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Thread: cleaver sizing cck--sugimoto

  1. #11
    Senior Member chinacats's Avatar
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    Thanks for the detailed info on Shibazi rickyro! I had actually purchased two new Shibazi's this week to complement my CCK (mine's ~225 x 110 so I may have the model number wrong). I was looking for something heavier and bought a S2506-A which is listed as a heavy duty Chinese meat cleaver which has a more western style handle. I also decided to try a stainless handle one as well as a PO3 so will report back when they arrive. Total including shipping was ~$30 from the site unkajonet recommended.

    Cheers
    once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by chinacats View Post
    The only cleaver I currently own is a CCK 1103 which I assume is a slicing cleaver or the approximate equivalent of a Sugimoto 6? I am interested in trying a few other inexpensive cleavers and would like to find the rough equivalents of a #7 and maybe a #22. My understanding (please correct me if I am wrong) is that the number 7 is sort of an all around cleaver and the 22 is more of a meat/bone basher? What would be a couple of good inexpensive cleavers that might approximate the others in the series. Thinking that maybe the Dexter carbon here may be sort of the middle ground? Size isn't too important, but I like the size of my current 1103 so full size is fine. Again, please excuse my ignorance on the subject but I would like to try a few others just to figure out the usefulness of the other sizes/weights. I really like my 1103, but again I feel it is more of a slicer which is how I now use it.

    Thanks
    Sugimotos are close to the ideal all around cleaver. With their strong distal taper they are thin at the tip and thicker at the choil. Slicing cleavers typically have a bit of flex. Not the Sugimoto, the distal taper, makes for a stiff knife. The handle is probably the best of a production cleaver. The spine and choil are rounded, in the right places. The cleaver feels good in the hand. It is easy to sharpen, and holds its edge.

    Fit and finish are on the rough side. It seems like Sugimoto spent time getting the areas right that are needed to make a cleaver perform. They are ugly ducklings, but they do work well.

    I'm not aware of any brand, including the Japanese ones, that are similar to a Sugimoto. They get listed from time to time, in the BST thread. At usually a very good price.

    Sugimoto 6 is a slicing cleaver.

    Sugimoto 7 is a chopping cleaver.

    Sugimoto 22 is for chopping poultry or fish bones. It measures 195mm x 110mm.

    The Sugimoto 1 is Sugimoto 6, but with a reduced blade height of 95mm versus 110mm.

    The Sugimoto 2 is a Sugimoto 7, again with reduced blade height.

    Sugimoto 3 is a boning cleaver.

    Jay
    I'm a over-sized, under-educated, two onions a month, cutting fool.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Seb's Avatar
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    Thanks for the info!

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by jaybett View Post
    Sugimotos are close to the ideal all around cleaver. With their strong distal taper they are thin at the tip and thicker at the choil. Slicing cleavers typically have a bit of flex. Not the Sugimoto, the distal taper, makes for a stiff knife. The handle is probably the best of a production cleaver. The spine and choil are rounded, in the right places. The cleaver feels good in the hand. It is easy to sharpen, and holds its edge.

    Fit and finish are on the rough side. It seems like Sugimoto spent time getting the areas right that are needed to make a cleaver perform. They are ugly ducklings, but they do work well.

    I'm not aware of any brand, including the Japanese ones, that are similar to a Sugimoto. They get listed from time to time, in the BST thread. At usually a very good price.

    Sugimoto 6 is a slicing cleaver.

    Sugimoto 7 is a chopping cleaver.

    Sugimoto 22 is for chopping poultry or fish bones. It measures 195mm x 110mm.

    The Sugimoto 1 is Sugimoto 6, but with a reduced blade height of 95mm versus 110mm.

    The Sugimoto 2 is a Sugimoto 7, again with reduced blade height.

    Sugimoto 3 is a boning cleaver.

    Jay
    Very clear comparison between No1, 2, 3 and No 6, 7.

    But I found out the spine and choil of my CM4030 are not rounded at all. Maybe that's because the CM4030 is low end model and the price is less than half of No 6 and this process is omitted.

    And the side opposite to choil (from the tip to spine) is not even symmetric, which means one edge is 90 degree and the other is around 120 degree.

    And there are some glue remaining you can see from the connecting point between handle and blade. But since the handle is more complicated than a full tang- three rivet type and does bring the advantage of comfort, then the glue staff is totally understandable.



    This is the distal taper Jaff is talking about compared to a Shibazi same width blade.


    Generally, I think the f&f of CM4030 is quite OK. The major glitches are coming from the blade, such as not rounded, irregular angles in some edge. The other part is coming from the handle connection point with glue remainings. But Hiromoto AS is also not rounded, and the f&f of handle also has some small glitches.

  5. #15
    中華庖丁の用途:
    1.薄刃:やわらかいものを切る、肉、野菜、前菜用に 1号?6号?
    2.中厚刃:肉、野菜、鳥、魚などその他万能用に 2号?7号?11号?佐文?No887?20041。
    3.厚刃:骨付の肉、魚などを切る622-30W?3号?22号?20042骨切り:22号

    Google translation:
    1. thin blade: Cut a soft meat, vegetables, appetizers. No. 1, 6.

    2. middle thick blade: all-purpose for other meat, vegetables, birds, and fish. No. 2, 7, 11

    3. thick blade: cut of meat with bone, and fish. No.3, 22. No 22 is especially thicker for chopping bones.

    So I think No2, 7 is good enough for chicken bones and fish with bones. No3 is even thicker so more suitable for pork with not too hard bones cutting. In Chinese food, sometimes the bones are cooked together with meats so you don't need to separate the meat from bone but just need to cut them into small pieces.

    But No3 is 4.5mm (220*95) thick. No22 is 6mm (220*110) thick, even stronger.


  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by gic View Post
    How does the shibazi compare in quality/steel/sharpening ability to the CCK??

    Seems like a great deal, thanks for sharing!
    I haven't had a chance to use a CCK. I bought a Dexter not too long ago, and while it takes a nice edge, it needs thinning.
    You just think you know who he is.

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