Kagayaki Carbonext 270mm Gyuto KC-7?

I've been lurking here along with Cheftalk for a good few months now while i drool over the plethora of japanese Gyuto's i will probably never buy. Except now i'm seriously thinking about buying one. So i've just got some questions before i do, and i'll take any unsolicited advice you guys have.

LOCATION
Continental US

KNIFE TYPE
270mm Gyuto
Right Handed
Handle not important
260mm-300mm
Stainless or Semi stainless required
180$

KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment? Commercial kitchen, primarily prep.
What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for: Chopping/dicing/slicing meats/vegetables
Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? Pinch grip.
What cutting motions do you primarily use? Push cut, Guillotine 'n glide, mincing.
What improvements do you want from your current knife? I want it to take and hold a better edge, I would also like it to be light. A rounded spine would be nice, but not mandatory. I might just buy some sand paper and round off the spine myself.
Ease of Use Good food release would be a nice perk.

KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? Typically Synthetic.
Do you sharpen your own knives? Yes

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

What i have is the Victorinox Fibrox 10" Chef's knife. It's served me well, and i've learned to sharpen on it to the point where i've bested the factory edge, for whatever that's worth. But now after a couple weeks of overtime i think i've earned myself a "nice" knife. I've been leaning towards the Kagayaki Carbonext 270mm Gyuto after hearing that while it typically comes with a terrible factory edge, it's not super difficult to sharpen, and it will take and hold an acute edge.

But i'm here to ask a few questions before i throw my money at a new japanese knife and the requisite ceramic hone.

1. Are there other knives i should consider in this price range? Must be between 260mm and 300mm, semi stainless or fully stainless.
2. What are the odds of getting a serious defect like an over/undergrind? It doesn't sound like JCK would be willing to swap my knife out no questions asked, or cover the return shipment, so i don't wanna get a defective knife and be boned.
3. How much abuse will this knife tolerate? I don't do anything awful like cut citrus and leave my knife dirty, but i tend to put my knives back on the wall magnet after washing but not drying them. I also cut things like squash on occasion, rock'n'chop herbs, and i've bumped the tip of my knife against the side of the sink while washing it a few times. How brittle are these knives?

More information if its helpful. I tend to sharpen my victorinox on 1000 and 6000 stones ever few weeks at around a 20/25 degree edge, because it does wear down and i very much notice when cutting an entire case of beef into thin pieces for stir fry. I don't feel comfortable bringing a non stainless knife into the kitchen because i don't always have time to wash and dry my knife right *now*. I'd be willing to go up to maybe 180$ for a knew chefs/gyuto, but i can't afford something like the Konusuke HD.

Would the Kagayaki Carbonext be a good choice for someone in my situation? I am hoping for and expecting a very noticeable difference between my current chefs knife and the kagayaki, am i being unreasonable?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can offer.

3. A lot - my Carbonext was left by my roommate overnight after cutting lemon unwashed. The lemon juice was grey in the morning and the knife had while milk-ish patina.

2. Not sure if these defects are serious.

I have the 270mm carbonext gyuto and the fit and finish is more than just decent. The blade profile is without any discernible bumps much less overground parts. my factory edge was sharp enough to shave hair off my forearm. I haven't used or sharpened it yet (I am more of a collector) so I can't say anything about edge retention and reactiveness.

1. Fujiwara FKM worth to consider on the SS side, personally I like CN way better.
3. CN is not reactive at all although overtime if develop a very light grey-ish patina. I am not sure about putting wet knife to magnet block, I've seen some knife with magnet line spot on the semi SS knife.

Just as a heads up, my 240mm Carbonext had a pretty crappy edge until it had been seriously thinned and sharpened about 5 times to remove the weak outer layer of steel.

I had looked at the Fujiwara FKM series but it sounded as if the edge retention was sub par for a japanese knife, which is a big deal for me.

How exactly is a knife thinned? I've heard the term but haven't looked too much into it. Do you just lay the knife down on a course stone and do an equal number of strokes on each side? As if you were flattening a dished stone? Could this be used to remove small over/undergrinds?

Has anyone here recieved a knife from JCK they needed to return? How costly or difficult was the process? The biggest reason i haven't just gone ahead and ordered the knife is my fear of being stuck with a defective knife.

Rmag37 said:

I had looked at the Fujiwara FKM series but it sounded as if the edge retention was sub par for a japanese knife, which is a big deal for me.

