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View Full Version : How much flex acceptable in a laser?



Eamon Burke
06-05-2012, 01:26 PM
So for you laser lovers out there, how much flex do you find acceptable in a laser?

Is the goal to keep it from flexing as much as possible and still be thin?

Is the flex something you just adjust to?

I'm actually not much a laser-guy myself, and I'm just trying to see how thin is too thin.

Assume it is not laser-thin at the base, a forged knife.

Lefty
06-05-2012, 02:57 PM
A bit of flex doesn't bother me, since I cut up and down, with a bit of push or draw and don't really torque the knife when doing so. I've used somewhat flexy and incredibly stiff knives and I find the stiffer blades make you think they're better quality, but without any flex, I often find they can feel a bit unnatural.

EdipisReks
06-05-2012, 02:59 PM
i prefer stiffer knives. it's not something that is an issue in actual use, for the same reasons that Lefty gave, but i find flexible knives are harder to sharpen, and i like easy.

tk59
06-05-2012, 03:54 PM
I'd say that stiffer is better as long as you're not sacrificing too much cutting performance. The only times I find myself wishing a knife was thicker are when I'm going to put a lot of pressure on the spine of a blade, popping a something out of a fruit or root veggie or when I'm peeling something with a very tough rind, etc. I really don't like it when I can feel the blade flex at the choil. Tip flex is okay, for the most part.

Mingooch
06-06-2012, 12:31 AM
Stiffer is better in a laser. Too much flex and it is too annoying to sharpen to a level that I like.

sw2geeks
06-06-2012, 01:32 AM
My #1 chukabocho is razor thin with good flex when smashing garlic, but is a laser on the cutting board.

Mucho Bocho
06-06-2012, 08:59 AM
I'll chime in cause the Yusuke I have is probably the thinnest blade of all coming in a 1.3mm at the handle. Its so thin that when washing/polishing you can feel the knife contour to your fingers when wiping length wise. That being said, it really not a problem as I mostly draw cut with it but even push cutting is not a problem unless cutting something hard. Plus being so thin, very little effort is needed to complete the cut especially when your blade is perpendicular to the board. Honestly, my Kono 240 HD Kiri feels totally stiff compared.

NO ChoP!
06-06-2012, 11:25 AM
Good question....
I also had the aforementioned yusuke. I thought I was a laser fan, being I love my HDs. But I found the Yuke to feel real flimsy when doing any type of rocking. It had no real benefit over the traditional laser, so I dumped it....

Mucho Bocho
06-06-2012, 11:54 AM
Agreed. I don't think I've ever rock chopped with it, but thats not my cutting style so that isn't an issue

Justin0505
06-06-2012, 12:01 PM
Maybe i just havent used enough/the right lasers, but I never found ultra-thin blades to cut noticably better than a well-ground medium-thin blade. Even if i could get used to flex, I never saw tbe purpose.

keithsaltydog
06-07-2012, 04:51 AM
Yeh most of my cuts are forward push or chop cuts,almost never rock a gyuto.I like em thin for most prep jobs,it's my experience that thin blades glide through food better speeding up prep time.

vai777
06-15-2012, 05:12 PM
it should really have ZERO flex...

rhygin
06-16-2012, 05:39 AM
Umm. Embarrassed to be the voice of disagreement. Really just my own opinion, but the Tad is worlds apart from other gyutos, but it's absolutely one of the favorites (mine is white steel, but I think it's comparable to the stainless version that is more common). I definitely won't say other people are wrong, but in my experience, I haven't tackled anything where the flex has become an issue.

I guess there is some limit to acceptable flexibility, but I haven't hit it yet (which isn't to say that thicker knives are inferior).

chinacats
06-16-2012, 10:07 AM
Isn't the flex more a function of how you use the knife? Seems as if the knife will only 'flex' if you don't cut straight? Really just asking as I am in the market for a light (laser) gyuto myself and figured that any ultralight knife will flex just like the old filet knives, and as with those, if you make straight, clean cuts then there is no issue.

JohnnyChance
06-16-2012, 01:52 PM
What is the advantage to flex then? If you could grind a knife that is a laser without much/any flex, why would you continue grinding until it did flex?

