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mojojojo

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I am a home cook, and I really enjoy cooking and baking. I have been using a set of Saber knives from Costco to tie me over. I thought that it might take a year or two. However, it has taken me a little over six years of pinching and saving to get to my current budget. In any event, I have about $2300 cash to spend on everything. I can go as high as $3000, but it has to be for good reason. In any event, I have composed a list of knives and accessories that I believe is a good start. I currently have no experience sharpening my own knives, but I am excited to learn and try. The main reason why I am writing this is because I am having a hard time identifying what chef’s knife that I should purchase and other knives that I might need. I do not have a preference for carbon or stainless, and I am aware of their pros and cons. I appreciate any advice and thank you so appreciably for your input.

Gyuto ???
Misono moly Bread Knife
Gesshin Ginga 180mm Stainless Petty
Ginga Chinese cleaver #6
Pierre Rodrigue fork
Water Stones
Boardsmith 2" x 18" x 24" Walnut cutting board
 
That's an enviable budget and more than enough to get a awesome setup. Enjoy the hunt, plenty of knowledge worth listening to on here!
 
Wow. Dude I'm a pro (not a good one yet), but man what I could do with that budget. I suppose if I added up everything I had I could be in that price range, but it was never all at once. You have an opportunity to buil a great setup, keep asking questions is my advice.
 
get a gyuto in the 400-500 range. so then you can feel comfortable giving it a flogging and sharpening it a lot.
 
A few questions which might help with narrowing it down

Are you prepared to wait a year + for a custom knife?

Would you consider buying used from the BST?

Will you be the only one using the knives ?

Good luck with the search, you can definately get a cool collection with that budget
 
I'm yet to understand why a home cook would need to sharpen a high-end gyuto "a lot". Anything with good retention that has been well sharpened should last for months when being used for a few minutes a day.
 
Oh haha I didnt even register that he was a home cook even though it says it at the start. Haha.
 
I was given one knife about 18 months ago. For the last 6 months I have been trying to decide what to get next, still deciding. Perhaps getting one knife first, and a stone or two, will make your decision easier.

No doubt many here will be glad to help you use up your budget. :D
 
I've been doing research on my first j-knife for almost two months now. Just one chefs knife. Today I finally made my choice. I think Lexington Jim ^ is on to something--focus on getting one knife, find out what you like about it, what you dont (if anything), what other needs you have that it can't fulfill, and grow your collection from there.

There's a lot involved in a small, well maintained collection. Going big right away may be overwhelming.
 
This will be fun! (For you, and for us.)

That's a healthy budget--you should be able to cover things with room to spare.

For stones, a 1K (or 1200) and a 5K or 6K would cover most normal sharpening. Maybe a 400 or 500 for major work or repairs at some point. And I'd suggest a strop (Marko Tsourkan on here makes nice wood mounted felt ones).

Have you considered a slicer or paring knife? Those are two standard knives in a kit.

You can get a very nice gyuto for 400-500. If you buy a used one (some offered here are barely used), you can try something out, and likely sell it for close to what you paid if it turns out to not be quite right for you. Or you could buy new, and have a similar option to move it on, if needed.

Jon Broida's (from JKI) youtube sharpening vids are very helpful.

Filling out the "new knife" questionnaire will help you focus on your wants/needs, and give folks here more info to help guide you in the right direction. Here it is: http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/s...hich-Knife-Should-I-Buy-quot-Questionnaire-v2
 
I would first suggest talking to jon @ jki here on kkf could prob be a one stop shop unless your set on certain things he may not have but I'm sure could suggest a good alternate option.
 
First off, thank you everyone for being so responsive and helpful. I truly appreciate it. As for some of the questions, I have answered the ones that I saw.


1. Are you prepared to wait a year + for a custom knife? I have waited this long. I am willing to wait longer, but I am getting a tad anxious.

