My first knife, no budget. Need suggestions!

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Benign

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Hi, I Filled out the questionnaire, hope to get some help. All of this is completely new to me. All I know is I love cooking and am interested in knife care/sharpening etc.

LOCATION
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England (London)

KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chef’s knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?
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Chef’s knife
Are you right or left handed?
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Right handed
Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?
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Either (sorry!)
What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?
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Roughly 8’’
Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)
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I don’t know
What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?
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Roughly £300 ($500) but I do not need to spend this much. If something cheaer suits my purposes then great.

KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?
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Home
What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)
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Slice/chop vegetables, slice meat.
What knife, if any, are you replacing?
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This is my first real knife. Have been using Robert Welch 8’’ Cooks Knife at my parents’ home but am now renting a place of my own.
Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.)
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Finger point.
What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)
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Rocking/drawing
What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)
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Ease of use! Does not chip, easy to sharpen, edge retention. Having no experience with good knives I do not know whether I’d prefer a heavier or lighter knife.
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Aesthetically pleasing is a bonus.

KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)
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Yes (http://www.topgourmet.co.uk/acatalog/TopGourmet_Cutting_Surfaces_EP10806BK.html) Is this fine?
Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)
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No
If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)
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Yes!
Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)
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Yes

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS
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This is my first knife of my own. I am 21 and have just graduated university. I am finally moving into a place of my home with a proper kitchen and as a birthday present I am receiving a knife, and it is my job to pick what I want. I have always cooked at my parents’ house using a set of Robert Welch knives, and have never used anything nicer than that in my life. I don’t really have a budget (nominally $500, though I can spend more or a lot less) but don’t want to go over the top and buy something I won’t appreciate, but I am looking to buy something that will hopefully last the rest of my life.
I have no experience with knife care but am very happy (and eager) to learn.
​
Sorry this is so vague…

Thanks for any help!
 
Sorry for the horrific formatting, I seem to be unable to edit this post past the first 15 minutes :(

The obvious question I skipped out is: how do I get into j-knives in general? I've been going through all of the forum posts (starting on page 141!) and trying to find things that may be useful. Is there a beginner's guide or something of that nature anywhere? Beyond throwing money at a knife I obviously need to learn about care/sharpening etc.

Any suggestions?
 
I'm a novice, who was just doing a lot of reading and experimenting on the subject lately, so please don't take this as an advice, just some thoughts.
So, why have I decided to comment at all? Because I can talk to you as novice to novice.

First, $500 will get you almost anything any pro cook might ever want from a knife. Check "for sale" sub. Handwork by world-renowned masters goes
for this price. You don't think it's a good idea to learn sharpening on those, right? Besides, top $350 or so in the $500 price go to the qualities
only pros would be able to really appreciate. And you are going to need at least $100 for the stones to start with sharpening.
So, here's my bottom line: $100-150 for a stainless VG10 Shun or Tojiro.
 
Personally I would decide whether you want a wa- or western-handled knife. I would avoid soft-iron clad personally, and go stainless, semi-stainless or stainless-clad carbon.


Since you are in the UK (like me), II would be taking a good look at this. Who you buy your knives from is almost as important as the knives themselves in my opinion, and Maxim is a vendor who is incredibly knowledgeable, and an excellent sharpener. His knives are, in short, bloody good.

http://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/itinomonn-stainless-kasumi-210mm-wa-gyuto/

And don't buy a Tojiro or Shun. If you want cheap there are better options, like the JCK Kagayaki knives.

You'll want to watch Jon Broida's and Dave Martell's sharpening videos. I would recommend you pick up a King 1000/6000 combination stone and perhaps a leather strop.
 
+1 on the Itinomonn for the OP. (though I would suggest the 240) Very good, solid, no frills knife. Will take on anything. Maxim can get you started with stones as well.

Apologies in advance for the below but someone did say Wales?

wales.jpg
 
Thank you very much for the responses. The $500 number was just what I would be willing to spend, not necessarily what I'm looking to spend :). I completely take on board that such a knife would be wasted on me, and I can progress up.

With regards to wa vs western style, I've only ever handled a western style handle. Aesthetically I think I may prefer the western handle... I've run into long discussions back and forth on different tpyes of handles and don't want to start any of that here (!), but are there any objective advantages to each?

Is there a western-style alternative to the linked Ikonomonn? All I could find is this which however is a different price and has a different steel. What is V2 steel? Also, is there a suggested place for buying the King 1000/6000 stone for the UK?

I'm sorry I have so many questions!
 
Benign, since you cannot PM yet, pls email me at B_390_LU at yahoo.com.au

Thank you.
 
V2 is a type of carbon steel from Takefu, which I believe is very similar to the very popular White #2 steel from Hitachi (look here).
Just my 2 cents on the knife length, most of the people here will suggest 240mm but I'd say for a home cook 210 will be quite good enough unless you have already used 240mm or longer before and liked it.

