge would seem to be advantageous. The place where differential hardening would be helpful is when a goodly amount of force needs to be applied.

vai777
06-15-2012, 05:00 PM
doesn't get much better than a nice hamon... http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/8122/74095162186230142374122.jpg