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Thread: That which shall not be named

  1. #11
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    At the risk of getting in some hot water....

    I really, really like a certain 'speckled' 1k stone.

    It's the only stone I've tried from the line but it's a very nice feeling stone and it cuts very fast.

    I have not used the Gesshin 2k or Bester 1.2k which are probably my next moves in that grit range (the JNS 800 looks awesome too... so little money, so many stones) - but I am very happy with the purchase.

    It dishes fairly quick in my experience so it requires constant flattening but it is by no means a 'bad' stone.

    I use it & a Suehira Rika 5k as my standard 1-2 punch for my work knives and I personally find it very effective. But I am not in the business of sales and I understand and respect why people would not wish to do business with certain folks - but objectively, as far as stones go, I am a fan of this 1k stone. My two cents.

  2. #12
    Senior Member DSChief's Avatar
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    It's a fact of life that retailers would push their own house labels, For some, thats good they invest the time & money
    to test and in some cases tweak formulas for the stones. That being said, there are only a finite number of
    companies that do the actual production. Googling "japanese whetstones" or something as germane as
    'Bladeforums" will result in tons of hits to mine for info.
    The names that come up most often indicates basic truths, they work & people like them.

    My shopping list of "Generic" must haves { Every body sells them, even Amazon } so nobody gets offended.

    Naniwa chosera 400 & Bester 1200 { "MY" perfect starting kit, One could survive with just these 2 }

    Next Suehiro Rika 5k

    Gesshin 1 K extra large This is a luxury item, but I love to use it. { before the bester if I'm stopping there. or the Rika. }

    The rest you can live with out, But they are fun to play with:
    Naniwa Snow White 8k & a Kitayama

    a Jumbo JNS Binsui I'm sorry I mentioned this by retailer. But this thing is a beast

  3. #13

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    Hi guys,

    I'm new here. I've been using some Chinese stones for sharpening.
    I have a combination stone for rough work from Chan Chee Kee.
    Then I move up to some generic Chinese stones at 3000 and 5000 to finish.

    At each stage, I notice an improvement in blade performance.
    Are generic stones that bad?

    I presume that a nicer branded stone may cut nicer and work faster and probably last longer, but generic stones won't hurt my knives will they?

  4. #14
    Senior Member ThEoRy's Avatar
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    The stones wont hurt the blade unless they have toxic inclusions or lines in them. Human error will though. Say you have an extremely slow cutting stone, it takes longer to cut the bevel, therefore more time on the stones, more room for error, hands/arms get fatigued etc.
    Starting this harvest I'm a starving startling artist/
    Lyrical arsonist it's arduous spitting this smartest arsenic/

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by RLParker View Post
    it would seem as if the question is automatically set up to solicite a given response. Any positive opinion would automatically be deemed fanboyism and discredited. Hardly a way to reach a rational decision.

    BTW, one only needs to lurk for awhile to learn that calling one set of enthusiasts fan boys is the pot calling the kettle black to the 10th degree.
    I wrote "that which shall not be named" because any attempt to name the line of stones that I'm referring to or the place that sells them is replaced with ***** on this site. I can understand not allowing links to non-approved vendors, but sometimes this site's rules make it difficult to have serious discussions.

    I am not discrediting any positive review. I say that I can only find fanboy and pusher's reviews because I can mostly find dozens if not hundreds of reviews from a few people. Two of those most prolific sources sell the stones (Ken and Mark), and the third gives glowing reviews of absolutely everything sold at that place (**************). There are some vendors that I would trust because I know that they have heavily tested their products before they will consider putting it on their site. Back at the old site, you can read how Dave tested some stones for months and sent them to independent testers before making them available on his site. At the other place, dozens of stones suddenly became available in a very short period of time. That doesn't mean that they are all junk, but I'm going to want to see some independent 3rd party reviews. And sorry **************, but if in your reviews you love (or hate) EVERYTHING, your opinion is useless to me.