To help you to decide whether you want carbon or SS have a look at Jon's youtube video. If you think you can do it, you can consider buying a carbon or at least carbon core with SS cladding. But personally I wouldn't buy a good full carbon knife (i.e. more than $200) for my very first J-knife.

EDIT: typo...
 
For $500 you could get a really nice gyuto, a petty, parer and a bread knife or some stones.
 
V2 is a high-end simple carbon steel made by Takefu. It requires more care than stainless or semi-stainless, i.e. it will rust if left damp for any period of time. That knife is clad with stainless though, so it's only the edge you need to concern yourself with, it's not a big deal unless you leave your knife lying around not wiped down.

As for steel characteristics, V2 is very easy to sharpen and takes a very fine edge. The semi-stainless Itinomonn is a bit more difficult to sharpen (but not excessively), is tougher, and has better edge retention.

The main difference between wa- and western handles will be balance point. Wa- will be more blade heavy, this is a personal preference thing.
 
Thank you for the response. I am straying towards 210mm as it is more similar to what I have used in the past. I also think that I would prefer SS and I can always move on to carbon when I am more experienced. Would there be a western-handled knife equivalent to that stainless itnomonn, or does that website stock all of their knives?
 
panda said:
if you just want a buy once and forget and not have to deal with it ever again, just go into a sur la table and pick out the one that you like best.
Click to expand...

That's not quite what I want, I'd like to learn about these knives, not just throw money at them.
 
Timthebeaver said:
You'll want to watch Jon Broida's and Dave Martell's sharpening videos. I would recommend you pick up a King 1000/6000 combination stone and perhaps a leather strop.
Click to expand...

Hi Tim - Whereabouts did you get your strop? I'm based in the UK too. Do you use a compound?

Cheers
 
I've heard lots of good things about Gessin Ginga series from JKI but the 210 western handle is currently out of stock. Send Jon an email or PM to ask for the shipping cost to UK and when they will be available.

JCK also has lots of different western style SS gyutos. Browse through the website and you will find some in the similar price range or other cheaper alternatives too. They have really good shipping price to worldwide.

Another option is the Sugimoto CM series. I don't have CM gyuto but have a CM4030 small Chinese cleaver and really like it. You can get it from Rakuten or Koki at JCK might be able to source one for you.
 
daveb said:
+1 on the Itinomonn for the OP. (though I would suggest the 240) Very good, solid, no frills knife. Will take on anything. Maxim can get you started with stones as well.

Apologies in advance for the below but someone did say Wales?
Click to expand...

Sorry, but I just passed some beer through my nose when I saw this
 
Chuckles said:
I just gifted a Blazen from epic edge to my little brother and all of a sudden he is into cooking. The included saya makes storage a non issue while you move around through your 20s.

http://http://www.epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=85485

They also have the king combo stone. Do yourself a favor and make sure you get the large size.

http://http://www.epicedge.com/shopexd.asp?id=80007
Click to expand...

I'm so confused :( How on earth am I supposed to choose (as someone with no experience) between say this knife and the Itinomonn? Or does it not really matter and they're both great?

EDIT: Thanks for the replies and advice, this forum is great!
 
If you order from the States reckon on paying around 25-35% of the price of the knife on delivery and customs charges.

In answer to your question, yes, there are many great knives. The Itinomonn is a sound choice, and is a one-of-a-kind piece with a very nice custom handle. A lot of knife for the money, I feel. If you don't want carbon at all, perhaps Maxim (owner of JNS) could get you a stainless western, he is very helpful.
 
Benign said:
That's not quite what I want, I'd like to learn about these knives, not just throw money at them.
Click to expand...

You probably need to have a think about what you would like to do.

If you are looking to get one good knife and be done with it, Panda's suggestion is a good one.

The issue is that a lot of it comes down to preferences, and you don't really know yet what yours are.

If you just choose a knife you like the look of (which comes well recommended) then you'll have a great knife which you can adapt to.

If on the other hand you want the best possible knife for you, which perfectly suits your preferences, you're likely to have to go thorough a few iterations before finding the perfect one. Many folks here are still looking for theirs.

If you don't want to go down the rabbit hole, choose any of the recommendations that you like and be done with it. Otherwise welcome aboard!
 
MAS4T0 said:
You probably need to have a think about what you would like to do.

If you are looking to get one good knife and be done with it, Panda's suggestion is a good one.

The issue is that a lot of it comes down to preferences, and you don't really know yet what yours are.

If you just choose a knife you like the look of (which comes well recommended) then you'll have a great knife which you can adapt to.

If on the other hand you want the best possible knife for you, which perfectly suits your preferences, you're likely to have to go thorough a few iterations before finding the perfect one. Many folks here are still looking for theirs.

If you don't want to go down the rabbit hole, choose any of the recommendations that you like and be done with it. Otherwise welcome aboard!
Click to expand...

Benign, this is probably the best advice you'll get.
Don't over think it, all these knives are good knives.
If one in particular catches your eye, then go buy it, you will not regret it.
No doubt you can try various styles and steels in due course.
I disappeared down the rabbit hole last year :)
 
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