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Thread: 1st Nakiri Choices

  1. #41
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    But just how many years will it take to reach stage four? I have a Dexter 12-inch steaking knife I run through a ChefChoice every fall before butchering my deer. In a really good season I may butcher 4 or 5, an average year a couple. Once the edge is touched up on the ChefsChoice, it is steeled on a EZE-LAP diamond rod as I work. The knife has been in use for maybe 25-30 years now and it might have as much wear as stage 2 on your drawing. Of course, the drawing is a complete exaggeration the wear pattern. from the machine.

  2. #42
    Senior Member kungpao's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mucho Bocho View Post
    Forum members are too nice sometimes. I'm encouraging the CC on J-knives experiment. That way we could document a very quick and efficent way to ruin J-knives.
    Amen.

  3. #43
    Senior Member Crothcipt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noodle Soup View Post
    But just how many years will it take to reach stage four? I have a Dexter 12-inch steaking knife I run through a ChefChoice every fall before butchering my deer. In a really good season I may butcher 4 or 5, an average year a couple. Once the edge is touched up on the ChefsChoice, it is steeled on a EZE-LAP diamond rod as I work. The knife has been in use for maybe 25-30 years now and it might have as much wear as stage 2 on your drawing. Of course, the drawing is a complete exaggeration the wear pattern. from the machine.
    Noodle it would be worse wear with a nikiri, because of more chipping, harder steel, ect..
    Chewie's the man.

  4. #44
    Senior Member Justin0505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noodle Soup View Post
    But just how many years will it take to reach stage four? I have a Dexter 12-inch steaking knife I run through a ChefChoice every fall before butchering my deer. In a really good season I may butcher 4 or 5, an average year a couple. Once the edge is touched up on the ChefsChoice, it is steeled on a EZE-LAP diamond rod as I work. The knife has been in use for maybe 25-30 years now and it might have as much wear as stage 2 on your drawing. Of course, the drawing is a complete exaggeration the wear pattern. from the machine.
    A soft butcher knife is much more appropriate for the CC. I've notices that a thicker blade / thicker bte works pretty well for raw meat. It seems like the thicker geometry the would wedge in hard veg helps separate the flesh and actually reduces drag. A nakiri is also far more dependent on even board contact than a butcher knife.

    The degradation in performance would become noticeable (to anyone that isn't oblivious) pretty quickly. It all depends on the geometry of the that particular blade, but I've noticed a degradation in cutting feel in less than a half dozen hand sharpenings without thinning.
    Given a good hand edge will last longer than a cc edge and that the cc removes more metal, I'd say one could easily see a very noticeable drop in performance within the first few months of buying a shiney new nakiri.

    The drawing is obviously an exaggeration, but that's because fractions of a mm make a huge difference in reality.
    "I gotta tell ya, this is pretty terrific. Ha hahaha, YEAH!" - Moe (w/ 2 knives). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVt4U...layer_embedded

  5. #45
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    I guess I shouldn't get into an argument about using a ChefsChoice on a nakiri because I would never do that anyway. That said, I still think this "removes too much metal" thing is way over exaggerated assuming you stay off the first and second stages as much as possible. If you think you need to go through all three stages every time, then you many have problems but ChefsChoice will tell you that upfront. The third stage on most models (and like I said, I've used every model they have made) removes no more metal than a stone would. My real point is still that it is a good machine for the average person that has no desire to spend the time,or in the case of waterstones, money learning to hand sharpen. Maybe not ideal for hard Japanese blades but their Asian model will give them the proper angle.

  6. #46
    Senior Member Justin0505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noodle Soup View Post
    I guess I shouldn't get into an argument about using a ChefsChoice on a nakiri because I would never do that anyway. That said, I still think this "removes too much metal" thing is way over exaggerated assuming you stay off the first and second stages as much as possible. If you think you need to go through all three stages every time, then you many have problems but ChefsChoice will tell you that upfront. The third stage on most models (and like I said, I've used every model they have made) removes no more metal than a stone would. My real point is still that it is a good machine for the average person that has no desire to spend the time,or in the case of waterstones, money learning to hand sharpen. Maybe not ideal for hard Japanese blades but their Asian model will give them the proper angle.
    I won't argue that a CC is "better than nothing" for crappy knives. When I saw a 3-stage model on super-close-out sale I actually picked one up for my mom in hopes that she would use it on her soft german-steeled knives in between times when I visit and give them all a propper sharpening.
    Another scenario might be that the industrial models (that wont over heat and shut off like the home versions) are perhaps viable if you had a whole pro kitchen or butcher shop full of crappy knives that needed sharpened every day / multiple times a day.
    However, I don't think that either scenario would apply to 99% of the folks on here.

    However, the argument that anything other than the non-cutting "buffing" stage doesn't take more metal off than a hand stone is so wrong it's silly. Maybe early on in hand-sharpening one might tend to remove a little extra steel as it takes some time to get a feel for holding an angle and developing a consistent bur, but very quickly it get's pretty easy to feel the exact instant when you've reached that primary edge and it's time to switch sides. The manual process allows for a level of control and a conservation of edge steel that I just inherently impossible with something like a cc. I understand that you're happy with the money that you put into yours, but stop trying to argue the point that it's something that it isn't.
    "I gotta tell ya, this is pretty terrific. Ha hahaha, YEAH!" - Moe (w/ 2 knives). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVt4U...layer_embedded

  7. #47
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    Justin, I started to write a long reply to that last post but decided against it. You have found your true religion and I'm just a poor, unenlightened heathen. LOL

  8. #48
    Senior Member Justin0505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noodle Soup View Post
    Justin, I started to write a long reply to that last post but decided against it. You have found your true religion and I'm just a poor, unenlightened heathen. LOL
    Quite the opposite. Religion is a matter of faith and seeking explanation / meaning for things which we cannot know or fully understand.

    Knives and sharpening is very much a topic which is observable and understandable to those who care to observe with their senses and think with their brains.

    If you had a well constructed argument as to why someone on this forum should go spend between $100 - $600 on CC or similar machine, I'd be genuinely interested in reading it.
    "I gotta tell ya, this is pretty terrific. Ha hahaha, YEAH!" - Moe (w/ 2 knives). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVt4U...layer_embedded

  9. #49
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    What ever Justin. I bow to your superior knowledge of everything sharp.

  10. #50
    Senior Member Justin0505's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noodle Soup View Post
    What ever Justin. I bow to your superior knowledge of everything sharp.
    I guess that means "no I don't have anything intelligent to say, so I'll say something sarcastic and defensive instead."
    "I gotta tell ya, this is pretty terrific. Ha hahaha, YEAH!" - Moe (w/ 2 knives). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVt4U...layer_embedded

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