Even though I don't like his knives, I too think it would be fair to find some kind of way to let him respond to the criticism. Maybe somewhere else outside of the forum?
Even though I don't like his knives, I too think it would be fair to find some kind of way to let him respond to the criticism. Maybe somewhere else outside of the forum?
I have to agree.
Having had the opportunity of trying several respected maker's early work (The word "naïve" comes to mind) the dialogue here has proven to be very beneficial not only to the vendors but the community as a whole. To stifle that in any way would be opposite of what this place is about. I guess I've been guilty as the next guy but I'm starting to wizen up in my old age. I try to choose my words carefully.
Well if there's a passaround surely he can read the feedback at least so he'll hopefully gain something from it? But why treat him any different to anyone else? If he cares so much about what everyone here thinks he'll register as a vendor
Originally Posted by mkmk
Based on our Terms of Use to have Ken respond to anything here he would have to become a subscribing Vendor and ask for feedback in his own forum.
Then maybe the terms of use could use some revision. For someone to have to pay a high price (presumably something considerably higher than the $250 hobbyist rate) to respond to a criticism is the very definition of an exclusive, pay-to-play system. This guy isn't looking to sell here, and likely never would; he was responding to comments.
And before someone says I'm a shill, I'll repeat that I don't know Ken Onion, and have no interest in the knives. I simply don't like to see things like this degrade the credibility of the forum. And to be sure: they do.
This suggestion is the definition of the slippery slope- if we let anyone sign up and badger our members and use vulgar language what is next? However if you care to rewrite or edit a draft of the Terms of Use for vendors that does not shortchange the paying vendors and hobbyists, then I would be happy to look at them and the team and owners will take them into consideration.
When Ken first posted, I went back and reread the whole thread. I also looked at the design of the knife. It also got to thinking about would I like the handle? How about the handle with the shape of the blade? (prob. not)
Ken being a well renowned I didn't think he would want to be a craftsman here, or pay anyother higher price, not that he can't afford it. If we make a exception for him then what, who next? To me this is a learning forum at heart. The rest is well not. I myself can see learning off of what he has done and wouldn't mind sharing with others. As it is now Ken can take or leave what is offered there.
As for my original post in this thread I still say the same.
http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/sh...l=1#post185140
When I see that I still think about that knife. I am just hoping it is better in many other ways.
Chewie's the man.
+1
Chewie's the man.
What do you charge a vendor to participate? $500? $1000? Whatever the price, your scenario that leaves no space between non-participation and full investment means that you literally have a pay-to-play environment. You shouldn't be surprised that as a result, people will see this forum as insular and exclusive with regard to brands and vendors. It's written into the DNA.
Now, maybe that's fine, and maybe you believe it's the only way you can avoid slippery slopes. What's unmistakeable, though, is that it erodes the credibility of those who DO participate as sponsors. What possible harm is inflicted on Jon or Dave by allowing Ken Onion to respond to criticisms (some legit, some obnoxious)? Conversely, how much damage is done to those same sponsors by a system that treats their products and services as so fragile that they have to be supported by censorship?
mmmm mkmk, you hit the nail on the head It is a exclusive club here. It was started by other sites that don't avoid slippery slopes, we have here, and kicking them off. There is many places to read about that here.
With this dna set up this place has become what others want from their forums. Am I mad that Ken can't contribute? yes. But in many ways he did that to himself. We have many makers here that participate with out any problem. Censorship, is a huge word for what you are posting about. It is a free forum, but it still costs money for it to be able to function. Any time you put that into jeopardy then you need it. I can see how having him reply on this thread can, and prob. would jeopardize that.
Last edited by Crothcipt; 07-03-2013 at 04:08 PM. Reason: commas
Chewie's the man.
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