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Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 12:25 AM
Hello to everyone on this forums,

I am just starting to cook, I have only been cooking for maybe 2 months, my name is Julian Nell as you can see on my profile, I am 13 years old, I am not sure I will be posting alot because I am mostly here to learn I might post some pictures of the food that I make.

Julian

Lucretia
07-07-2012, 12:28 AM
Welcome Julian!

cookinstuff
07-07-2012, 12:32 AM
Welcome Julian, glad to see young people interested in cooking.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 12:40 AM
Thank you for being so welcome.

Julian

Johnny.B.Good
07-07-2012, 12:45 AM
Welcome to the forum Julian!

What is your favorite dish to make?

GlassEye
07-07-2012, 12:52 AM
Welcome Julian.

SpikeC
07-07-2012, 12:57 AM
Welcome to the Knut House, Julian!

Crothcipt
07-07-2012, 01:02 AM
welcome.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 01:09 AM
Thanks everyone.

Right now my favorite dish to make is either shrimp stir fry or baked garlic salmon on rice.

Julian

tk59
07-07-2012, 01:13 AM
Sounds good. I'm looking forward to seeing pics of your dishes. What are you cutting with? :)

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 01:19 AM
I am cutting with a dull knife that my parents bought many years ago.

I am not sure when I will be able to get a new knife, but when I do I am looking at a MAC chef's knife,

or maybe something else, like a Tojiro, but I am making do with what I have.

Julian

tk59
07-07-2012, 01:21 AM
How dull is dull? Do you have anything to sharpen with?

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 01:27 AM
Well I can dice an onion fairly well, it doesn't go threw pepper skin with one slice, when I tried to chop a tomatoe it squished, and cutting steak is far from enjoyable.

Julian

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 01:30 AM
I have a rod that I am using right now, I am really not sure if it is a good one and I don't have the money for any stones so no good sharpening.

Julian

tk59
07-07-2012, 01:43 AM
Is the rod metal or ceramic and does it feel pretty smooth or rough?

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 01:48 AM
The rod is metal, I can't remember at the moment but I believe that it is slightly rough.

Julian

kalaeb
07-07-2012, 01:49 AM
Welcome!

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 01:54 AM
Thanks.

Julian

PierreRodrigue
07-07-2012, 01:55 AM
Welcome to the forum! It is cool to see youth into food and knives!

tk59
07-07-2012, 01:59 AM
The rod is metal, I can't remember at the moment but I believe that it is slightly rough.

Julian

Hmm. Sounds like you should take the knife to a nice smooth section of sidewalk and then the back of a ceramic mug. Got a pic of the knife that shows the edge well?

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 02:39 AM
Sorry no photos of the knife right now and it is going to be a few days.

But I am not sure if it is something I really want to spend time trying to fix because I think it is a pretty thick blade.

Thank you very much for the advice, I might give it a try but I think it would be better to get a new knife.

Julian

chinacats
07-07-2012, 03:59 AM
Welcome! You can find a nice knife without spending a lot of money...hang out and enjoy!

Eamon Burke
07-07-2012, 12:12 PM
:ntmy:
Welcome!

Pictures of anything--food and/or knives are ALWAYS welcome.

El Pescador
07-07-2012, 12:20 PM
Welcome to the knut house.

K-Fed
07-07-2012, 12:49 PM
Welcome and awesome to see younger people cooking. I started when I was 8 and never looked back.

Deckhand
07-07-2012, 01:02 PM
Welcome! Best of luck to you on your cooking.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 01:45 PM
Thank you for the welcome everyone.

Julian

sachem allison
07-07-2012, 04:00 PM
welcome, send me your address and I will send you a knife to start your journey with.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 04:23 PM
Thank you very much for the offer, but I couldn't accept it.

Julian

JBroida
07-07-2012, 04:34 PM
welcome, send me your address and I will send you a knife to start your journey with.

son... that doesnt sound sketchy at all :happy3:

Pensacola Tiger
07-07-2012, 04:50 PM
I have a rod that I am using right now, I am really not sure if it is a good one and I don't have the money for any stones so no good sharpening.

Julian

Go to an auto parts store and get some sheets of wet/dry sandpaper, 60 grit, 400 grit and 1000 grit. Then get a 12" square ceramic floor tile with a smooth surface from Lowe's or Home Depot. Wet the back of the sandpaper so it will cling to the tile and use edge trailing strokes to sharpen your kitchen knife. Yeah, it's crude, but it will work and it won't cost more than $10.

