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View Full Version : New Konosuke HD Gyuto--Wa Handle separating from ferrule



Andy
06-02-2012, 12:57 AM
Greetings everyone. This is my first post and it's a question. I've had a Konosuke HD 270 gyuto (ebony wa handle) from CKTG for ~ 2 weeks. Have used it three times, moisture has not touched the handle. The handle has begun separating from the ferrule in two places. I have digital photos but for some reason it says I don't have permission to post attachments. Do any of you have suggestions for what to do about this? It's a $296 knife. Mark at CKTG doesn't want to replace it; he wants to refund it...which will leave me without the knife I want.

apicius9
06-02-2012, 01:04 AM
Hi Andy, welcome! I think you just need a few more posts before you can add pictures (that's a protection against spammers).

As for the handle, pictures would be nice. Besides returning it, it might be possible to close the opening gaps with epoxy or superglue, or by immersing the handle in mineral oil for a few says so that the wood expands a little bit and closes the gap. Will depend on the size and position of the gap. The wood should not shrink, but as a natural material, it can happen, especially if you are in a different climate zone.

Stefan

chinacats
06-02-2012, 01:04 AM
Welcome! IMHO I would let him refund your money and then buy from someone here...any reason you want the knife that bad? Many other options available though the Kono's are nice...I am sure you will get good advice here either way. Good luck!

unkajonet
06-02-2012, 01:04 AM
If he wants to refund rather than replace, I would think that there may have been a bad batch of kons that escaped from the factory. Get the refund.

Vertigo
06-02-2012, 01:08 AM
If he wants to refund rather than replace, I would think that there may have been a bad batch of kons that escaped from the factory. Get the refund.

I seem to recall someone else mentioning poor F&F on their new Kono recently too. Definitely sounds like a blooper batch might have escaped.

To the OP, I'd go with the refund as well... but if you're dead set on it, like Stefan said a little epoxy or mineral oil might do you just fine. Alternatively, you could also have it rehandled, which will make the fancy knife you like even more fancy!

add
06-02-2012, 01:08 AM
Welcome !

Did you ask him why he would not replace it? :scratchhead:

Well, yeah then.

Either return it, keep it and eat the cost of a steller re-handle by some great craftsmen around here ($ 150 +), or some type of DIY fix (pics would certainly help)...

NO ChoP!
06-02-2012, 01:12 AM
I'm guessing he doesn't have an ebony handle available for replacement. I think he only gets a few at a crack...maybe it would take some time.

labor of love
06-02-2012, 01:14 AM
get your refund. then order it again! they dont stay in stock too long either. i love the hd steel personally but the ebony handle was a bit heavy for me.

Johnny.B.Good
06-02-2012, 01:15 AM
Welcome to the forum!

I'd take the refund and reconsider your options if it were me. I have seen your knife (including the ebony handle) in the B/S/T section here from time to time, but you have to be on the forum all the time and ready to act fast! I'm sure Mark will get another shipment soon enough too.

As Vertigo suggests, if you really love the blade (and want to spend some more money), there are some excellent handle makers here.

NO ChoP!
06-02-2012, 01:16 AM
I know the old double horn HD handles were much nicer than these newer "stabilized" handles of late. They have zero taper and aren't sanded very smooth or even... one can only wonder.

labor of love
06-02-2012, 01:28 AM
I know the old double horn HD handles were much nicer than these newer "stabilized" handles of late. They have zero taper and aren't sanded very smooth or even... one can only wonder.
yeah he stocks the cheap handles I guess. Konosuke has a bunch of better handles to choose from. My next HD will have a yew or cherry handle.

Andy
06-02-2012, 08:44 AM
Thank you all for your replies. I bought one other knife from Mark, a Kanehiro Gyuto. The handle had 3 or 4 deep scratches on the handle. I emailed him about it, ended up keeping it and sanding the handle. His response to my request for him to replace my 2nd purchase, the Kon HD was "Send it back and I'll give you a full refund. Since we're 0 for 2 lets not try again." I was quite puzzled by that reply. I'm new to Japanese knives and had seen the Kono HD so highly recommended on the forums that I wanted to try it. Still can't attach pics.

Andy
06-02-2012, 08:54 AM
Hi Andy, welcome! I think you just need a few more posts before you can add pictures (that's a protection against spammers).

As for the handle, pictures would be nice. Besides returning it, it might be possible to close the opening gaps with epoxy or superglue, or by immersing the handle in mineral oil for a few says so that the wood expands a little bit and closes the gap. Will depend on the size and position of the gap. The wood should not shrink, but as a natural material, it can happen, especially if you are in a different climate zone.

Stefan

Thanks Stefan. The gaps appeared between the hanlde and the ferrule and the glue appears to be a lighter brown color than the dark gray glue that holds the knife in the handle. I live in Raleigh, NC. Climate here is temperant but can be humid. However, I keep my house air conditioned my hygrometer tells me the humidity in my house is 45%.

It was already an upgrade to get the ebony handle. What kind of epoxy? Would you oil first, then epoxy or vice versa?

Many thanks...

NO ChoP!
06-02-2012, 09:50 AM
Andy, I'd urge you to take the money and run. I wouldn't trust myself to do these repairs, maybe your more handy. And once you take the glue to it, it yours to keep.

My suggested solution. Take the money; post a WTB kono 270 HD thread, I'd bet you'd find one quickly. Send it off to Mhenry or Stefan for a rehandle. You'd probably come out with a kick a$$ rehandled Kono for not much more $$, just need a little patience...

Gravy Power
06-02-2012, 10:06 AM
Still can't attach pics.