2. Would you consider buying used from the BST? I am more than willing to buy used. Is it hit and miss on the forum?

3. Will you be the only one using the knives ? The knives might be used by my fiance, and that is why I am on the fence about carbon.

4. Pairing knife/Slicer - I like a good pairing knife. I am not sure if I have actually used a slicer.

5. Piece by piece - I am also willing to go piece by piece, but I thought that if I don't commit to something now, something will come up and it will never happen. I do apologize for sounding like such a naysayer.

Thank you again for your advice. At times, this does feel a little overwhelming, and I haven't bought a thing. I think that I worry because I just don't want to get something wrong that will be a permanent feature in my home.
 
I have responded to the questionaire, and I hope that I have answered the queries correctly. Thank you again for taking the time to help me.

LOCATION
USA


KNIFE TYPE
I’m interested in several knives. I wanted to get a brand new set of everything.

I am right handed

I believe that I am interested in a western handle, but I have not tried any Japanese

Depending on the knife, the size will vary. However, I am coming to the conclusion that it is ok to go bigger.

I am on the fence for carbon because it might be used by another.

My absolute maximum budget would be $3000, but $2300 is also very agreeable.



KNIFE USE
I intend to use the knife in a home environment.

I intend to slice vegetables, chop vegetables, mince vegetables, slice meats, occasionally break poultry bones, trim meats, and cut cakes and bread.
I am replacing my set of saber knives.

My grip is pinch

Some of cutting motions include rocking, chopping, and slicing.

Some of the improvements include a better and easier cut, timelessness, comfort, and if possible edge retention


KNIFE MAINTENANCE
I use several plastic and wood boards, but want to purchase an end grain from boardsmith

I want to learn to sharpen my own knives

I am more than willing to purchase my own sharpening stones


SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS
Is it too soon to go custom?
 
As someone who only purchased their first "real knives" a year ago I bought a couple of knives that weren't rubbish but also not so good that I would have been upset by ruining them with bad sharpening and I personally think that was a good approach. Now 12 months on i'm upgrading after having learned more and more each time I sharpen and from the others on this forum. I think if you go a bit cheaper now while you learn it might save you a whole lot down the road
 
Honestly,

My advice would be to talk to Marko T he can make you an amazing gyuto and a great cutting board.

His stuff is truly amazing hands down one of the best if not the best knife I have in my collection.

If you get a high end carbon steel like 52100
It doesn't require much maintenance like white steel or simple carbon.

Stainless is always an option and Marko is working with some that is supposed to be as good as his 52100, also Devin T makes great stainless but at a heartier price.

Anything on jki is worth buying if you want talk to Jon he's great.

For stones hands down gesshin line. I would get a jnat just because there fun as well.

Good luck
 
With the following requirements for your gyuto, "better and easier cut, timelessness, comfort, and if possible edge retention" I too would look for a Marko Tsoukan stainless or a Devin Thomas ITK AEB-L. Marko's d handles are incredibly comfortable and his knife feels like an extension of your arm. His knives have a timeless look, especially in cocobolo or ironwood. Devin is a master, and I am extremely happy with his knives. His ITKs are more affordable than his custom, and offer tremendous value for the knife.

There's actually a lot of solid (and stellar) knives at the $400-$500 price point. A lot of it will depend on your personal preferences. In general, I like lighter knives. So while Shigefusa, Kochi, Watanabe, Gengetsu, and Yoshikane are really nice knives, I reach for my Marko or DT when I want performance. The one exception is a Heiji. Recently acquired a 210mm santoku, and it's super fun.

Unless you've handled a number of knives, I recommend not going custom. You may not know what works best for you. I had worked in a restaurant, enjoy cooking and baking, and am now middle age. But only after joining KKF and buying and trading way too many knives did I finally settle on what works best for me. But then again, I'm a pretty big optimizer, tweaker.

