Masakage Discussion - leading into the Feb Sale

Leading into the relatively well known 15% off Masakage Sale starting in February wanted to get a little discussion open for people to ask questions about different lines etc.

Honesuki Yuki vs Kosishi?
The one knife I think I'm looking for is a Honesuki and was wondering if anyone had experience with either the Yuki (~$100) or the Koishi (~$150) and thoughts.

Also had a generally question around if its ok to use a Honesuki to separate chicken wings/drummettes/tips or if I should be using a heavier butchery knife for that.

Masakage Yamamoto
Has anyone heard anything about this line? The only knife I can find from this line is a 240mm Deba Gyuto hybrid knife.

Looking forward to the overall discussion =)

mikedtran said:

Also had a generally question around if its ok to use a Honesuki to separate chicken wings/drummettes/tips or if I should be using a heavier butchery knife for that.

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I use my Misono Swedish Steel honesuki to pop joints, and cut thru bones such as the backbone (?) holding the two thighs together. Sometimes a larger bird I'll use my yo-deba from the same line. Both are relatively thick and only about 61hrc IIRC so haven't had any problems so far.

Which vendors will be offering the discounted lines?

I ask as it's my belief some will not be discounted their current inventory

bonestter said:

Which vendors will be offering the discounted lines?

I ask as it's my belief some will not be discounted their current inventory

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This is the knifewear only sale I believe, maybe it isn't as well known as I thought :dontknow:

It's going to be known now ;-) Another vendor has expressed that he will not be having a Feb. Masakage sale. So if your after a Masakage knife you better act quickly on the 1st.

What is the main differences between the various lines (Yuki, Koishi, Shimo, Mizu, Kiri, Kumo, etc)? I should ask in terms of performance and edge retention, etc.

I have a Yuki bunka that I use as a line knife. I got a koishi gyuto but didn't like it so much so I sold it. Got em from knifewear. I think the Yuki honesuki would be a solid choice

Mizu are very easy to maintain but the finish can vanish really fast and then they get rusty a loooooot
Koishi have an incredible edge retention and good cut properties, I own a gyuto 240 and I love it.
Yuki are really thin behind the edge, w #2 I belive, stainless, crazy sharp, just doesn't hold it so long like the koishi.

Never tried a shimo but I will buy one my self together with the kujira. 😄

Yuki is definitely easy to maintain, it is a really fun knife to sharpen and thin.
Shimo is known for having fantastic grinds, but the cladding is supposedly very reactive.

I might go with the Koishi Honesuki purely because it alone meets the $200 CAD requirement for free shipping. If anyone else has compared Yuki vs. Koishi let me know =)

I own a Koishi honesuki. It is a fine knife - well made and and good for its intended purpose. It is, however, not a single bevel construction as honesukis traditionally are.

I have owned a few other Masakage knives and I have generally been very disappointed. I have had two koishi gyutos. They were bend and very bad cutters and I send them both back. I have a 180 yuki gyuto. I have thinned it a lot as it was very thin behind the edge. So I have to say that I´m not a fan despite that I think I gave the knives a fair chance.
- Kim

^ When you say 'very bad cutters' in what way did they not perform for you?

I'm gonna give a koishi 180 gyuto a shot. Not expecting much for 180 bucks but looking for a small chopper. Hoping to be pleasantly surprised.

preizzo said:

Yuki are really thin behind the edge, w #2 I belive, stainless, crazy sharp, just doesn't hold it so long like the koishi.

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A Yuki 240mm gyuto has probably been my most disappointing knife purchase. I was upgrading from a MAC and had done research, watched videos, and was really excited and sold on the knife. First carbon and first wa handled knife. It has very, very thick shoulders meaning it would wedge badly on anything taller than a halved carrot. I like the handle a lot and the knife feels good to sharpen. But I quickly bought a Hiromoto AS 240 and used that as my work knife. And have since bought a few other knives. I've tried to thin it out some but it still doesn't perform well and I've basically given up. Don't see why the effort would be worth it since it will never be a daily driver.