How exactly is a knife thinned? I've heard the term but haven't looked too much into it. Do you just lay the knife down on a course stone and do an equal number of strokes on each side? As if you were flattening a dished stone? Could this be used to remove small over/undergrinds?

Has anyone here recieved a knife from JCK they needed to return? How costly or difficult was the process? The biggest reason i haven't just gone ahead and ordered the knife is my fear of being stuck with a defective knife.

Click to expand...

I'm curious to know where you read about edge retention of the Fujiwara FKM. Is it from a knowledgeable source, or just someone "shooting from the hip"?

Thinning is done by placing the blade flat on the stone and raising the spine slightly so that you are grinding on the lower 1/3 to 1/2 of the blade, but without actually reaching the edge. Painting the side of the blade with magic marker or machinist's blue will help you see what you are doing.

I have purchased several knives from JCK, and the proprietor, Koki Iwahara, stands behind what he sells. In the event that the knife has an issue that requires return, you will be directed to send it to his US based representative. Several years ago I purchased a Hiromoto AS sujihiki that had a twist to the blade and Koki replaced the knife as soon as his representative had received and examined it.

Rick

Pensacola Tiger said:

I'm curious to know where you read about edge retention of the Fujiwara FKM. Is it from a knowledgeable source, or just someone "shooting from the hip"?

Thinning is done by placing the blade flat on the stone and raising the spine slightly so that you are grinding on the lower 1/3 to 1/2 of the blade, but without actually reaching the edge. Painting the side of the blade with magic marker or machinist's blue will help you see what you are doing.

I have purchased several knives from JCK, and the proprietor, Koki Iwahara, stands behind what he sells. In the event that the knife has an issue that requires return, you will be directed to send it to his US based representative. Several years ago I purchased a Hiromoto AS sujihiki that had a twist to the blade and Koki replaced the knife as soon as his representative had received and examined it.

Rick

Click to expand...

To be honest i don't know exactly where i heard that. Probably from one of the variety of "Heres 10 knives, which should i buy" threads i read through. I just remember reading somewhere that it was only like 57 rockwell and that its edge retention, while not bad, wasn't impressive for a japanese knife. It may have been a different knife i suppose. And regardless, i'm sure it would beat out my victorinox by a noticeable margin.

I'm glad to hear that JCK has a good history with replacing defective products.

My main draw to the carbonext line was that i have seen mostly praise for the quality of the knife for the cost. I haven't heard of carbides or brittle edges with them. Even the people who don't seem fond of them seem to suggest the knife is a good buy if you are willing to sharpen it. The FKM just wasn't suggested as frequently. Would the actual cutting power/steel quality/heat treatment/edge taking/retention be similar? Would the carbonext be 50$ more for a marginal increase in quality?

Having used both a Fujiwara FKM and a CarboNEXT, I'd say that they were very similar in performance. The CarboNEXT does have somewhat better edge retention, and that could be significant when using it all day in a professional setting.

Regarding the OOTB edge, both knives that I used had acceptable edges; most forum members would sharpen them immediately.

Neither knife has a rounded spine, so a little work with some wet/dry is in order.

You seem to have done your homework, so I'd say to pull the trigger on the CarboNEXT. You won't be disappointed.

At this point someone has private messaged me offering a very fair deal on a barely used Suisin Special Inox 270mm, and i am now considering that as an alternative to the carboNEXT. I see Suisin knives recommended at the 300-400$ range frequently can anybody offer a comparison between the two? The Suisin is definitely better looking, but what practical difference am i likely to see? I can't really find any reviews for the knife. For basically the same price Saya/shipping included, i am almost convinced it would be a better purchase.

Also while i'm looking again, has anyone seen a 270mm Akifusa Gyuto for sale? I looked around for one of those when i was comparing knives, couldn't find one. Still can't. Only 240mm. Sorry for double post, can't edit previous post.

Since I have yet to hear a negative comment on Suisin INOX line than I would say of the deal is good just go for it. Suisin is known for very good fit & finish as well.

Alright, I'm gonna go ahead and buy the special inox. Thanks for the input guys. Hopefully i can stop buying knives before it becomes a problem. Right after i get a good 8 inch chinese chefs knife. And a decent Yanagi.

Tell us what you think after you have used it for a week or so. I'm curious:biggrin:

Can do. Will probably post a full review after i have used it for a month or two. Just because there really aren't any.