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View Full Version : Suien SCC-01 or Sugimoto #30?



454Casull
12-10-2012, 01:11 AM
Looking to use a Chinese cleaver as a general-purpose knife, so it needs to be comfortable and effective for both breaking down carcasses and fine vegetable work. I lean toward stainless steels unless the edge retention of the carbon is significantly better.

Which way do you vote?

JKerr
12-10-2012, 02:55 AM
A little more info will help give informed advice. I personally haven't used either cleaver listed (though I have used Sugimoto's CM steel and use a Sugimoto #6)

Taking the post at face value, I'd say go for the Sugimoto purely from the edge retention point of view. I think you'll be hard pressed to find a carbon cleaver with good edge retention without breaching the $300+ mark, even then I can only think of Moritaka and Takeda for Aogami Super (possibly Mizuno).

Personally though, I would go for the Suien out of those two. As much as I love Sugimoto, I would prefer the full size of the Suien over the Sugimoto #30 and would gladly tolerate lesser edge retention for the larger blade. Of course, this is speculation as I've never used the Suien; it could very well have better edge retention than the Sugimoto, but with my experience, I doubt it.

To probe a bit deeper; is the cleaver for home use or professional? What carcasses are you breaking down? What size knife do you currently use or would feel comfortable using?

For home use, the size of the Sugimoto wouldn't be a problem IMO, if you're prepping sh*tloads, you may well find the extra size/weight on the suien to be advantageous. If it's just chicken carcasses and you're disjointing them, either will do, if you're going through bones of using it for fish or pretty much any other protein I wouldn't use either, I for filleting, trimming, slicing etc, sure, but I would just buy a crappy $15 cleaver from the closest Asian super market in addition for that. If you use a larger knife (240 +) again, I'd suggest the Suien. I found that full size cleavers felt a little clumsy and fatiguing at first, but you pick it up quickly. I tried a CCK 1303 at first (20cm x 9cm) before trying the Sugimoto #6 (22cm x 11cm and about 200g heavier) took me about a month to get use to it, but I wouldn't consider anything smaller now. Since then my sugimoto has been ground down to about 10cm in height and it feels so light (Around 390g last time I weighed it) and it's no where near as pleasant as it was to use at first...still my favorite knife though.

Hope this helps a little. With any luck someone with first hand experience will chime in or the cleaver gurus Jaybett and Andy will make an appearance

Cheers,
Josh

454Casull
12-10-2012, 02:00 PM
What if we throw the F-921 into the mix? It's going for $170 at ****, worth it?

rdm_magic
12-10-2012, 02:52 PM
Are you able to break down carcasses with cleavers? I've never heard of it before and considered them almost only for veg prep..

keen81
12-10-2012, 06:21 PM
i recently purchesed the suien and i couldnt be happier with it. For the price. I couldnt justify double the price for anything else thar wasnt a cck. It is carbon though and does have a fair amount of belly to it that im triming down and thining out. Check out andys cleaver posts, they say it all really. It has easily become my main workhorse knife with a small petty. I really wouldnt break down meat with bones in, you get thick cleavers for that. Andys posts explain it all

454Casull
12-10-2012, 06:31 PM
Now a 4-way competition: is the F-631 still available from anyone? Would Korin be able to source it?

454Casull
12-10-2012, 06:32 PM
Are you able to break down carcasses with cleavers? I've never heard of it before and considered them almost only for veg prep..
Yes, but it's not recommended with certain types of cleavers.

I don't want to cut through bone but I do want to be able to joint a chicken, for example.

jaybett
12-11-2012, 06:08 AM
I'm not quite sure about your question. From the cleavers listed, it appears to be the best cleaver for under $200. Hopefully you have already purchased and tried an inexpensive cleaver, either from an Asian store or online. If not, that should be your first step. Many people don't care for the size and weight of a cleaver. Better to spend $40 on a CCK, then getting a $160 knife and finding out you don't like it. Selling cleavers can be hit and miss.

From the cleavers listed on this thread, my choice would be the Suien.

Jay

quantumcloud509
12-11-2012, 06:09 AM
General rule of thumb for cleaver users on this forum is: Buy all cleavers.

454Casull
12-11-2012, 02:43 PM
I'm not quite sure about your question. From the cleavers listed, it appears to be the best cleaver for under $200. Hopefully you have already purchased and tried an inexpensive cleaver, either from an Asian store or online. If not, that should be your first step. Many people don't care for the size and weight of a cleaver. Better to spend $40 on a CCK, then getting a $160 knife and finding out you don't like it. Selling cleavers can be hit and miss.

From the cleavers listed on this thread, my choice would be the Suien.

Jay
I'm Chinese. No need to worry.

454Casull
01-30-2013, 11:07 PM
I ended up with an F-920.

There are some seams that are not sealed; e.g. the ferrule to the blade, and the butt-end nut to the wood. I got me some Devcon 2-ton epoxy but I'm worried that I won't be able to get a smooth finish. How do I wipe it down to get a sanitary finish for smoothness and cleanability?

MikeHL
01-30-2013, 11:30 PM
Nice , how do you like the F-920?

As for the epoxy, perhaps a toothpick for application and automotive sandpaper wrapped around Popsicle stick for cleanup might get the smoothness you desire.

454Casull
01-31-2013, 09:27 PM
Nice , how do you like the F-920?

As for the epoxy, perhaps a toothpick for application and automotive sandpaper wrapped around Popsicle stick for cleanup might get the smoothness you desire.
Why sandpaper?

MikeHL
02-01-2013, 12:22 AM
sandpaper, just in case there is a couple of rough patches in the cured epoxy.

The automotive kind of course, not the stuff you use on wood.

454Casull
02-06-2013, 02:06 AM
It went easier than I thought. I used a 6" static mixer tip with a small orifice (1/16" or so) which made it easy to control the application. The only other real tool I used was a stainless steel ruler with a square end and a round end. The square end was used for cleaning up the seams to give a straight finish, and the round end was used to give a nice, smooth fillet to the seams. I had some paper on hand to wipe off the excess and the smudges.

I was able to fill in the gap between the ferrule and the blade, the ferrule and the handle, and the butt-nut and the handle.

http://images2.mcmaster.com/Contents/gfx/large/6813a61p1l.png?ver=12913575

TheDispossessed
02-14-2013, 07:31 AM
love my togiharu