do you give away your recipes?

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TamanegiKin

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From a broke line cook's perspective I'm curious if you guys give away recipes.
If you contribute to menus and don't expect to work somewhere for long would you give a place the recipes or ask for some form of reimbursement? This is a topic that has always made me uncomfortable so your opinions and experience are highly appreciated. Part of me has really enjoyed seeing my stuff on menus but now I'm beginning to feel that's also bad business on my part to not seek any form of compensation. Maybe I'm trippin' buy that's the reason I thought I'd ask.
Thanks and I look forward to your input.
 
I used to feel similarly about recipes/dishes when I was working for others. But I think it's a good way to develop & create new dishes, once you have a full repitoire of recipes that have been tried and tested on paying customers, you will be ready to take a position as head/executive chef, and the financial rewards will follow.
 
really I think be proud of dishes living on the menu beyond your stay at the restaurant. (or take it with a grain of salt as the restaurant isnt doing anything new and lacks the ability to adapt) also realize almost all menus change over time as customers change over time. understanding and tapping into the pulse of the dinners is the key.

if the owner of the restaurant had any sense he would pay to keep you around making him money. ill tell you this though there are many owners.... the smart ones take care of people that help them make money... there are many reasons most restaurants fail but the owner is a huge part of the problem. owners though also see a turn-style of cooks to be one hit wonders. few have the drive to pour out great ideas and stay on top of it.

honestly I meet too many cooks who have a solid resume cooking for the past 8-15 years... even held a sous chef or chef position. just got burned out. no new ideas. they are like a broken cog. they can cook but dont care to figure out much beyond that. cooking for people means to feed and nourish them... there is a deeper exchange beyond just cook... you dumb it down to well I followed the recipe so your recipe must be the problem and the truth is that cook is as stale as the day they gave up caring.

the best way to get paid for your ideas is to prove your ideas turn a profit.
 
I think that you should. I hate the idea of intellectual property when applied to food.

When you take a job, you're surely learning a whole new slew of techniques and recipes anyway, so you're probably to come out with a net gain.

Cooking is at its best when it is collegiate.
 
I like seeing my stuff on the menu. As a sous, it is part of my job description to create menu items, so part of my salary does compensate me for it. But even when I was a line cook I didn't have a problem with it. Especially the place I am at now, it was tough to get that first item on there.

I prefer to think of it this way: I am constantly getting better at what I do, so even if I give the place I am currently my best idea, it isn't going to be my best item next week, next month, or next year. It is product research on someone else's dime. And I am confident that even if the restaurant hangs onto it long after I am gone and I still want to use that item on my menus, I can execute it better than they can.
 
I like seeing my stuff on the menu. As a sous, it is part of my job description to create menu items, so part of my salary does compensate me for it. But even when I was a line cook I didn't have a problem with it. Especially the place I am at now, it was tough to get that first item on there.

I prefer to think of it this way: I am constantly getting better at what I do, so even if I give the place I am currently my best idea, it isn't going to be my best item next week, next month, or next year. It is product research on someone else's dime. And I am confident that even if the restaurant hangs onto it long after I am gone and I still want to use that item on my menus, I can execute it better than they can.

That sounds pretty cool. I'd eat at a restaurant with chefs with that attitude.

k.
 
the chefs i've worked under are mixed. most wouldn't share a drop of information so i too would withhold information from them if i knew better. half the time i pretend i don't know anything and act "stupid" just so they get their kicks from being "my superior".

but the chefs that share to me, i share to them everything i know. i give them seeds from my garden sometimes even produce coz i like growing heirloom stuff from all over the place (whenever i'm successful, that is). i tend to give more to those that share to me, information or things as thanks.
 
Of course, a recipe doesn't dictate how the food is sent out or presented to a customer.

I can follow a recipe by Thomas Keller exactly but would it be the same at my restaurant, no, the ambiance plating etc would be different.

To me chefs who are concerned about giving out recipes are insecure.