    I can only recall a couple of reviews that weren't made by one of the 3 reviewers mentioned above. Cliff Stamp gave a review of a 24 grit stone. (Everyone seems to either love him or hate him, but my google search of his name was entertaining.) Personally, I'm not sure what to make of a guy whose stone holder doubles as his left hand. I also found a review comparing a 320 vs. the Beston 500. That particular review was interesting, but I didn't think that the two stones were close enough in grit to compare, and the pro's and con's that the reviewer listed led me to the opposite conclusion that the reviewer made. There are a handful of other reviews done by people who clearly had nothing else to compare against. "I needed to compliment my *** stone with something coarser/finer so I contacted Mark (or Ken) and he hooked me up with *** which I like just as much as the first".

    I'm most curious about the 150 grit stone from the same line, how it compares against using an Atoma plate for rough work, and how the Latte 400 compares vs. the Gesshin 400 (is i the same stone?) Beston 500 and Chosera 400. Based on what I've seen, I would stick with my Atoma plate, and I would probably go with a Chosera or Gesshin 400 if/when I'm ready to move on from my Beston. But, really I'm curious about the entire lineup. Some of the offhand comments here would give you the impression that you are better off picking up bricks from Home Depot. I really don't doubt that they are serviceable, even if overpriced. With the size of the lineup, you'd think that one or two of them might even be worth the price. Has anyone here found a stone from that line that they really like?

    EDIT comment:

    One name that I tried to type (didn't edit out myself) was edited out. I can't even mention "that guy" to say that I don't trust his reviews!
    Last edited by CompE; 09-16-2013 at 07:27 PM. Reason: Add a comment to my post

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSChief View Post
    It's a fact of life that retailers would push their own house labels, For some, thats good they invest the time & money
    to test and in some cases tweak formulas for the stones.
    You are absolutely right that retailers will push their own products. However, some retailers invest time and money to test their products, others do not. I've been around long enough to form my own opinions regarding which vendors fall into which category.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Justin0505's Avatar
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    I don't really understand what you're getting at / your logic.

    On one hand you've got unknown quality product from a site with known paid or solicited reviews that appears disreputable to you and on the other hand you've got dozens of alternatives in the form of well known, excellent products from honorable retailers that support this community.

    Are you asking just out of curiosity or would you seriously consider buying the stones from a source where you couldnt even trust the reviews just to save yourself a buck?
    "I gotta tell ya, this is pretty terrific. Ha hahaha, YEAH!" - Moe (w/ 2 knives). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVt4U...layer_embedded

  8. #18
    Senior Member chinacats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin0505 View Post
    I don't really understand what you're getting at / your logic.

    On one hand you've got unknown quality product from a site with known paid or solicited reviews that appears disreputable to you and on the other hand you've got dozens of alternatives in the form of well known, excellent products from honorable retailers that support this community.

    Are you asking just out of curiosity or would you seriously consider buying the stones from a source where you couldnt even trust the reviews just to save yourself a buck?
    this makes no sense to me either...
    one man gathers what another man spills...

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin0505 View Post
    I don't really understand what you're getting at / your logic.

    On one hand you've got unknown quality product from a site with known paid or solicited reviews that appears disreputable to you and on the other hand you've got dozens of alternatives in the form of well known, excellent products from honorable retailers that support this community.

    Are you asking just out of curiosity or would you seriously consider buying the stones from a source where you couldnt even trust the reviews just to save yourself a buck?
    Mostly curiosity. There are certain stones that I would not buy from that site because I know that they didn't do their own research on them and I have spent a couple of extra dollars at other sites where they did the original research. The stones from that site's in-house lines appear to be unique to them, where they actually did the research themselves. If they found a real winner on their own (accidentally or as a result of real research), then why not buy it? The problem with untrustworthy people is that you can't trust them to lie or be wrong 100% of the time.

  10. #20
    Senior Member bahamaroot's Avatar
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    But the fact that they are untrustworthy people to begin with is exactly why you stay away from them 100% of the time, even if they do actually have a quality product. They can't be trusted and don't deserve the business.

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