perfect gyuto (another kato?)

I am looking for a perfect quyto to my taste and like to seek your wisdom.

I am not a gyuto person and have limited experiences (aritsugu, shige, mario's, DT ITK, and kato) with the type.
After spending numerous hours on this forum, I felt that a kato fits my preference (thick spine, heavy weight, distal tapering from hill to tip) So, I ended up getting a couple of katos in 210 and 240. They are great cutters for sure. Yet, the 210 kato feels too light and weak (just my subject feeling) so that I don't feel like using it for any heavy duty cutting job.
The 240 kato I have is much closer to my taste but it just gives me the feeling like a nice dish needs a pinch of salt. So, my search for a perfect one continues.
What I am looking is a hefty (even 300g is fine with me) 240mm weapon-like-feeling gyuto with ~5.5~6mm thick at the handle tapering gradually toward the tip. What would you recommend for it?

With exception to having a nice spine taper from heel to tip, I think you should check out Watanabe.

Have a look at Noborikoi Toyama from Maxim.

Mine feels big and hefty in hand. It is almost as bis as a Kato. Taper from heel to tip is there, just not that extreme. Edge comes nice and thin, and profile is very nice with a slight drop nose at the tip.

If you want a thick knife with good grind and all the finesse of a panzer division you can have a look at Wakui (ex Yoshikane employee if the net rumours are to be believed).

labor of love said:

With exception to having a nice spine taper from heel to tip, I think you should check out Watanabe.

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I am actually in the process of checking on a watanabe. Thank you for your suggestion.

schanop said:

Have a look at Noborikoi Toyama from Maxim.

Mine feels big and hefty in hand. It is almost as bis as a Kato. Taper from heel to tip is there, just not that extreme. Edge comes nice and thin, and profile is very nice with a slight drop nose at the tip.

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Thanks.
I checked Maksim's site. The spec of it looks indeed similar to kato's.
What's your feel about its heat treat and hardness? how's it on a stone?
When I compared all the knives that I have had so far, common features that I found among the knives that I am sure well made are 1. steel makes very clear sound and bouncy when I tap the tip on a hard surface (granite top for ex) 2. regardless of hardness (whether it's a honyaki or not), those knives are easy to sharpen.

MrOli said:

If you want a thick knife with good grind and all the finesse of a panzer division you can have a look at Wakui (ex Yoshikane employee if the net rumours are to be believed).

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Thank you. I will check on it.
As a side note, one thing that I am always puzzled about is yoshikane's popularity; I have not owned one from them yet but some of their knives looked to be good but...maybe theirs are not as good as shige's or kato's.

orange said:

Thanks.
I checked Maksim's site. The spec of it looks indeed similar to kato's.
What's your feel about its heat treat and hardness? how's it on a stone?
When I compared all the knives that I have had so far, common features that I found among the knives that I am sure well made are 1. steel makes very clear sound and bouncy when I tap the tip on a hard surface (granite top for ex) 2. regardless of hardness (whether it's a honyaki or not), those knives are easy to sharpen.

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I haven't used this much, since I got it last month, only because I have a Kochi 240 for a short test drive that I will have to return.

Edge originally came very thin, so I had to put it onto the stone for slightly more robust edge. Sharpening work was minimal, but it was easy to sharpen that initial edge. Steel feels like it is in the same ball park as Kato and Shigefua, where Kato might be a bit harder. Maxim kinda hinted that this may be a blue #1, definitely some sort of blue steel.

If you are looking at Watanabe as well, you should give this Toyama a hard look, as they are very very similar AFAIK.

I also favor a mighty blade but didn't fall in love with Kato. I would look at Watanabe Honyaki or Mizuno Honyaki or Rader. i have had all three and currently have two Mizuno Honyaki some how. The Blue DX steel from Mizuno is very nice. They run short and are not very high at the heel. Watanabe runs truer to length and is also taller at the heel. Watanabe makes a very nice Honyaki. Rader's knives make you feel like a King when you use them and he has made some seriously power sword type knives.

Nothing to really add other than I sold my last Kato for the same reason. not sure where you're located but if you'd like to try a Watanabe pro 240 send me a pm...it filled the void for me.

Watanabe honyaki is very high on my list.

orange said:

Thank you. I will check on it.
As a side note, one thing that I am always puzzled about is yoshikane's popularity; I have not owned one from them yet but some of their knives looked to be good but...maybe theirs are not as good as shige's or kato's.

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They are excellent fuss free knives with a good weight, I love my SKDs.

schanop said:

Maxim kinda hinted that this may be a blue #1, definitely some sort of blue steel.

If you are looking at Watanabe as well, you should give this Toyama a hard look, as they are very very similar AFAIK.

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Thank you for your feedback. I like well made blue #1 a lot.

MrOli said:

They are excellent fuss free knives with a good weight, I love my SKDs.

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Cool.

Chuckles said:

I also favor a mighty blade but didn't fall in love with Kato. I would look at Watanabe Honyaki or Mizuno Honyaki or Rader. i have had all three and currently have two Mizuno Honyaki some how. The Blue DX steel from Mizuno is very nice. They run short and are not very high at the heel. Watanabe runs truer to length and is also taller at the heel. Watanabe makes a very nice Honyaki. Rader's knives make you feel like a King when you use them and he has made some seriously power sword type knives.

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I have never considered a Rader knife but will do research on it. Thank you.

chinacats said:

Nothing to really add other than I sold my last Kato for the same reason. not sure where you're located but if you'd like to try a Watanabe pro 240 send me a pm...it filled the void for me.

Watanabe honyaki is very high on my list.

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Thank you for your generous offer. I appreciate it.
I have not considered a honyaki for a gyuto but maybe it's time to entertain the idea as well.

What about some of Will Catcheside's 4mm mono steels? They're slight thicker than that coming out of the handle. I've been using one for a few months now and they're truly great cutters. Super thin behind the edge with a slight distal taper means the knife has a really nice weight and feel to it.

Mangelwurzel said:

What about some of Will Catcheside's 4mm mono steels? They're slight thicker than that coming out of the handle. I've been using one for a few months now and they're truly great cutters. Super thin behind the edge with a slight distal taper means the knife has a really nice weight and feel to it.

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I have maninly looked into Japanese maker's knives so far.
Thank you for your info.

Z kramer it s perfect i thought.