Also, in your knives, I'd skip the 180mm petty. If you find you like that length, a 180mm gyuto or santoku will be more useful for home use. The 180mm gyutos and santokus provide extra height, so it becomes a pretty handy knife when you're making small meals (1-3 ppl). If you go 180mm gyuto, Marko does a 225m gyuto and 180mm gyuto set.

Lastly, you're missing a paring knife. Since you got the budget, go for a Ealy 4" paring. The original 3" is great for in hand work, but I find the extra length useful.
 
i don't recommend jumping from a costco to a catcheside.

pick whatever knives you want but i recommend stuff that's less expensive to begin with. just because you have a massive budget doesn't mean you need to spend it all. pick something that you like the aesthetic of the most and has the best reputation. personally, i'm a big fan of ginga. they're not cheap but also not super expensive and still deliver excellent bang for buck. cutting with a stainless ginga will probably be really effortless for the first few weeks/months at home.

what i do recommend is

210/240mm ginga gyuto
120/150mm misono/fujiwara/tojiro petty (180mm petty is a little unwieldy for a home cook. it's my line knife and i love it but it's overkill for household cooking duties. a 120 or 150 would be more handy.)
beater cleaver from chinatown/chinese store. something robust and about $20-30. a #6 is a slicer type cleaver. it's thin and delicate for veg and meat prep, not bone breaking. it's more of a gyuto replacement. if you are capable with slicer cleavers, you'd love a ginga/sugimoto #6 but then you wouldn't want/need a gyuto or even a petty.
misono bread knife is good. mac is nicer.
victorinox paring knife
atoma 140 for flattening
chosera/shapton etc 1k and 5k or thereabouts.
stone holder

you're better off spending on great stones that will last a lifetime instead of expensive customs that can never satisfy for long. go easy and enjoy the journey.
 
Wow that's a big budget, I think I spent half that and have a 270 Harner gyuto, a 210 hhh gyuto, a catcheside petty, a 240 Davis suji and now a small Harner paring knife. I am quite happy with this set up as a home cook. Certainly much nicer than my wusthofs :) all are stainless by the way since I am not to be trusted with carbon

Keep your eyes open in the BST and you can get some great knives. I know there is a very sweet Harner the right now.
 
I would like to thank everyone for all of their input. It has really given me some serious thought. I have been searching the BST for knives. Maybe I can get something that will work from there. I have also been reading more and more about other knives. Does anyone have any opinions on Z Kramer knives? I have also fallen in love (boy is that weird to say) with this Burke knife. I have no idea how much this costs, but it sure is beautiful. I know that I won't be going in that direction anytime soon, but it sure is nice to admire. Lastly, does anyone have any opinion of shapton pro stones?

91588_1_b.jpg
 
You'll find nothing but love here for burke knives! It would cost a bit, but you do have a healthy budget, and gyuto is most important knife...... Sure is stunning.
 
I would like to thank everyone for all of their input. It has really given me some serious thought. I have been searching the BST for knives. Maybe I can get something that will work from there. I have also been reading more and more about other knives. Does anyone have any opinions on Z Kramer knives? I have also fallen in love (boy is that weird to say) with this Burke knife. I have no idea how much this costs, but it sure is beautiful. I know that I won't be going in that direction anytime soon, but it sure is nice to admire. Lastly, does anyone have any opinion of shapton pro stones?

91588_1_b.jpg

Bill makes incredible knives!!! But that will eat up the majority of your budget, and will take a year or two to get. but it is an heirloom piece that will serve you for life.