If you are getting stuff on the menu as a line cook that is great and you should be proud that your making good food I don't think however you should be entitled to profits.
 
I like seeing my stuff on the menu. As a sous, it is part of my job description to create menu items, so part of my salary does compensate me for it. But even when I was a line cook I didn't have a problem with it. Especially the place I am at now, it was tough to get that first item on there.

I prefer to think of it this way: I am constantly getting better at what I do, so even if I give the place I am currently my best idea, it isn't going to be my best item next week, next month, or next year. It is product research on someone else's dime. And I am confident that even if the restaurant hangs onto it long after I am gone and I still want to use that item on my menus, I can execute it better than they can.

Also, I would not want to work at a place that I did not want to contribute to.
 
Thank you all for your responses.
Up until now all I've cared about is that people enjoyed the food that I've put my heart and soul into.
The best feeling is when people really enjoy your food, always puts a smile on my face.
I think johnnychance just made me realize the issue, I don't think I'm somewhere where I want to contribute.
Thank you all for the sage words, I got something from every post.
 
For me menu items represent a place and time. Dishes that sold at the last job represent that clientele, concept, budget, and staff. Old recipes need more than flavor to be relevant. They have to reflect the entirety of your current situation. Think about the music you listened to five years ago. How much of that music do you play for other people now? Probably a few tracks still resonate but most serve by influencing your current taste. Ideas are cheap. They can get you a job but I think it is consistent execution and development (menu and staff) that create and increase your value to an employer. Recipes alone are not worth half as much as the will to create and inspire quality on every plate. If you can get a dish on the menu you should do it. Then, make sure it stays as good as the plate that got approved or make it better.
 
I have no problem giving out recipes as the day I am completely ,100% satisfied with a dish is unlikely to ever occur and if someone chooses to use one of my recipes I would be flattered.
I also believe that, with the possible exception of some of the cutting edge molecular dishes,someone,somewhere and at some time will have also "created"the same dish.I am constantly amazed after reading through old cook books how many wild and wacky recipes you can find-hence how do you claim intellectual property when in all likelihood it has been done before.
I also am acutely aware through my job that Chefs are much more likely to become bored and frustrated with their employers when they are not learning and given the opportunity to contribute.Doing 80 hours a week is much less onerous when you feel valued.
 
How many recipes/ideas/styles are you be exposed to each day? It should go both ways.
 
In general I would not expect compensation for recipes until you are the Chef or an Executive Chef. Even then there are only certain circumstances where this would apply and it's rarely going to be direct compensation for a recipe. This is something that you want to discuss with your employer as you talk about compensation. If you are required to create recipes, SOP manuals etc this should have an impact on your salary. The most difficult situation where this seems to come up is when a move is made to a position where you are the Chef or you help some one start a business that is using only your recipes or a signature dish. Things take off but the working relationship sours between owner/investor and Chef.
Contributing to a recipe is not something that I've ever seen direct compensation for. If you are performing well and not feeling the love ask for a raise.
Beyond that perform your best and contribute all you can on the way up.
It will pay off in the future.
 
To whoever want to listen.

Without enoough love and understanding noone can make it better then yourself.
And if they can, then they will surely tweak and make it their own.

Someone said once, creativity is not copying.
 
Like this post... :knife:

I like the way you answered that JohnyC. I think the same way...

You want to work in an environment that fosters growth, cooperation and improvement... If you share, you strive, improve and round and round it goes. A virtuous cycle so to speak.

Thats the way it should work anyway but someone needs to get the ball rolling at some point.

Regards to all
 
Sharing is caring. If the public doesn't eat my food who will? My wife isn't adventurous enough to eat a fraction of the stuff I've come up with.
If you're in this industry for compensation......
......you might want to think of a different career.
Hope this doesn't sound too douchey.
 
I agree chefs and cooks who won't share recipes are insecure. I can tell you that I have never withheld a recipe from someone who asked but I also don't think I've given any away. I also haven't expected monetary compensation for a recipe either.

