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Thread: Tojiro DP?

  1. #11
    Senior Member rdpx's Avatar
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    Ok - so what I am hearing, and please correct me if I am wrong, is that I should steer clear of the Tojiro DP that I linked to?

    On top of that, you are saying that the FKH is a good knife.

    I have no problem with carbon (in fact I quite like the idea of carbon) it's just that whenever I find a thread where the FKHs are discussed a lot of people talk about this taste/smell issue, which is not something that I see being mentioned so much when discussing most carbon knives. I have no issue with having to take care of a carbon knife, and the patina etc, and all that goes with a carbon, but I see warning bells whenever this particular carbon has been mentioned.... I do have a friendly butcher round the corner who if asked nicely would probabaly give me a bag of blood to soak it in after all....

    As I mentioned in the OP, I can't really justify spending a lot on this knife which is why I am looking at the FKH or FKM. I guess I could push it up to a CarboNext maybe?


    There seems to have been no great love for the FKM, or will I find that a let down compared to my CN?

  2. #12
    Senior Member EdipisReks's Avatar
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    there is nothing wrong with the Tojiro DP you linked. the "eco wood" is probably the "pakka wood" that they have been using forever.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by rdpx View Post

    I have no problem with carbon (in fact I quite like the idea of carbon) it's just that whenever I find a thread where the FKHs are discussed a lot of people talk about this taste/smell issue, which is not something that I see being mentioned so much when discussing most carbon knives. I have no issue with having to take care of a carbon knife, and the patina etc, and all that goes with a carbon, but I see warning bells whenever this particular carbon has been mentioned.... I do have a friendly butcher round the corner who if asked nicely would probabaly give me a bag of blood to soak it in after all....
    The FKH is SK-4 steel. SK steel is made by Hitachi, and is a cheaper, lower purity (higher sulfur and phosphorus content) simple carbon steel than the usual suspects (White, Blue, even Yellow). It is generally accepted that lower purity steel = more reactivity problems.

    Forcing a patina is easy and will attenuate the reactivity significantly.

  4. #14
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    i have a tojiro DP 240 gyuto, it's not a bad knife, but i really really really prefer carbons at this point. =D

    and once you've tasted carbon steel, the only stainless steel that you'd wanna try out are the better ones. like AEB-L for example.... many of the knife makers on here use them and love it. and since you have a semi stainless, that's pretty much as close as you can get to owning a carbon steel knife.

    I would rather have ten tojiro DP knives than any VG-10 knife from shun. only shun knife i'd want is that kiritsuke style knife in aogami cladded in stainless. =D

    SK4 is the japanese equivalent to 1090 carbon steel which is a good carbon steel in my opinion. the closest thing i have that's 1090 is an old hickory 10" chef's knife that's made with 1095 carbon steel. and i quite love it.

    mine is vintage so there's an established patina on there when i got it and never took it off. just washed it down and cleaned it up with light passes of BKF and baking soda then a light soaping and water. this was my first carbon steel knife. and it opened my eyes to carbon steel! not necessarily my first carbon steel item, i've had a carbon steel tailor's shears for 6 years before this.

    but the edge after sharpening did get reactive with garlic and onions, reaction to sulfur to said ingredients. cut onions and garlic turned grey where the cut was made. but after a few more cuts and a few more onions that went away.

    my old hickory is quite possibly softer than FKH so it will be a better knife than my vintage.

    nothing to worry about.

    and since the FKH knives (60rc) are actually harder on the rockwell scale than the FKM (58rc), they will be sharper and maintain a better edge, and possibly keep a steeper edge compared to FKM.

  5. #15
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    the sequence of what i wrote is messed up. lol. lemme correct this:

    but the edge after sharpening did get reactive with garlic and onions, reaction to sulfur to said ingredients. cut onions and garlic turned grey where the cut was made. but after a few more cuts and a few more onions that went away.

    nothing to worry about.

    my old hickory is quite possibly softer than FKH so it will be a better knife than my vintage.

    and since the FKH knives (60rc) are actually harder on the rockwell scale than the FKM (58rc), they will be sharper and maintain a better edge, and possibly keep a steeper edge compared to FKM.
    there ya go

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by franzb69 View Post
    either FKH or FKM will do the trick. +1
    Have you got personal experience of either?


    @RDPX if you want to see if you'll use a suji I could lend you Hattori HD 270 in Vg10, might give you an idea of size and broadly what vg10 is like to sharpen.
    Re the tojiro it's hard to find much in that price range and length in the UK, never used one though.

  7. #17
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    Have you got personal experience of either?
    no sir, i haven't.

    i'd imagine that the FKH would behave like my old hickory, so in a sense i have an idea? since 1095 and 1090 is quite similar. i do understand that it's not just the steel that makes the knife and all that.

    with the FKM i've read on a few forums and a quite a bit of threads that they all quite like this line of knives, but only as an introduction to j-knives.

  8. #18
    Senior Member rdpx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TB_London View Post
    @RDPX if you want to see if you'll use a suji I could lend you Hattori HD 270 in Vg10, might give you an idea of size and broadly what vg10 is like to sharpen.
    Wow, you mean you would actually be happy for me to hack your $280 knife to death on my broken old stones?
    That is a very kind offer and I will have a think about it. Downside might be that I might decide that I won't use it, so that will be a knife that I won't buy, which would be a tragedy. Also it might push my desire up into a knife that I can't really justify the expense of! Upside would be that I may love it, and think I would like an even longer one, so just get a 300mmm CN! I considered the HD for my gyuto purchase, but overwhelming support for the CarboNext won the argument.

    I do like to cook roast beef and hams every now and then, so I guess the excuse for this knife would be that it would be better to slice such things with a suji than with my 210 gyuto.

    The bottom line is that I don't really NEED a suji, I just seem to have got a little into browsing knives at the moment, and want to buy another one! I get the feeling I am amongst friends in that respect.

    Re the tojiro it's hard to find much in that price range and length in the UK, never used one though.
    Well that was why I asked about it! It seems that webshop has a bucketload of them that they haven't sold, so they are discounting them to a level where it is actually possible to buy a japanese knife for a fair price in the UK, which seemed too good to be true. It would still be a couple of quid more than an FKH or FKM though, which is why I asked if they were any good.

    Quote Originally Posted by franzb69 View Post
    with the FKM i've read on a few forums and a quite a bit of threads that they all quite like this line of knives, but only as an introduction to j-knives.
    Thanks Franz - I think one of the big issues for me is that because I now have a CarboNext, I would not want to get a knife that was going to be disappointing when compared to that. Part of me thinks I should maybe just stump up the extra few bucks and get a CN suji, but another part of me thinks it is boring to get the same kind of knife! Leaning heavily towards the FKM, mainly because it is SO DARN CHEAP, and seems to have a good rep for its price. I wonder if there is anyone out there who has a CN and an FKM and could say how they feel about them both?

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by franzb69 View Post
    tojiro is a great intro to j-knives, but then you kinda already had that intro with a better knife. it's a notch below the carbonext in performance....so you might wanna consider something a little better as you might feel that it is a lesser knife. although a great knife especially for the price, it will feel lesser in performance.

    i'd suggest something better. but it really is up to you. =D

    like a carbon clad in stainless, or something stainless/sanmai and stainless but in better steel.
    Have you directly compared a CarboNext to a DP?
    Michael
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  10. #20
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    I would buy it if you're interested in trying it out. You'll likely be able to sell it here for a slight loss since it's at such a good price to start. It's only nominally cheaper here in the US.
    Michael
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