Oh, and welcome to the forums!

Rick

The Edge
07-07-2012, 04:56 PM
Welcome to the forum Julian!

Deckhand
07-07-2012, 04:56 PM
Son tries to help new chefs as he was helped. Nothing sketchy he has given many people knives, but being brand new here I can see how Julian could react that way.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 05:00 PM
It's nothing about being worried about him sending weird stuff to my house, I just don't feel right accepting someone else's knife that they paid for.

Julian

sachem allison
07-07-2012, 05:32 PM
It's okay, Julian I didn't think about that, I apologize if that came off wierd. As, for cost of me buying a knife, that isn't a worry. I have dozens of knives, specifically for giving away. I have been collecting for 20+years and knives come in and out of my hands all of the time. If you ever change your mind, with your parents permission the offer still stands.

sachem allison
07-07-2012, 05:32 PM
son... that doesnt sound sketchy at all :happy3:

never crossed my mind.

JBroida
07-07-2012, 05:40 PM
never crossed my mind.

its cause you're too nice of a guy ;)

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 05:48 PM
Thank you very much, if you have ones that are for giving away I will think about it.

Julian

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 05:54 PM
Out of curiosity , what brands of knives do you have to give away? are they expensive knives or more like a Henkles because if it's something like a Henkles I could buy a new one and if it was something over a hundred dollars I couldn't accept it

Jim
07-07-2012, 06:00 PM
Julian, welcome to the KKF. Where are you located in the world? Looking forward to seeing some of your food pictures.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 06:02 PM
I am in Kansas City

Julian

Justin0505
07-07-2012, 06:22 PM
Hey Julian, welcome to the forum.

I also started cooking and getting interested in better kitchen knives when my family didn't have good knives and I didn't have a job or a way to afford good knives of my own. We didn't have a lot of money, so when my mom finally spent $20 on a small chef's knife, it was the best kitchen knife that I had ever used. It had a simple, thick grind and poor edge retention, but it served me well for many, many years (and it's still around).

Look around at some of the threads that talk about "thinning behind the edge" and restoring old knives. With a little effort and practice, you can make even a cheap, simple knife perform pretty darn well. The nice thing about cheaper, softer steel is that that it's much easier to abrade and shape and you're less likely to chip or seriously damage a more expensive knife made out of thin, hard steel.

The fancy water-stones that people talk about on here are also most useful for very hard, high quality steels, and actually might not work as well on softer steels. What would probably be best on your knife is what people call a "toothy edge" which is created quickly using pretty rough abrasives.
Have you seen any of Eamon's videos? They are a great place to start, but even some of the hard-core geeks on here still find stuff in them to learn from:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqsbO1w8rXE

One more thing about cheap knives when you're first starting out is that they get dull faster so you have to sharpen more, so you get more practice!

Here are a couple videos that show what can be done with free, readily available things like a cinder block or cement step or a section of curb, a brick, cardboard, and an old belt.

http://youtu.be/CXLaE1JvQ94

http://youtu.be/wSzq45W0LTk

Because this is kitchenKNIFEforums, a huge emphasis gets placed on having awesome, really high performance knives. However, you can learn all of the most important things that you need to from simple, cheap, and even free tools. Being able to get good results with a cheap knife all by yourself will put you far ahead of someone who just went out and bought a new knife and then had it professionally sharpened.

By the time you get your first really nice knife, you will already be a bad-ass and the coolest kid on the forums:pirate1::cool:

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 06:52 PM
Thanks for the help.

But am understanding right that it is an old pants belt to scharpen with?

Julian

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 07:51 PM
I just sharpened my knife on a cinder block and it seems to have helped alot, I will do it a few more times until it is nice and sharp. Thanks for the idea.

Julian

SpikeC
07-07-2012, 07:58 PM
Very cool, Julian! There are a lot of threads about cooking here besides knives too, you know!

Crothcipt
07-07-2012, 08:00 PM
I miss K.C. spent about 10 years there.

After you use the cinder block take it to the belt strap and you will notice a difference to the edge too. Just make sure you don't "roll over" the knife like you see in old movies with barbers stropping the razor. You came to a great place to learn. Can't wait to see some food pics.