I look at it as others have said my next batch is better than this one. I feel the exchange of information and education if far more important than what goes into a particular dish. I've been fortunate enough in my career to work with chefs that are open with things like that and always worked in environments that foster growth and development. If you figure out how to make it better home for you I've probably already moved on to new ideas and dishes. Plus as was stated you still probably can't execute it and present it like me.
 
Ok I feel some things need to be cleared up here.
First off, my question stemmed from something feeling off with my current job and my role.
I've always contributed at every place I've been because I love what I do.
I always took it as a challenge to prove to my chefs that I can do whatever they throw at me and also do my part to create or improve.
I don't understand the "insecure" suggestions.
My confusion on whether or not I wanna leave behind a detailed how to once I'm gone has nothing to do with insecurity.
Why would I feel that way about items that have become signature menu items?
I just don't feel too fondly about the owner.
If creating is so easy (which it is) then why don't all cooks do so?
Cooks who don't create are insecure.
I did a dessert menu awhile back because my chefs didn't "like" pastries. I was a prep cook at the time and I ended up with my name in a magazine and a dessert menu that people really enjoyed. I did it because it's FUN! Because I love my work and it's how I get better. Finally, I'm not seeking compensation directly for a recipe. I'm just in a place now where I am trying to look out for my best interest.
If you think that some owners don't try to exploit those who do this just for the "love" of the game then that's naive.
I'm glad I brought this up, as I said earlier I don't think I'm at a place where I want to help and I will fix that real soon.
I've never experienced this before and I appreciate the responses.
One last thing, I do this because I enjoy it, because I belong in the kitchen, it's all I've got and I hit it hard every day because I know it's all I've got. This is my life, there's no reason I shouldn't seek a suitable wage for it.
Thanks for helping out fam, all your replies are much appreciated.
 
ive had jobs where i helped in recipes/specials, menu development and ive also had jobs where i didnt want to. theres nothing wrong with whatever decision you come to. follow your gut instincts.
 
Its so tough to share sometimes :) I only share with people I trust anymore. Not the owner or the sous chef, but the chef yeah. He at leats gves me credit for my input unlike the other two. Geez. Thats all you really want though, is credit right? :) The only place I banked off of recipes is when I was chef at Market Grill inside of pikes place...that was nice. Free money. Yeah.
 
Ok I feel some things need to be cleared up here.
First off, my question stemmed from something feeling off with my current job and my role.
I've always contributed at every place I've been because I love what I do.
I always took it as a challenge to prove to my chefs that I can do whatever they throw at me and also do my part to create or improve.
I don't understand the "insecure" suggestions.
My confusion on whether or not I wanna leave behind a detailed how to once I'm gone has nothing to do with insecurity.
Why would I feel that way about items that have become signature menu items?
I just don't feel too fondly about the owner.
If creating is so easy (which it is) then why don't all cooks do so?
Cooks who don't create are insecure.
I did a dessert menu awhile back because my chefs didn't "like" pastries. I was a prep cook at the time and I ended up with my name in a magazine and a dessert menu that people really enjoyed. I did it because it's FUN! Because I love my work and it's how I get better. Finally, I'm not seeking compensation directly for a recipe. I'm just in a place now where I am trying to look out for my best interest.
If you think that some owners don't try to exploit those who do this just for the "love" of the game then that's naive.
I'm glad I brought this up, as I said earlier I don't think I'm at a place where I want to help and I will fix that real soon.
I've never experienced this before and I appreciate the responses.
One last thing, I do this because I enjoy it, because I belong in the kitchen, it's all I've got and I hit it hard every day because I know it's all I've got. This is my life, there's no reason I shouldn't seek a suitable wage for it.
Thanks for helping out fam, all your replies are much appreciated.

You basically answered yourself.
Think about it this way: even if you dont like the place or whatever about it that you dont want to contribute, do it for your own sake.
You push yourself and its going to be you who benefits.
Ideas are coming from inspiration, inspiration might come from that dirty bastard you work with and hate ;) It is all over. I think every place can give you something back.

