Help spending my money (questionnaire completed)

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bogeybrown

Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Messages
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LOCATION
What country are you in?
USA


KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chef’s knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?
GYOTO, PETTY, BUNKA, AND PROBABLY A NAKIRI AND/OR USUBA

Are you right or left handed?
RIGHT

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?
HYBRID? I continue to be drawn to the bolstered japanese styles like Miyabi or Kanetsugu

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?
250mm or so on the Gyoto, 150ish on the petty, 180ish on the bunka

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)
YES, or very close to it

What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?
We'll call it $1000 max for the 4 knives, allowing for more money on some of the knives and saving a bit where I can on others where appropriate. I can blow that budget if need be however.


KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?
Serious home use and some occasional pro use as I decide how far back into the industry I feel like getting

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)
Primarily breaking down veg, and teaching knife skills. I have my old battle blades for abusive work on proteins but will likely use the new blades for breaking down meats (with and without bones) as well

What knife, if any, are you replacing?
Looking to hand my old workhorse Henckels off to my girlfriend for her to learn with and treat myself to some new steel. I have the 10" and 8" chefs, 7" Santoku, 6" utility, boning knife, 4" paring, kudamono, and bread knife. All of them are partial-tang (either 4 or 5 star from the 90's era before they changed the blade geometry)

Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.)
Pinch grip for everything but breaking down proteins where I tend to use a finger-point or variation thereof

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)
primarily push cutting unless the task calls for something different

What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)
big issue I'm trying to improve on is wedging from the fat german blades

Better aesthetics (e.g., a certain type of finish; layered/Damascus or other pattern of steel; different handle color/pattern/shape/wood; better scratch resistance; better stain resistance)?
I find myself geeking over the Damascas and hammered finishes, partly just for looks and the hammered to help with stiction

Comfort (e.g., lighter/heavier knife; better handle material; better handle shape; rounded spine/choil of the knife; improved balance)?
My current lineup tends to be a bit blade-heavy, which I'm used to, but I adjust well to new blades. If anything heavier tends to be a bit better than lighter for me

Ease of Use (e.g., ability to use the knife right out of the box; smoother rock chopping, push cutting, or slicing motion; less wedging; better food release; less reactivity with food; easier to sharpen)?
Looking for stupid sharp out of the box with good retention. I like to spend more time using knives rather than coaxing them to work. Minimal wedging with good release and no reactivity are important

Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)?
As long as I can get away with between sharpenings


KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)
I have a Boos Block kitchen island that I periodically use a softer synthetic board on top of for heavy work

Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)
Not currently (honing steel only)

If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)
If I truly learned to do them right and could be confident that I was doing more good than harm

Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)
I'd be interested in purchasing products once I felt I was competent in their use



SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

I was in the industry for years and treat my knives like tools. I've always respected them and never abused them, but as much I try I just can't baby them.
 
Thanks guys, Todd I'm not locked into all 4 necessarily, especially if there's an overlap. I'm figuring on a big knife to be the new 10" chefs, the petty for a utility blade, and either the bunka or nakiri for a mid-size veg-slayer.

Is there a better term than "hybrid" for the japanese-styled handles utilized by miyabi, shun, kanetsugu?
 
Thanks guys, Todd I'm not locked into all 4 necessarily, especially if there's an overlap. I'm figuring on a big knife to be the new 10" chefs, the petty for a utility blade, and either the bunka or nakiri for a mid-size veg-slayer.

Is there a better term than "hybrid" for the japanese-styled handles utilized by miyabi, shun, kanetsugu?

Welcome to KKF.

Get the "big knife" and the paring only. Use them for at least a month to give you an idea of what knife style, if any, you need to get next. The gyuto/chef's is more than capable of "veg slaying".

A better term than "hybrid" is "hidden tang".

Rick
 
Thanks Rick, I agree that "hidden tang" is probably much better.
Other than the 3 I've found so far, are you aware of any other manufacturers I've missed?

Also, I indicated that I don't currently sharpen. I have the Spyderco sharpener that I use for most of my steel, but I don't currently pray over a set of water stones the way the "real" sharpening ninjas do.
 
