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Thread: That which shall not be named

  1. #51
    Senior Member labor of love's Avatar
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    you guys do realize that many of the forum members here are here because we dont like mark, we dont like his phony marketing and his insincerity, and his awful customer service. i would much prefer to let laying dogs lie, but some new forum member, or some new thread appears almost monthly making it necessary to rehash this old crap. if you want to rave about how awesome your artifex is around here, you should really be prepared for criticism or anti mark comments, thats the way things have been for a while and i dont see any reason why that would change.
    also, wouldnt it make more sense to simply go to marks forum to discuss his knives? especially how they need to be fixed,lol? im pretty sure most noobs that stick around this forum should know better than to pick up an artifex,if they do their research.

  2. #52
    I'm going to be brutally honest here. I've stayed out of this discussion because the only thing I have to input to it might bend the rules just a bit (Dave, please feel free to remove this if it does). You guys see on my avatar that I'm a hobbyist knifemaker. I only started making kitchen knives relatively recently (within the last three months). Before I begin making ANY new style of knife (or sword)...I research. A lot. If I can get good examples in hand, I do that. I pore over the internet for any reference to the kind of knife I'm wanting to make. The better the reviews, the more eager I am to pick one up just to see what a properly performing knife of the type I'm intending to design should look like.

    I think you can see where I'm going here.

    In my research I found this forum...but I also found a TON of references to the Artifex as THE EPITOME of a high performance kitchen knife. On forums, youtube, everywhere. And the price! I thought to myself...'Wow, I'm going to pick one of these up...if they perform like these guys say, this will be a great example to show me (a guy who had never used a better kitchen knife than a 'Good Cook' from WalMart) what a proper high end gyuto should look like!!'. Thank God I ran into Son first...and found this forum...or I literally might have thought that a high performance kitchen knife should be thicker behind the edge than my all purpose prybar EDC.



    Again...I don't know Mark...I barely know Dave. But I know what I've seen in the marketing for the Artifex...and I know enough (through having made, and used enough kitchen knives that WORK now) to know that the broadhead arrow geometry in the Artifex just doesn't live up to that hype. This is regardless of steel, heat treat, or anything else. I can't stand when people take others for money, and it pisses me off even worse when being open and trusting to a normal degree can get you taken like that. Being ill informed in an arena of flooded marketing hype does NOT give license to someone to screw you for your money.

    off.
    I try to be the man I am..in times of broken lives. Shattered dreams and plans..standing up to fight. Pressures and demands..staring at the knife. Holding in your hands..

  3. #53
    Senior Member spaceconvoy's Avatar
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    I don't feel like I'm raving about my Artifex. That's the problem I have with the attitude around here. If Mark did somehow find a good stone, we would never know because anyone who said a kind word about it would be dismissed outright.

  4. #54
    Senior Member Mucho Bocho's Avatar
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    Labor is right on here.

    Quote Originally Posted by labor of love View Post
    you should really be prepared for criticism or anti mark comments, thats the way things have been for a while and i dont see any reason why that would change.
    One thing you can give and still keep...is your word.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by CompE View Post
    ....Sorry, I'm not in the habit of shelling out $100 out of curiosity. I consider this a (unfortunately not very active) hobby and I do my research before I make a purchase. For the record, based on the what little information that I have gleaned, there aren't any house-brand stones over that that would give me a compelling reason to try them. Thank you to those who provided real information on the products, not just rehashed information on people and business practices.
    Most of the knives and stones, that people are aware of on the forum, are because somebody took a chance and bought one. On the old ITK, Fish and Lee, use to send international postal money orders, to Japan, and then have to wait months, and hope that a knife would show up. I believe it was Lee, who either discovered Takeda or was a very early user. CCK became known, because a knife nut, out of Utah, went into an Asian market and bought one. The Suehiro Rika stones were found by users on Foodie Forum. Heck even the infamous Ken, was an early user of Chosera.