For example, I worked in one shitehole once, needed money when baby was on her way.
So there are burgers on the menu. They serve frozen stuff, of course.
Even though it comes ready shaped they managed somehow to run out.
One day we had leftover ribeye joint, so I minced it, blended meat mixture and shaped some burgers.
Next day Im coming, and theres my burgers for staff meal and the frozen shite in the fridge.

I was so sick of that frozen pile of crap, that I wanted it out the menu. The next menu I supposed to make. So I did.
First day we served the menu comes one idiott waiter and cries that a customer came all the way from Canada and is unsatisfied that this shitehole have no longer freaking frozen dry shite on the menu.

You can see the pics of the items in my picture thread, this was winter bar menu, sous chef [which happened to be an idiott with 7 months experience from restaurant joint] said about it "The flavours are there but theres no colour"
I will never forget that.
I left but the menu and recipes are there. Noone can make it anyway.

Oh yeah for the warm rice pudding with cherries and cherry-kirsch sorbet the ice cream machine got broken but nobody cared for 5 months, even though me moaning.
 
I don’t work in a pro kitchen, so my perspective is a bit different.

It's not about the recipe, it's about the technique and execution. People ask me all of the time for my "recipes" (which I rarely use), so I'll write down what I put in a dish, they'll try to make it and they'll say it was terrible. Again, these are mostly non-pro folks that usually need a detailed recipe to boil water.

May be the kitchen and restaurant world is different, but in the design world, your ideas are not yours - they are the of the firm you work for. You get paid to create for the name on the door, not yourself. A friend from college who is a rock star designer worked for a very high end firm in NYC after we graduated, and every day his drawings were taken from him and locked in a safe for the night. May not be relevant, but that's the level ideas and protection can go to.

It's much harder to keep secrets in the food world today, where just about everything that anyone is doing at the moment is at your virtual finger tips. It's common place for a young chef to work for a well know joint famous for something for a short time, take what he can learn, and then move on to something else.

My thought for OP is if you’re writing recipes, dishes, menus for your joint and you feel you deserve something for it that you’re not getting, you either should be in a conversation about a higher position, or be looking to relocate.
 
I always give out recipes freely never really thought about it any other way .
i am always revising and looking for new or different not so much recipes but maybe a idea forms in dishes or technique that i use and the recipe or dish i give away today will not be what i am doing next week .
always changing and learning . but good technique and method will always stays.
 
My wife had to sign a contract stating that every recipe she makes becomes the property of her company. She has had dishes that didn't make it on the menu at her restaurant appear on menus at other restaurants in the company. FWIW There are a few recipes she developed at previous jobs that she won't even run on specials because she doesn't want to lose control of them.
 
And i told him no ketchup but he insist
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There is no talking to him , seriously there is no talking to him . he's a dog.
 
I think it depends on the recipe, and the work place. Most restaurants i have worked at have been independent or small ownership type places, varying greatly in style and quality of food. In all these places i loved to contribute, i took just as much or more away from these places than i put in. In these environments exchange of information was rewarding, and taught me alot. Learning how to conceptualize a dish for service(i.e. making it executable in the kitchens environment, level of skill of the staff ect.)was great practice. The restaurant may have my recipe but i learned from its use.
However i remember my first job in a more corporate place that took direct ownership of recipes for multiple restaurants, even with financial compensation, it seemed like a bad deal. you rarely saw your recipe appear on the menu, and if it was, it was always changed. It was not a learning experience.
That said there are certain recipes,(sausage seasoning ratios come to mind)that i don't like to give up quite as readily.
 
Ive always had an idea for my own place to put my name on the front of the menu i.e "The Chinese Laundry, by Shane G" for instance but my name in smaller print, and then each chef gets one thing on the menu, obviously tuned a little, which is a good way to teach others how to construct and cost a dish which complements the menu, and the get a "by john hancock" beside the dish..
 

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