+1 to Rick's suggestion, get the Gyuto (Chef) and Petty or Paring first. Don't be surprised if after some use you decide your 3rd knife should be another Gyuto. (shorter, longer, thinner, more heft, etc, etc,) I could probably live with only one Gyuto but glad I don't have to.

Based on your questionnaire response a boning knife should probably be in your future, and a good sujihiki (slicer). Nakiri and Bunka are largely redundant, either would be a nice to have but not at the top of the list. Usaba is all about technique - if you don't need the technique, you probably don't need the knife.

I don't see where you've identified any manufacturers. "Other than the 3 I've found so far, are you aware of any other manufacturers I've missed? " EE sells Yoshikane Gyuto with a hammered finish - I feel it's "bling" and don't care for it myself. But if you like it then you should have it.

Good luck.
 
Thanks Rick, I agree that "hidden tang" is probably much better.
Other than the 3 I've found so far, are you aware of any other manufacturers I've missed?

Also, I indicated that I don't currently sharpen. I have the Spyderco sharpener that I use for most of my steel, but I don't currently pray over a set of water stones the way the "real" sharpening ninjas do.

If you take the plunge into high-end knives, you'll likely want to start using waterstones, but that's a subject for another day.

Other than Shun, Miyabi and Kanetsugu, you should look at Takamura (the Hana line in SG2):

http://www.thebestthings.com/knives/takamura.htm.

If you don't mind waiting, you can also have a custom bladesmith make you one to your specs. Del Ealy's knives have what Del calls a "hybrid" - octagonal scales on a tang without a pommel. Dave Martell can make a hidden tang handle as well.

Ealy damascus gyuto:

attachment.php


Martell hidden tang handle:

attachment.php


Rick
 
Thanks Tiger,
I've also seen that Ryusen and Yaxell Ran are offering the hidden tang design. Although price isn't a huge factor, at a certain point I can see some of the more expensive knives hitting a status where I'd be afraid to use them, or would obsess over using them anyway.

I was talking to a chef buddy of mine a couple of days ago who told me that he doesn't use any of his knives unless he's on TV. The rest of the time he just uses the house beaters. I just (internally) shook my head at how much things have changed from the days when a $250 knife was expensive and we beat the hell out of it for 60+ hours a week without a second thought.
 
Thanks Tiger,
I've also seen that Ryusen and Yaxell Ran are offering the hidden tang design. Although price isn't a huge factor, at a certain point I can see some of the more expensive knives hitting a status where I'd be afraid to use them, or would obsess over using them anyway.

I was talking to a chef buddy of mine a couple of days ago who told me that he doesn't use any of his knives unless he's on TV. The rest of the time he just uses the house beaters. I just (internally) shook my head at how much things have changed from the days when a $250 knife was expensive and we beat the hell out of it for 60+ hours a week without a second thought.

Hah! The only people who give a damn about what type of knife your'e using on the tee-vee are us obsessive weirdos:knife: I've beat the crap out of more than a few $400+ knives in a pro environment. I'm not a believer in 'preciousness' if you catch my drift...
 
Hah! The only people who give a damn about what type of knife your'e using on the tee-vee are us obsessive weirdos:knife: I've beat the crap out of more than a few $400+ knives in a pro environment. I'm not a believer in 'preciousness' if you catch my drift...

Agreed buddy, but I've got to say that I should kick Tiger in the junk for showing me that Bloodroot. I collect guns for the sake of it, but have never bought a knife I didn't intend to have my way with. BUT I can see buying one of those Bloodroots just to stare at and touch myself. What's worse is that the girlfriend saw them and is now MUCH less impressed with the Henckels I'm teaching her on. This is like my shooting forum all over again where I'm going to find all kinds of cool stuff I never knew I needed and will go broke chasing the new addiction.
 
Agreed buddy, but I've got to say that I should kick Tiger in the junk for showing me that Bloodroot. I collect guns for the sake of it, but have never bought a knife I didn't intend to have my way with. BUT I can see buying one of those Bloodroots just to stare at and touch myself. What's worse is that the girlfriend saw them and is now MUCH less impressed with the Henckels I'm teaching her on. This is like my shooting forum all over again where I'm going to find all kinds of cool stuff I never knew I needed and will go broke chasing the new addiction.

Welcome to hell!