If that's what you want email Daniel or Drew from Epicurian Edge, they get them quite often, and may be able to speed up the process.
 
i don't recommend jumping from a costco to a catcheside.

pick whatever knives you want but i recommend stuff that's less expensive to begin with. just because you have a massive budget doesn't mean you need to spend it all. pick something that you like the aesthetic of the most and has the best reputation. personally, i'm a big fan of ginga. they're not cheap but also not super expensive and still deliver excellent bang for buck. cutting with a stainless ginga will probably be really effortless for the first few weeks/months at home.

what i do recommend is

210/240mm ginga gyuto
120/150mm misono/fujiwara/tojiro petty (180mm petty is a little unwieldy for a home cook. it's my line knife and i love it but it's overkill for household cooking duties. a 120 or 150 would be more handy.)
beater cleaver from chinatown/chinese store. something robust and about $20-30. a #6 is a slicer type cleaver. it's thin and delicate for veg and meat prep, not bone breaking. it's more of a gyuto replacement. if you are capable with slicer cleavers, you'd love a ginga/sugimoto #6 but then you wouldn't want/need a gyuto or even a petty.
misono bread knife is good. mac is nicer.
victorinox paring knife
atoma 140 for flattening
chosera/shapton etc 1k and 5k or thereabouts.
stone holder

you're better off spending on great stones that will last a lifetime instead of expensive customs that can never satisfy for long. go easy and enjoy the journey.


i disagree with starting with less expensive stuff to begin with. For a few reasons, for me i ended up going that way. i spent about 400$ on knives and stones and got a lot for my money, well i thought. I ended up not liking most of it and wanted to upgrade rather soon. What i found was the cheaper knives didn't hold their value as well as the stones and honestly i still have most of them laying around that never get used.

So in that aspect i threw away about 400$ rather than putting that towards stuff i really wanted, but was scared to buy at the time. I would say definitely get good stones to start the best you can buy this will not hinder your sharpening only improve it from the get go. But start with the medium grits until you get the hang out it like 2k-4k.

Also maybe buy one cheaper knife to practice sharpening with, like a tojiro or a fujiwara, still have decent steel, but rather cheap and will offer feedback.

now the knives KPNV mentioned are all more than worthy and good products, just the theory of starting cheap doesn't always work. Misono and Gesshin Ginga are both awesome blades for a great price. Anything really from jon at JKI is going to be a good product.

good luck
 
Thank you for your advice. I was starting to sway towards not spending a lot, but your post makes a lot of sense. I will reach out to Jon at JKI to see what he says. Do you think that a 180 Gesshin Ginga is too much of knife for a home cook? Thank you again.
 
Thank you for your advice. I was starting to sway towards not spending a lot, but your post makes a lot of sense. I will reach out to Jon at JKI to see what he says. Do you think that a 180 Gesshin Ginga is too much of knife for a home cook? Thank you again.

A 180 will and can get the job done, however for larger tasks may not be ideal. The most versatile size is a 240mm for a gyuto and can very well work in a home kitchen depending on your board size. I would recommend not going under 210 for your main gyuto but again its all personal preference. A petty or paring knife can be sued for smaller tasks. Del makes some awesome knives in that size for a great price.

Gesshin ginga are great knives, very thin and very sharp with decent edge retention. Should be ideal in a home kitchen. Although Jon knows all his knives and how they perform, im sure he can steer you in the right direction. If your going to pick up a knife from him definetly check out his stones, i have used a lot of stones and i can honestly say other than Jnat i wont purchase any except gesshin.. well until i get the whole set haha
 
Are you talking about a 180 for your main knife? I think that's too short. If you're talking about it as your smaller knife, it's probably too long.

Get a kick ass 210 or 240 gyuto. As much as you'd feel comfortable spending on a knife you will actually use. Maybe a Gesshin Heiji? I've never tried one, but people seem to love them.

You might be able to get by with a 120ish as a smaller knife. Or maybe a paring and a 150 petty.

There's a lot of overlap with a gyuto and a cleaver (this is coming from someone who has knives with A LOT of overlap). But if you want both, get both.

If your fiance isn't ready to take care of carbon, get some semi-stainless, or a good, properly heat-treated carbon.

Just curious, what's the focus on the fork? Nothing wrong with that, but just curious what it means to you.
 

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