Btw Chef Son (sachem allison) loves giving good knives to new starting off cooks, just so they can learn what it's like to have something that will cut very well.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 08:20 PM
So should I strap the belt to a chair and pull it straight to scharpen with it?

P.S. I am recovering from miner surgery right now so there won't be any food pics for maybe a week or when I feel up to cooking.

Julian

Crothcipt
07-07-2012, 08:30 PM
putting it on something flat would be best. It is recommended that you glue it to a board or block of wood. But for now just something flat would be good.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 08:42 PM
Okay thanks for the help.

Julian

The hekler
07-07-2012, 09:03 PM
Welcome to the forum, I wish I got started so young. As for Son he is a great guy that loves giving his stuff away, I don't know what he has planned but he has given many vintage German and American knives to many here that don't have as much need as you. I myself recieved a hippo tooth from him and look foward to the day that I can use it for something and post pictures of the result in my way of thanks. Glad your well on your journey keep it up, try to let us know how your doing as I'm sure many here get a kick out of watching the younger generation learn the trade.

Candlejack
07-07-2012, 09:32 PM
Oh god, carter with a pony-tail



Welcome julian, in response to the belt-question: That's called stropping. It's done to remove the burr and polish the blade, it's not an effective means to sharpen. You can put abrasives on it to remove more metal, but it won't be coarse enough to be an effective sharpener, it's a finishing move.

Candlejack
07-07-2012, 09:37 PM
Out of curiosity , what brands of knives do you have to give away? are they expensive knives or more like a Henkles because if it's something like a Henkles I could buy a new one and if it was something over a hundred dollars I couldn't accept it

Son has alot of vintage knives that are really old - many have a history, i suggest you ask him about the history of the knife you're getting, he has alot of very interesting stories.
Son is a great guy with a big heart, and the knives he gives away are great. They're not new, but that's not a bad thing. Blades from the old days are of very high quality and often underestimated.


You should take him up on his offer, and then, when you're older, you should remember this and help out the other guys starting in the business. This place is full of great people.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 10:08 PM
Okay I think I am convinced about accepting a knife, but what would you recommend I do for sharpening, I don't think I want to rub it on a cinder block.

Julian

Candlejack
07-07-2012, 10:13 PM
Okay I think I am convinced about accepting a knife, but what would you recommend I do for sharpening, I don't think I want to rub it on a cinder block.

Julian

I'm sure Son will sharpen it up before sending it to you, and after that you can keep it sharp using a leather-strop (a piece of leather on a flat surface, you can use an old belt. Just make sure it's plain leather.)
You can even strop on cardboard, with our without any abrasive paste.

If you're thinking of a stone, you should look at combination stones like a 1k/6k or a 1k/5k
King has cheap and decent stones.
Or use the bottom of a ceramic cup or plate (the unglazed, rough part)



If you're not comfortable with this, i'm sure one of the guys here would help you out.. and think of it like this, you're helping them feed their addiction. Many here use sharpening as meditation.
And you'll get a screamingly good edge.
Perhaps there's even a guy in kansas who could teach you sharpen it

JBroida
07-07-2012, 10:14 PM
king 1000... only $30 and more than enough to get you started

SpikeC
07-07-2012, 10:21 PM
For stropping the best way is just to use newspaper on a hard flat surface. Some of the best sharpeners in the world do this, and it is fairly inexpensive.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 10:30 PM
Okay thanks.

Julian

Crothcipt
07-07-2012, 10:34 PM
Even a phone book works well too.

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 10:39 PM
There are alot of options.

Julian

gamblerS4
07-07-2012, 11:08 PM
Hey Julian, welcome!

Julian Nell
07-07-2012, 11:37 PM
Thanks.

Julian

sachem allison
07-08-2012, 01:08 AM
Julian, if you are interested I have a 10 in carbon steel Forgecraft chef knife I can send you. It was made 60 years ago and is one of the finest American made chef knives of that era. It can get wicked sharp and is very easy to maintain the edge. If you take care of it it will last you another 60 years. It is carbon steel and will rust if you don't wipe it off after each use. It is a knife that will teach you how to use it and teach you how to take care of your gear. never put your knives in the dish machine, never leave it dirty on the counter and never leave it in the sink. I will give it to you with only one condition. In the future if you find somebody else in a similar situation and you are able to help them out, do so and pass on that tradition.