I initially could, then had a problem with it. Best solution IMO is to create a photobucket account, upload them there, then click the little picture frame when replying and paste the direct link...

Dave Martell
06-02-2012, 11:33 AM
Still can't attach pics.


http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/64-Image-File-Uploading?p=16023&viewfull=1#post16023

Eamon Burke
06-02-2012, 11:36 AM
I think it's better to have a refund than a return, no? Then you get two knives for the price of one?

I think Mark just knows that it's defective and doesn't want to sell it to someone else--just wants to give you your money back, and let you get the knife you want.

Or hell, buy a less expensive knife and get that one re-handled with the difference. Then everyone's happy and the world is less one defective handle.

Andy
06-02-2012, 12:27 PM
OK...Here's a first attempt to share images via Photobucket.

http://i1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg597/AndyG24/IMG_0596.jpg

http://i1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg597/AndyG24/IMG_0591.jpg

Andy
06-02-2012, 12:29 PM
Thank you all very much for the good feedback. Am looking forward to learning and sharing on this forum. I've always loved knives and loved sharpening them so this is good place to be.

Dave Martell
06-02-2012, 12:33 PM
Hi Andy, I understand where you're coming from however this type of separation of horn to wood isn't something that's uncommon with this style of handle construction. IMO if you stick with Japanese knives you will likely run into this same type of thing again and maybe even worse. I'm not excusing it but I am saying it's not what most of us would see as bad or out of the norm.

Eamon Burke
06-02-2012, 12:35 PM
Yeah, that's not a big deal at all. I wouldn't expect a knife made from natural materials like that to be 100% free of anything like that unless I paid a LOT of money for it.

If it really bugs you, I'd say either seal it if you are handy, or get it rehandled if not.

Andy
06-02-2012, 12:50 PM
Thanks Dave. That's good to know. As I said, I'm new to the world of Japanese knives. I love the metal. My initial take is: If Japanese knives were cars, then when I buy a new car (new knife), I should plan on it having scratches, perhaps a flat tire or a bent fender, and plan on repairing the defects myself. I'm not saying this to be sarcastic, am just trying to understand what level I need to recalibrate my expectations as a customer because I've not run into this with western or German knives.

Dave Martell
06-02-2012, 01:19 PM
.....am just trying to understand what level I need to recalibrate my expectations as a customer because I've not run into this with western or German knives.


Yeah that's something we all wrestle with at first.

Eamon Burke
06-02-2012, 01:26 PM
It's really that with western knives, people prefer to pay for better fit and finish and get a less-than-mind-blowing blade, and Japanese knives are the other way around.

You can get a western knife with an excellent blade to go with the high standard of handle fit and finish, or a Japanese knife with a flawless handle and fit-up to go with the excellent blade. Both will cost you at LEAST $500.

The reason is, it takes time, materials, and skill to do all of those things. Try to get some factory like Chicago Cutlery to make a blade comparable to the Konosuke HD. I think the conversation alone would be laughable.

GlassEye
06-02-2012, 01:36 PM
That doesn't look bad at all, just fill it in if you want to.

If you want to use the car analogy: I think, usually, the Japanese knife is more like a racing car than an average factory made car. It performs far better than most others, looks good enough from the outside, but has no interior and requires more from the driver in skill and care. You can get race performance, high-end materials, looks and fit/finish, but you may have to pay for the Ferrari or custom made knife. The standard factory made knives/cars will get the job done if maintained or even abused, for a reasonable cost but you aren't paying for performance.

NO ChoP!
06-02-2012, 01:47 PM
Just use it a few times and those will get filled with food residue. lol

99Limited
06-02-2012, 10:20 PM
I looked at those two pictures and thought, "Ok, he can now post pictures. Let's see the pictures with the problems." What you see as a problem, wouldn't even be a blip on my radar screen.

ThEoRy
06-02-2012, 11:12 PM
It's fine man.

SpikeC
06-02-2012, 11:29 PM
Did Mark see these pictures?

kalaeb
06-02-2012, 11:30 PM
Definately no issues on that one. I have paid twice that and have had much larger issues. If it really bothers you fill it with some super glue. That knife will present no issues for you. That is a Harley with an oil leak...kind of expected.

bieniek
06-03-2012, 06:23 AM
Where is the problem exactly? I cant see it.

apicius9
06-03-2012, 11:14 PM
Hi Andy, I agree with what has been said - that's not something to worry about. You can seal that with a fee drops of superglue or epoxy, or even some melted bees' wax although that may not be as permanent as epoxy but it's natural and food safe. When you first posted, I thought the ferrule had separated from the wood on the length side of the handle.

Stefan

ecchef
06-04-2012, 12:08 AM
Another thing to consider is the climate. The humdity in Japan is generally higher than in the US, so a ferrule that fits nice & tight in Sakai City may loosen up in the States. Happened to a couple of mine. They tighten up again when I use them regularly.

Eamon Burke
06-04-2012, 11:21 AM
I'm curious, Andy. How are you feeling about this? Does it make you feel better about the knife? Worse about Japanese knives in general? You still want a new knife?

I mean, I'm in the boat with everyone else, I think it looks just fine to me, I wouldn't even bother filling it. But I realize that it's probably a little strange to be unhappy enough with something to want a refund, and then have everyone tell you that you are the only one.

Vertigo
06-04-2012, 01:36 PM
The first couple knives I bought (that weren't made entirely by automated laser-wielding German robots) had "defects" like that, and I thought I'd been ripped off. Just comes with the territory I think, you get used to a certain level of fit and finish and anything less is unacceptable. Once it dawned on me that these things are predominately made by hand, it kinda excused minor defects like those shown in the picture. At this point I doubt I would have even seen it.