Flex comes from starting with thin stock, so that you dont have to spend a lot of time grinding to get as thin as desired therefore saving money. It is just cheaper production wise. Some may claim there is no disadvantage to having a gyuto with flex, but there is no advantage either, so why have it if you can avoid it? I prefer stiffer knives and feel they are better than flexy knives, so I do see a disadvantage in flexible gyutos.

chinacats
06-16-2012, 05:56 PM
So which of the current ultralights have the most/least flex? I really think it is more difficult to sharpen a flexible knife, but hadn't considered so much the consequences of using one--used to think the other way around. Would either the Konosuke and Gesshin Ginga (white steel versions) be considered overly flexible, or one much more so than the other?

Thanks

GlassEye
06-16-2012, 06:00 PM
So which of the current ultralights have the most/least flex? I really think it is more difficult to sharpen a flexible knife, but hadn't considered so much the consequences of using one--used to think the other way around. Would either the Konosuke and Gesshin Ginga (white steel versions) be considered overly flexible, or one much more so than the other?

Thanks

I haven't really noticed any flex in my Gesshin Ginga; I have not tried to test the flex, but in use and sharpening it is not really noticeable.

tk59
06-16-2012, 06:03 PM
None of the Ashi/IT/Suisin types are difficult to sharpen, in the least due to flexibility.

For the record, EVERY knife flexes. The question is how much and if you feel it while you work with it.

chinacats
06-16-2012, 06:20 PM
I haven't really noticed any flex in my Gesshin Ginga; I have not tried to test the flex, but in use and sharpening it is not really noticeable.

Thanks, this (GG) is actually the knife I plan on purchasing once the 240's are back in stock, though it does seem like a lot of people really like their Konosuke's.


None of the Ashi/IT/Suisin types are difficult to sharpen, in the least due to flexibility.

For the record, EVERY knife flexes. The question is how much and if you feel it while you work with it.

Yes sir, hadn't really thought about it, but just went into the kitchen and even my big old Sab nogent and large cleaver will flex nicely near the tip.

SpikeC
06-16-2012, 06:35 PM
If flex is a problem when sharpening the technique might need a look at. Brute force is not always the best approach.......

chinacats
06-16-2012, 07:04 PM
If flex is a problem when sharpening the technique might need a look at. Brute force is not always the best approach.......

My technique is always something along the lines of suspect :O It has been many years since I've tried to sharpen an old/cheap super flexible filet knife and that was on a small/crappy oilstone, hopefully the technique is slightly improved since those days and quality of stones has definitely improved tremendously.

JohnnyChance
06-16-2012, 10:23 PM
None of the Ashi/IT/Suisin types are difficult to sharpen, in the least due to flexibility.

For the record, EVERY knife flexes. The question is how much and if you feel it while you work with it.

All people are flexible, doesn't make us all yoga masters.

tk59
06-16-2012, 10:38 PM
All people are flexible, doesn't make us all yoga masters.Uh, sure... :scratchhead:

Benuser
06-17-2012, 05:43 PM
My technique is always something along the lines of suspect :O It has been many years since I've tried to sharpen an old/cheap super flexible filet knife and that was on a small/crappy oilstone, hopefully the technique is slightly improved since those days and quality of stones has definitely improved tremendously.
I couldn't agree more. Flexible blades I haited a few years ago don't bother me
now anymore. That being said, the best sharpening result are still with stiffer blades. I'm not happy with blades that offer more flex than a Misono Swedish Carbon.

tk59
06-17-2012, 09:13 PM
...I'm not happy with blades that offer more flex than a Misono Swedish Carbon.I don't know too many gyutos that are significantly more flexible with regard to sharpening than the Misono carbon. What blades are you refering to?

Benuser
06-17-2012, 09:40 PM
I don't know too many gyutos that are significantly more flexible with regard to sharpening than the Misono carbon. What blades are you refering to?
Sorry, I didn't specificly referred to gyutos. To me it's just the max in flex. If you deal with e.g. filet blades with less height the flex makes the sharpening uncertain.