Looking to Buy a Nakiri

LOCATION
What country are you in?

USA

KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chef’s knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?

Nakiri

Are you right or left handed?

Right

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?

Doesn't matter

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?

165mm

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)

No

What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?

$300

KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?

Home

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)

Vegetables only

What knife, if any, are you replacing?

None

Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.)

No

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)

Push cut. Chop. Rock. Slice.

What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)

I want good edge retention and one that will not stain food.

Better aesthetics (e.g., a certain type of finish; layered/Damascus or other pattern of steel; different handle color/pattern/shape/wood; better scratch resistance; better stain resistance)?

Something that looks rustic...not futuristic.

Comfort (e.g., lighter/heavier knife; better handle material; better handle shape; rounded spine/choil of the knife; improved balance)?

Doesn't matter.

Ease of Use (e.g., ability to use the knife right out of the box; smoother rock chopping, push cutting, or slicing motion; less wedging; better food release; less reactivity with food; easier to sharpen)?

I don't want the food to be stained.

Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)?

I want good edge retention. Don't wanna sharpen this thing once a week. Maybe once every 4 or so months. Plan on using the knife at least two to three times a week.



KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)

Wood

Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)

Not yet.

If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)

I've been researching and watching videos.

Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)

Yes. 1000 and 8000 grit would be sufficient I suppose?

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

I'm coming from a Wusthof Classic, Global and Shun Classic Chef's knives. I just realized that at least 90% of my cutting is done on vegetables so I'd like to have a knife that was specifically designed for that, and I want the best in my price range. If I like the Nakiri I probably will upgrade to a Gyuto.

I don't have a lot of nakiri experience but with your usage I would suggest more frequently sharpening than once per four months. How bout once a month minimum? Buy a strop and then just touch ups on a 5-6k stone, then whenever needed you can drop down to the 1k range. Depends on steel/maker/usage but I feel you may need to sharpen more than you realize.

I have only tried 3 nakiri's, but I'd definitely recommend a Shigefusa if you can get your hands on one. They are pretty substantial though in weight and thickness so if you want a super light laser I'd say look elsewhere, though they are very thin behind the edge. The steel is really responsive and when sharp it mainly glides through food, though I have some slight wedging issues at times in my limited use with it thus far. I have yet to truly sharpen it, but have trued it on the ceramic rod and touched it up on a higher grit stone for just a handful of passes as far as sharpening goes. Great fit and finish though and overall I see why they come so highly regarded and am very happy with mine. I still want to grab a laser like nakiri such as a Konosuke HD2 in the future though, I am quickly becoming addicted lol.

I am sure ITT you will hear suggestions for Kono's, Watanabe's, Takeda's, Carter's, Itinomonn's and Zakuri's, amongst others, they all seem to have reputations that precede them and all were knives I heavily considered recently before scoring a really nice knife on the B/S/T Board from Namaxy.

Asai AS nakiri ( http://www.epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=89909 ). Very good edge retention and just glides through veggies. I was amazed the first time I used mine. Not that great of an edge OOTB, but EE gives a free sharpening with each knife they sell, so just ask them to sharpen it before the send it out (the also give a 10% discount to forum members).

Might consider this also- http://www.epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=85670

Be well,
Mikey

Best bang for the buck is the Itinomonn - very light and nimble, different in feel from some other well-known nakiri, but easily one of my favorites.

I like the Shige as well, and it's my wife's favorite, so you won't go wrong there either. If you get the kurouchi version, the price can be quite reasonable too.

You say "I don't want the food to be stained." That excludes any knife that has a soft iron or carbon cladding, such as Shigefusa, Zakuri, older Takedas (the new N AS are stainless clad), the Takeo Murata, the Moritaka Supreme and others.

Some to consider are:

The Gesshin Uraku from Japanese Knife Imports: http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com...pe/nakiri/gesshin-uraku-165mm-skd-nakiri.html

The Yoshikane SKD hammered from The Epicurean Edge: http://epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=85670&photo=1&size=b

The Watanabe Pro direct from the maker: http://www.watanabeblade.com/english/pro/santoku.htm

The Kanishige tsuchime from Tosho Knife Arts: https://toshoknifearts.com/shop/knives/kaneshige-v-gold-tsuchime-nakiri

If you can accept 15 mm more in length , the Itinomonn kasumi from Japanese Natural Stones: http://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/itinomonn-kasumi-180mm-wa-nakiri/

There are many others that fit your criteria; these are just some suggestions.