Just my experience. I know the knives vary and I've seen some choil shots that are very thin. But the one I purchased was a clunker and I would rather use a MAC or a Shun.

^ that's amazing - so much e-gush on these knives being mega thin behind the edge

JDA - I share your experience. I have a yuki gyuto and it had the same problems before heavy thinning. Its still not a great knife...
- Kim

Have you read the glowing review by money here on the kkf forums about the yuki? I'm honestly wondering if there is a wide range on these knives whether you get a super thin one behind the edge or a wedging one. I trust Mikey's take on Knives a good deal so for there to be such an in love review and someone else had a totally **** one is interesting.

Personal experience, the two that I've used were badass cutters, as was the koishi and shimo. Kurosaki makes the Shimo and his stuff is exceptional.... Except the cladding on the Shimo is one of the worst I've tried. It just turns yellow and brown, no pretty patina or nice blues, just ugly yellow and brown

http://www.kitchenknifeforums.com/showthread.php/24101-Review-Masakage-Yuki-240-Gyuto

Link to the review where he specifically mentions low wedging and just all around excellent performance. His "go to" knife for hard root vegetables

Rick (Pensacola Tiger) enjoyed his as well and that guy has had enough great knives through his hands than probably half of us combined

I had a koishi Gyuto for a while. Amazing edge retention and crazy thin behind the edge. I sold it because I didn't like the flex the blade had near the edge. But for the price it's a fantastic knife.

On the Yuki note it definitely sounds like there is large variation between the blades, I have a Yuki and I enjoy it (I thinned it a good amount near the tip though). Overall a good knife I think for the value and its a good one to learn thinning on.

Think I will go ahead and grab the Koishi Honesuki for $150, since I've been looking for a thicker blade to do poultry work. Unless anyone has a suggestion for something better in that <$150 range =)

I have the Koishi honesuki, and I think it's a great performer. The edge retention is very good and I have found it very easy to sharpen. I was breaking down dozens of birds a day in prep and also breaking whole birds to order during service. Despite all that daily use I would only have to sharpen once every week or week and a half. I used it to go through some joints and I'm sure I hit the breastbone plenty of times taking the breasts off but it didn't seem to slow the knife down at all.

Also worth mentioning is that it is quite low maintenance, many times it would sit with bird juices drying on it for a few minutes and it has yet to develop any rust.

Just my two cents, I have no experience with any of the other Masakage lines or knives.

I had a Koishi gyuto--liked it very much. Sold it when I bought something that I liked a bit better, but the Koishi was a very solid performer for me.

I have a few masakge knives shimo petty and gyuto 10/10 amazing knives patina is an issue, force one with instant coffee and move on. Helps immensly isnt as visually pretty. But who cares. Mizu, ultra thin great value, have a petty 75mm and its my go to for coring berries and other small tasks. Kumo is my moms petty. Stunning damascus , comparable to the mizu for performace, slightly thicker and kindof pricy $200 for a 75mm petty cad. Koishi 300mm suji, thick powerful impressive slicer. There is also a koishi variant that looks like the zero series. I bet it performs well. Might try the kujira. I want one but I'm going to go in and look at it. Over $500 for a San mai knife is pretty pricy. But it's a cool bloodroot blade esqe concept.

bonestter said:

^ When you say 'very bad cutters' in what way did they not perform for you?

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I meant that they didn´t cut well. My yuki had very broad sholders and needed a lot of thinning before being any good with things taller than 1 cm. My koishis - I tried two - didn´t cut through dencer stuff very well. I had them both returned ad they were also bend. I think maybe the blades were warped and hence didn´t cut well. It was in the very beginning of my discovery of knives better than Globals - so I wasn´t too good at detecting the problems at the time. I was fortunate enough to see Maksim shortly after buying one of them, and he told me to send the knife back. There was a video made that can be found on youtube. We compared a DT ITK, my Koishi gyuto and an Itinomonn kasumi gyuto vs a white cabbage. I also have a Koishi honesuki and that is a great and well made knife that cuts well.