Keith Neal
07-08-2012, 10:41 AM
Julian, welcome to the forum. This is the place to start if you want to learn about kitchen knives. We are always happy to see younger folks looking for knowledge.

Send me an address via private message (PM) and I will get a King 1000 stone off to you. Like Son, I want to help you get off on the right foot.

I suggest you practice sharpening your least favorite knives at first, until you get a feel for the angle and technique.

Keith

markenki
07-08-2012, 01:28 PM
Welcome, Julian! Enjoy the journey.

Julian Nell
07-08-2012, 03:30 PM
Thanks everyone, I have the flu right know so I am going to hold off on getting anything until I am better.

Julian

Justin0505
07-08-2012, 04:24 PM
Hey Julian! Glad you had some success with the cinder block!
All of this knife and sharpening stuff can seem really complicated and confusing but it seems like you're excited and catch on quickly (attitude and mindset is always more important the knowledge and raw skill).

When I first started sharpening, it made it easier for me to think of it as kind of 2 stages.

STAGE 1:
The first stage is actually grinding / removing significant amounts of metal. This is what most people think of when they think "sharpening." If your blade is very dull, chipped, damaged, or too thick, you need to start with something very coarse (like a cinder block) and actually GRIND away and re-shape the metal. When you use a very coarse stone, it makes your work faster, and you can still make an edge that will cut pretty well (as you discovered) but the problem is that the coarse stone will leave deep scratch marks and the edge will be VERY toothy (rough). Also, the edge will have a burr along it's length. A burr is basically some of the old, scratched, ground metal shavings that you have removed from the side of the edge, but have not yet completely broken off. The burr maybe very sharp, but it's also very weak and will bend and flop around as you use the knife and will make the edge feel dull long before it actually is.
SO,
As you move from coarser to finer stones (like going from a cinder block down to brick, and then maybe to some sandpaper or a 1000-2000grit stone) the scratches will get smaller and smaller and burr will as well.
Once you are done with all of the sharpening / grinding on stones, you can remove the last little bit of the burr a few different ways. One method is to lightly drag the edge over / cut into a piece of wood (like you saw Murray Carter do in that video). You can think of it as scraping the last little bit of suck on "dirty" metal shavings off the the edge. You may even see a dark grey line in the wood where it pulled off the burr.


STAGE 2:
This is what you do either AFTER you are all done with stage 1 or if you have a knife that is pretty sharp, but you have used for a little while (maybe 1-3 meals) and you can feel that it's not quite as sharp as it was, so you want to just quickly tune it up without having to get out the stones and actually GRIND away more metal.
This is where you use something like leather (the back of an old belt), cardboard, or newspaper or phone-book paper. These things may seem soft, but they all have microscopic particles in them that will polish metal. Some people used fancy leather with special types of fine abrasives mixed into it's surface. However, in the "free" price-range I find that cardboard works the fastest/best on soft metals.
What you're doing in this stage is called "stropping": you will hold the blade at the same or slightly lower angle as with which you sharpened and drag the blade in the direction of the spine (this is called and edge trailing stroke as opposed to edge leading).
Stropping does a few things:
-it polishes the metal and helps to refine the little teeth along the edge of the blade
-it helps to straighten and realign the edge (as you use a knife, the thing that makes it feel dull is actually the edge getting "rolled over" and bent out of shape, not the metal actually getting worn flat; stropping helps the edge "stand up straight" again and fell sharp.)

What you will find is that if you regularly strop your knife, you can keep the edge well-maintained and go a LOOONG time (months) before the edge actually wears down to the point that stropping no longer works and you need to bust out the stones and go back to stage 1.

You can find tons of videos of sharping and stropping using all kinds of different motions and methods. This may make you wonder (as it did me) "WELL, WHAT THEY HECK IS THE BEST METHOD?" - the simple answer is the "THE ONE THAT WORKS BEST FOR YOU!" every one is different with the way that their bodies move when sharpening and what feels easiest / most comfortable to them. People are also different in what kind of edge they like on their knives (how fine, what angle, how toothy vs polished). So just have fun, experiment, ask questions, read and watch stuff online, but realize that at the end of the day, you just have to figure out what works best for YOU and what YOU like most.


Enjoy the journey and keep us all posted on your progress (and don't forget the gift certificates when you open your first restaurant:D).

Julian Nell
07-09-2012, 10:32 PM
Thank you very much for taking the time to write that, alot of good info.

Julian