Rick

echerub said:

Best bang for the buck is the Itinomonn - very light and nimble, different in feel from some other well-known nakiri, but easily one of my favorites.

I like the Shige as well, and it's my wife's favorite, so you won't go wrong there either. If you get the kurouchi version, the price can be quite reasonable too.

Click to expand...

My Takeda makes my Itinomonn seem kinda hefty. It's not a heavy knife, but the Takeda is a feather.

I also think I need to put a new edge on the Itinomonn because its ootb performance was a bit disappointing...fair amount of resistance in slower cuts and quite a bit of stiction, which reallly surprised me.

Does the food being stained effect the taste or quality of it at all? If not then I'm open to other suggestions as well.

I'm liking the Watanabe Nakiri right now. How does it compare to either of these...

http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com...-type/nakiri/kochi-180mm-kurouchi-nakiri.html

Takeda Classic Nakiri Bocho 165mm

Funkola,

I currently own, and actively use, a Tanaka 210mm blue #2 damascus gyuto. The soft iron cladding on this knife is known to be very reactive and patinas quite quickly. In over 2 months of usage, I have not had a single piece of food discolor (even onions, garlic, and citrus).
Just my two cents... :hungry:

Funkola said:

Does the food being stained effect the taste or quality of it at all? If not then I'm open to other suggestions as well.

I'm liking the Watanabe Nakiri right now. How does it compare to either of these...

http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com...-type/nakiri/kochi-180mm-kurouchi-nakiri.html

Takeda Classic Nakiri Bocho 165mm

Click to expand...

XooMG said:

My Takeda makes my Itinomonn seem kinda hefty. It's not a heavy knife, but the Takeda is a feather. I also think I need to put a new edge on the Itinomonn because its ootb performance was a bit disappointing...fair amount of resistance in slower cuts and quite a bit of stiction, which reallly surprised me.

Click to expand...

Hmmm. Interesting. At least from memory, I think my Takeda and Itinomonn are pretty similar in terms of weight. I definitely put my own edge on the Itinomonn before I started using it, so I can't say how the OOTB edge was for me

echerub said:

Hmmm. Interesting. At least from memory, I think my Takeda and Itinomonn are pretty similar in terms of weight. I definitely put my own edge on the Itinomonn before I started using it, so I can't say how the OOTB edge was for me

Click to expand...

They might not be too different, but the "substantial" feeling was there with the Itinomonn because of the thickness at the handle. The Takeda is wider but much thinner near the handle. The balance isn't bad on either, but when I lift the knife to make a cut, it cerainly feels like the Itinomonn has more oomph. I'm ambivalent about that feeling so far.

I just put an edge on the Itinomonn, and will give it some work today when I make some Japanese curry. I also tweaked my Takeda edge a little and will give it a try as well.

A "no frills" Carter is within your budget - if you can catch one available. I've one thats 165mm that I like a lot - very nimble in hand, sharpens easily. I've also had a Shig that I felt was a little cumbersome and one of Del's that I liked but preferred the Carter. If I was trying another I would look hard at Watanabe.

You've never owned a nakiri so before you go spend $200+ here's what I suggest. Buy a Tojiro DP nakiri and give it a good workout to see if you even like that style of knife. You might end up hating it and this could save you hundreds. It's a 165mm, stainless steel and western handled knife so it won't give you trouble, and most importantly $63 on amazon and elsewhere so you can abuse it wthout feeling too guilty. It's the top rated nakiri on cookingcache.com, I've seen it recommended by others, and I've owned it myself so I can give a personal recommendation. The only drawback for Tojiro can be fit and finish (mine was a bit rough where the handle met the bolster but in no way impeded performance), so when you order make sure to put "please check the handle for defects and imperfections" in the comments box on the order page. Then, if you end up really loving it, you can upgrade to a more expensive fancy nakiri.

I have the Watenabe Pro, I like the length and thin behind the edge and the Yoshikane hammer finish, nice feel.
Both get very sharp easily for me, edge retension a toss up.
I don't need both but can't decide between them.
Home cook, not a pro.