    Quote Originally Posted by CompE View Post
    ....But, it's been 2+ years since this started and I still can't even try to get a little information about products that they are exclusively offering, products that they haven't stolen any research on, without starting more of this nonsense on this site.
    It's common knowledge that the forum has a negative view of CKTG, and yet you hope to get information on a product that they sell? Some how that doesn't quite add up.

    The forum has a lot of good information on popular topics, try to get information on something more obscure and you have to do your own research, as in buying the product.

    Jay
    I'm a over-sized, under-educated, two onions a month, cutting fool.

  6. #56
    Senior Member labor of love's Avatar
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    who cares dude?who freakin cares if by some miracle mark happened to discover something on his own instead of copying what other vendors do? again, mark has his own forum, and it really makes more sense to discuss his products there.

  7. #57
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    So............ does anyone know if Black Steel is better than White or Blue?

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by spaceconvoy View Post
    I don't feel like I'm raving about my Artifex. That's the problem I have with the attitude around here. If Mark did somehow find a good stone, we would never know because anyone who said a kind word about it would be dismissed outright.
    The ironic side of me, says that he finally had a product, that his competitors would find worth stealing.

    If the stone was good, it might take the forum a little longer to acknowledge it. If three or four members were to make positive comments, that would get peoples attention. A sharpening guru, who is positive about the stone, would probably create a run.

    Jay
    I'm a over-sized, under-educated, two onions a month, cutting fool.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timthebeaver View Post
    So............ does anyone know if Black Steel is better than White or Blue?
    Black duh? It says so right in the description.

    Jay
    I'm a over-sized, under-educated, two onions a month, cutting fool.

  10. #60
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    I think a lot of people who had issues with the Richmond Artifex's AEB-L knives got it when they first came out. If you look at most of the negative reviews regarding gummy burrs on this forum, they're from about 2 years ago. There's been some changes to it compared to the first release, but it appears as if these changes are mainly cosmetic and with heat treatment, not geometry; for example, there's been a light curve added to the choil to make it more comfortable to hold. I purchased a 240 mm AEB-L gyutoback in July before I really started reading this forum, and retrospect, I would have just payed the extra money to get a CarboNext or Gesshin Uraku. However, I put quite a bit of work into the Artifex to thin it down, and it's performing pretty well for me. I also got a good amount of experience thinning and sharpening knives when I was doing this so I consider the experience a plus, and I feel like it's made me better at sharpening knives. I currently use this knife as my beater knife, and I'll loan it to people when necessary. I haven't had enough experience with knives to speak for the edge retention compared to other knives in a similar price range, but I need to sharpen the Artifex every 3 weeks or so using a Suehiro Rika 5k to get the performance that I want from it. I hone using the Messermeister 1200 grit ceramic rod with light pressure, 4-5 strokes a side (8-10 total), on a day to day basis. I work about 60 hours a week in various kitchens and cut mostly on plastic boards. I do keep the knife as clean as I can, but one of the places I work at is a cramp, high volume gastropub so things don't always work out for me. The convex grind that this knife is suppose to have doesn't seem to make a very big difference in terms of food release, but it maybe due to the fact that I ruined it while I was thinning the knife. Even if this is the case though, the fact that the knife necessitates a lot of thinning kind of defeats the purpose of the convex grind. I also notice an overgrind on the knife, although there's a slim chance that this was due to my improper sharpening and thinning, although I don't think that this is the case. I did not know how to spot overgrinds when I first purchased the knife. Either way, there's this small section near the heel where my knife has a small hole in the edge, and it definitely affects cutting performance and ease of sharpening.

    I bought a Delbert Ealy 240 mm gyuto made with AEB-L recently, and I've found that it's a bit easier to sharpen and the geometry is much better. It's thinner, wedges less, and food release is really nice. However, it also costed 450 dollars for me as oppose to the 95 that I payed for the Artifex. I don't use this knife as much as I do the Artifex, so I can't speak for edge retention yet.

    Ultimately, I think that the Artifex isn't as bad as many people try to make it out to be, and it's not a terrible purchase. It's definitely an upgrade over the classic German knives that many cooks and chefs work with. However, there are definitely better options out there unless you're looking for the experience of thinning a knife down and learning about how to sharpen knives.

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