Art vs Artist who are terrible people.

[tkern]

I was watching Craig Ferguson the other night when the conversation of Wagner vs. him being an ass came up and if you can appreciate his music in face of his terrible views. This lead to a conversation about about writers, painters, etc who are just complete pricks in their personal lives but create wonderful things. Examples: Beethoven, Henry Miller, Van Gogh. Now, there are different degrees of being a terrible person one might argue. Henry Miller being a chauvanistic, whoring dick vs. Wagner's anti-Jew stance. I'm not intending this to be anyway politcal, religious, etnic, etc., and if the mods think that this may lead to trouble, so be it, delete it; but this lead to a great conversation for me and I was wondering if an equally great, well thought out, of sound and even keeled mind set conversation can also happen here.

[Salty dog]

Many great artists are troubled. It often seems to go with the territory. I've studied several contemporary greats and there seems to be a common thread. Narcissism, hubris, passion and ego. Not necessarily traits that make you a people person.
Alcohol seems to play a role in many of the "greats" lives as well. I personally believe some minds crave to be slowed down or put on hold. I think booze and drugs is a short term cure and why it's often abused by people who think, live and see things "differently".

[sachem allison]

sounds an awful lot like being a chef

[Salty dog]

You know it bro.

[mkriggen]

Something similar happens on the other side of the creativity spectrum as well. Many of the great theoretical physicists are believed to have had some level of ocd/autism which allowed them to focus intently on some really abstract sh*t. I think you have to be a little (or a lot) off to operate at those extremes of thought/consciousness

[Seth]

I don't particularly like Wagner's music but it doesn't have to do with his anti-semitic views. The counter example is Mendlessohn who was just a regular happy guy who wrote some of the most beautiful music ever - and not because he was Jewish. Wagner was an *******, Beethoven was cranky because he didn't get laid enough. The related question often is whether you need to be depressed or a schizophrenic to be creative. I don't know but it kind of seems that way.

[skiajl6297]

See Edvard Munch (famous for "The Scream"). His exhibition at MoMa a few years back was singlehandedly the most powerful vision of insight into a deranged mind, via art, that I have ever seen. He was clearly a troubled person, and his art characterizes that in gut wrenching detail. It's rare when you feel like you can understand someone's feelings via their art, but Munch sure knew how to hit hard, and below the belt, in a strangely relatable but horrifying way.

[markenki]

“Wagner's music is better than it sounds.” - Mark Twain

[Mucho Bocho]

I heard Picasso was real peach too.

[Don Nguyen]

For some reason, I welcome the crazy terrible artists. I haven't been able to pinpoint my logic yet, but I'll think about it.