Glen

+1 on the watanabe pro. was recommended to me when i made a similar thread here by several people and im glad i went with the purchase. no issues with it being reactive and a great cutter

Surprised nobody has mentioned Kato (yoshiaki fujiwara)

Maxim (japanese natural stones) has a 165 in his store that is around $180. Amazing cutters, rustic.....

I have a 180mm and love it.

CPD said:

Surprised nobody has mentioned Kato (yoshiaki fujiwara)

Maxim (japanese natural stones) has a 165 in his store that is around $180. Amazing cutters, rustic.....

I have a 180mm and love it.

Click to expand...

OP stated that he wanted a knife that would not stain food, which can be inferred as stainless or stainless clad construction. Yes, I know that you can reduce (note that I said reduce, not eliminate) reactivity of a Kato with a patina, but my Kato discolored onions even after developing a heavy patina. Pineapple? Let's not even speak of it.

My experience with the more rustic Kato nakiri has been pretty positive and no more reactive than a Shig. It is very thick near the handle but tapers very nicely toward the end which makes it nimble.

Oh and gets scary sharp…

Ok so its either the...

Nakkiri knife 165mm Watanabe

or the...

Takeda Classic Nakiri Bocho 165mm

I've had both, only the watanabe is 180mm. The Watanabe excels in cutting and feel. D shaped burnt chestnut handle feels nice. Fit and finish is great.

The takeda handle feels kinda plasticy. It can't go through half a carrot without wedging. Even celery made the knife hesitate part way through. It's very light, but again, wedged too much.

Watanabe wins hands down IMO.

Thanks. Watanabe it is!!!

You'll love it. Watanabe was really easy to buy from, too, and it arrived in less than a week. Was fun using only the watanabe to shred cabbage, chop onions/potatoes/carrots for St Pattys dinner. Striction is better on the Takeda, but the watanabe just cuts so smoothly.

Nakiris are a useless novelty IMO. There is nothing they do better than a gyuto, but there are countless tasks a gyuto does better.

I am just a novice. But I think it's a question of specialization. one tool that does every thing well vs a tool that is excellent in one thing only.

Nakiris are a useless novelty IMO. There is nothing they do better than a gyuto, but there are countless tasks a gyuto does better.

Click to expand...

to me, gyutos are useless novelty. there is nothing they do better than a chinese cleaver, a sujihiki, a deba and a honesuki.

WiscoNole said:

Nakiris are a useless novelty IMO. There is nothing they do better than a gyuto, but there are countless tasks a gyuto does better.

Click to expand...

I am laughing like a mad man every time I use my nakiri and only occasionally when using my gyuto. Quite a difference, I'd say

brianh said:

I've had both, only the watanabe is 180mm. The Watanabe excels in cutting and feel. D shaped burnt chestnut handle feels nice. Fit and finish is great.

The takeda handle feels kinda plasticy. It can't go through half a carrot without wedging. Even celery made the knife hesitate part way through. It's very light, but again, wedged too much.

Watanabe wins hands down IMO.

Click to expand...

I am also eyeballing the watanabe pro 180. My main worry is the plastic ferrule (the 165mm has horn). What are your feelings about the plastic ferrule?

riba said:

I am also eyeballing the watanabe pro 180. My main worry is the plastic ferrule (the 165mm has horn). What are your feelings about the plastic ferrule?

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I believe you can talk to Shinichi Watanabe and ask him to install any the handle you want. He is very easy to talk to, so why send him an email?

icanhaschzbrgr said:

I believe you can talk to Shinichi Watanabe and ask him to install any the handle you want. He is very easy to talk to, so why send him an email?

Click to expand...

Spasibo, yeah, I've asked him but that's a bit too expensive for me (7000 JPY). For that money I rather buy one of his Ajikiri's or so

riba said:

Spasibo, yeah, I've asked him but that's a bit too expensive for me (7000 JPY). For that money I rather buy one of his Ajikiri's or so

Click to expand...

Well… then just stick with burnt chestnut handle. I haven'd seen burnt chestnut handles from Wanatabe in person, but judging from pictures, they looks just the same as burned chestnut handle that I had on my Yamawaku knife. I believe all those chestnut handles are made by some 3rd party Japanese craftsmen.
There was nothing wrong with plastic ferrule. It looked ok and was very comfortable.