At least your gf seems to be on board. For now. Once that changes, there's always the "handbag" trick!
 
For the Bunka have a look at Masakage Koishi 170mm (super blue) or the Yoshikane Hakata SKD (165 or 180, though the availability at the moment is problematic). I have the Masakage in 130mm and it is great. The Hakata in 165 size feels bigger than it is with distinct front-forward weight distribution and thus makes for a great chopper. The grind is pretty much a wide bevel one (I will be sharpening mine that way). Both hold the edge very well. The super blue core of the Masakage is rather rust resistant, the cladding is stainless. The Yoshikane is stainless clad SKD (semi-stainless) and barely gets some patina.

For a gyuto I would have a good look at the Kochi knives available from Jon (http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com) - even better yet - give Jon a call.
 
Welcome to hell!

At least your gf seems to be on board. For now. Once that changes, there's always the "handbag" trick!

I'm VERY fortunate. She'd be more interested in a large caliber revolver than a handbag. The downside is that I "need" a voice of reason from time to time instead of someone who drools over expensive toys and geeks me up to buy more.
 
The forum is not quite the voice of reason. The forum is here to help assuage your conscience when buying beautiful (and often expensive) knives. :biggrin:
 
The forum is not quite the voice of reason. The forum is here to help assuage your conscience when buying beautiful (and often expensive) knives. :biggrin:

Believe me I understand. The shooting forum works the same way: Some poor sap will log on with a simple question looking for an affordable equipment choice, then a bunch of us proceed to explain that he can find a great deal on a USED scope for $1000 or so until he can save up the money for a better one. I have scopes that cost as much as a good used car.
I'm trying to maintain some perspective here, and fortunately very few of the REALLY expensive knives are what I'm looking for. I'll end up spending 3x more than I'd originally planned, but I've got 20yrs on my current knives, so I understand the investment.
 
I had a guy stage with me that had a bloodroot boner and let me tell you they are meant for you to have your way with them. They are beautiful and feel great in your hand, but are also good cutters and this one in particular was tough as nails.
 
I had a guy stage with me that had a bloodroot boner and let me tell you they are meant for you to have your way with them. They are beautiful and feel great in your hand, but are also good cutters and this one in particular was tough as nails.

Leave it to a fellow New Orleanian to be there to help me make bad decisions. :curse:
 
I had a guy stage with me that had a bloodroot boner and let me tell you they are meant for you to have your way with them. They are beautiful and feel great in your hand, but are also good cutters and this one in particular was tough as nails.

Damn, now I want a Bloodroot blade!
 
I now see why so many of you have a rack full of expensive knives you've never used:

You buy whatever you can find in stock when you can get it. :curse: Every time I've said, "okay, screw it, it may not be exactly what I want but I'll start with "X" and see how it goes" whatever it was I decided on is out of stock or otherwise unobtanium.

This feels like the firearms industry after the last two elections. I never thought I'd have this much trouble finding a vendor to take ridiculous amounts of my money.
 
I now see why so many of you have a rack full of expensive knives you've never used:

You buy whatever you can find in stock when you can get it. :curse: Every time I've said, "okay, screw it, it may not be exactly what I want but I'll start with "X" and see how it goes" whatever it was I decided on is out of stock or otherwise unobtanium.

This feels like the firearms industry after the last two elections. I never thought I'd have this much trouble finding a vendor to take ridiculous amounts of my money.

Keepn an eye on the BST, all kinds of gems pop up almost daily.
 
While I'm sure there are a few people here who just collect knives, my guess is that many just like to have a full rotation:)
 
While I'm sure there are a few people here who just collect knives, my guess is that many just like to have a full rotation:)

Agreed, but the way I'm going I'll end up just buying whatever I can find then replacing it when what I "want" finally comes back in stock.
 
You were looking for a miyabi right? There's a zdp189 miyabi gyuto and parer on BST:

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/s...abi-7000MCD-Chef-8-quot-amp-Parrer-5-quot-set

I saw that, thanks. Unfortunately neither of them were what I "needed". I'll likely end up settling on Miyabi simply because I may be able to find one in stock somewhere and will just have to acknowledge that for the money I could have gotten some cooler knives if I'd been willing to wait for them and buy them without ever having seen or felt them in real life.
 

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