Stropping/touching up on a dry stone?

I've got a question that came up in a thread about honing, but I think I'd better post it in a separate thread.

I think I'm a pretty accomplished sharpener and I maintain my knives either manually on waterstones or using the Wicked Edge. But there are times the edge of a knife needs just a little touchup and picking up a fine stone, wetting it and then touching up the edge is just a little too much. So I do use a ceramic honing rod in those cases.

As came up in the mentioned topic, this is not ideal. A ceramic honing rod is essentially a ceramic stone, but one with a very small contact area between the knife and the stone. That may cause issues.

I was thinking of using a balsa strop loaded with, say, 2 micron diamond spray to touch up edges in those cases where it's just too much effort to soak a stone. But Peter (psfred) mentioned another idea: touchup/strop the edge on a completely dry stone.

I wonder if more people do this. And if so, what are their experiences and what stones do they use? There are some stones you can use completely dry, like the Spyderco ceramic stones. I was also wondering whether a Shapton (pro or glass) would work, since it already requires little water.

I got my JNS 6000 last night and was eager to try it out immediately. Stropped few knives that just needed touch up. Stone needed just tiny drop of water and it worked amazingly, totally felt in love with instantly! Left the knives with amazing edge. If you would consider splash & go stone, I can fully recommend that one!

I either use my 6k jck stone dry or with a few drops of water and works great. Dry with Jon's stropping motion or use a little water if i go through a few sharpening strokes first

Mark search the site for Takenono. We've discussed this topic in great length. But you can absolutely use a stone as a dry strop. I use mine every day.

Mucho Bocho said:

Mark search the site for Takenono. We've discussed this topic in great length. But you can absolutely use a stone as a dry strop. I use mine every day.

Click to expand...

Never tried this what are the advantages other than splashing it with water for dry stropping?

Keith, I'da know if a dry or moist strop is more effective. Sometime I wet the stone most of the time I don't. I think wetting the stone gives a little more control and has possibly more stropping power. Because I like to keep my knives in top sharpness at all times, so after prep and kitchen clean up, I'll trail edge a few strokes the knives I've used to bring the edge back.

In my experience, dry/wet stropping doesn't work for all high grit stones that i've tried (JKI 6K Diamond), but the Takenono is da bomb diggity. I demoed this technique at the last ECG and folks were impressed. What I like about this technique was that it leaves the edge with bite but still refined (all steels that i've tried to, White, Blue, AEBL, SS, SG2, SVN35V...) Maybe Marc D. will provide his perspective.

So in your experience Jon's 6k diamomd isn't that effective for dry/wet stropping before or after use? I have wondered if i would get better results dragging that out.

Is that the same as Takenoko? That's what I found and that the Takenoko 8K is same as Arashiyama 6K. I know it happens I used a Masamoto polishing stone from cherry with wood base for years touching up my Yanagiba's at work. Later I purchased a Suihiro Rika 5K with wood base, exactly the same stone.

I don't understand how the lack of lubricant would help? Anybody have thoughts on this? Is it possible the stones act as though they were a slightly lower grit without the water??

Usually for my japanese knives that don't get steeled, if I didn't want to pull the polishing stone out I would use a strop with 0.5 micron dope... this seems to work quite well in a pinch for work and even works on things like aus8 which I would never bother to take further than 1200 King or 1k Bester anyway. Strop has the added benefit of being nearly indestructible (unless oil happens) and so is very nice for an unpredictable work environment

Keith, I did what you suggested (search for Takenono), but there’s a problem.

• Searching with Takenono only in the topic titles results in no hits.
• Searching with Takenono in the topic texts results in 21 hits. I don’t know which one you refer to, but I read all of the threads and the following ones seem to have some relation to the question I asked, but I wouldn’t describe them as an extensive discussion of this topic.
  • http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/24268-Asymmetrical-stropping?highlight=takenono
  • http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/s...alsa-Strop-need-your-input?highlight=takenono
  • http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/14595-Need-strop-advice/page3?highlight=takenono (post by Mucho Bucho on this page)
  • http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/s...r-stropping-advice-needed!?highlight=takenono

Keith or Mucho Bucho or anyone else, do you perhaps have a link to the topic where it was discussed extensively? Or more specific search terms I can use?

Thanks!

@Male, exactly. In my experience the JKI Diamond 6k was not as effective as stropping dry on the T.

@keith, Yea Takenoko (sorry I have a tendency to make words up) and yes the arashiyama and Takenoko are the same stones. If I understand your point, the 5k Rika and Takenoko are not the same stones. The Rika is blue, creamy feeling and a soaker. The Takenoko is mounted on a wood base, is yellow in color and is gritty feeling when dry. I bought both of these stone from JKS.

Top: JKI 6k Diamond
Middle: suehiro rika 5k
Bottom: Takenoko/arashiyama

Thanks Mucho yeh just making a point that some stones come in different boxes with other names. I bought the masamoto 10 years ago and the 5K rika 6 years. Both had wood bases & same writing on side of stone. Now looks like the Rika does not have a base at all these days.

Maybe I will try out the Takenoko

No mention of naturals here yet. Quick strops can work well on finer med stones (I usually have an Aizu around), some large nagura or finishers. Just a little water.

I also have a leather strop block for this.

2 questions

any idea why this works? I'm not trying to be argumentative.

does the Rika work ok for dry stropping?

I would guess you have some "wiping back up" of any rolled edge, plus some very minor metal removal that will "sharpen" the actual edge just a bit. Dry stones will be different than wet ones because the grit won't rub off as easily and the stone will clog with metal and any crushed or loose grit, reducing the amount of metal removed and increasing the polish. The Arashiyama/Takenoko is semi-natural, meaning a portion of the stone is made up of natural stone powder mixed with regular aluminum oxide grit.

The effect should be rather minor with just one or two very light passes trailing edge, but it makes a huge difference on my Tojiro. I don't bother with the stone for my soft stainless, I have a knife steel for those. Does the same thing, one or two very light passes at the sharpening angle or a bit higher restores nearly all of the lost sharpness.

I have not yet tried stropping on my wood loaded with chromium oxide or on my Kitayama stone, but I suspect either would work, although the edge would be finer, I think, than the 6k one. I do finish the Tojiro and my Korean carbon steel knives on the strop.

Peter

I've used quite often my Chosera 2k for fast touch-ups, dry. It will load the stone a bit, but I see it as an acceptable emergency solution.