Pulled the trigger on a Koishi Honesuki (they said they had one more not available on website, but you can order direct through phone)!

KimBronnum said:

I meant that they didn´t cut well. My yuki had very broad sholders and needed a lot of thinning before being any good with things taller than 1 cm. My koishis - I tried two - didn´t cut through dencer stuff very well. I had them both returned ad they were also bend. I think maybe the blades were warped and hence didn´t cut well. It was in the very beginning of my discovery of knives better than Globals - so I wasn´t too good at detecting the problems at the time. I was fortunate enough to see Maksim shortly after buying one of them, and he told me to send the knife back. There was a video made that can be found on youtube. We compared a DT ITK, my Koishi gyuto and an Itinomonn kasumi gyuto vs a white cabbage. I also have a Koishi honesuki and that is a great and well made knife that cuts well.

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I believe [video=youtube;2M8wPdX2240]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2M8wPdX2240[/video]...

2 cents: My Koishi 240mm gyuto cuts just fine. Seems to be some irregularities from knife to knife.

I also have the 150mm Honesuki and it's great. I've broken down dozens of chickens with it and it just keeps going.

Interesting video, have seen it before but didn't immediately recognize the knife as a Masakage Koishi. That said, I find that very odd in that the one I used didn't pause one bit splitting a squash, a football sized sweet potato or a whole head of cauliflower. Usually these things are enough to give most knives pause but the Koishi is one of the few I've used that cut all of these with such authority.

Just proving another data point of someone who has had a good experience, great actually with this brand multiple times.

I know it's entirely personal but of the variety of people that have had Masakage's go through their hands that I've known first hand (friends and co-workers, I work for a very large food company so a healthy amount of knife nuts/chefs/hobbyists) they have enjoyed them. Overall they were excellent knives. My only bad data point was a Mizu that I saw where the crappy plastic ferrule thing was loose, blade itself was fine and a good cutter but the POS plastic ferrule needed to be glued back in place as a temporary fix before replacing the handle and ferrule entirely.

Reviving this thread! Knifewear Masakage sale starts tomorrow

Has anyone used a Shimo sujihiki? I'm trying to stop adding to my 240mm gyuto redundancy...looking at other options

Anyone planning on getting a Kujira? Seems like there's some variations on what the blade looks like in photos - the listings at Knifewear make it look burnished or almost rusted or something, and then other pics on the web show it as a fairly nice muted damascus pattern. Curious to see what to expect OOTB, or does this one get better with age?

I bought one kujira today. Spoke with the guy at knifewear and seem that they don't have to many of them so pulled the trigger. Found one that suits me so I didn't care so much about the lower price.. Will post next week when I gonna get it. &#128517;

foody518 said:

Reviving this thread! Knifewear Masakage sale starts tomorrow

Has anyone used a Shimo sujihiki? I'm trying to stop adding to my 240mm gyuto redundancy...looking at other options

Anyone planning on getting a Kujira? Seems like there's some variations on what the blade looks like in photos - the listings at Knifewear make it look burnished or almost rusted or something, and then other pics on the web show it as a fairly nice muted damascus pattern. Curious to see what to expect OOTB, or does this one get better with age?

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Didn't know there were so many Masakage lines before seeing the Knifewear page. I knew the Yuki, Koishis and the VG10s, but there seems to be a lot more than that. Anything other worth eyeing?

I have a Yuki honesuki which I really like and use it once to twice a week.

guari said:

Didn't know there were so many Masakage lines before seeing the Knifewear page. I knew the Yuki, Koishis and the VG10s, but there seems to be a lot more than that. Anything other worth eyeing?

I have a Yuki honesuki which I really like and use it once to twice a week.

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More likely than not I'll use this discount as a chance to pick up a Shimo, just trying to figure out which one.
Mizu is the most budget line, KU iron clad Blue 2
Hikari I think is discontinued?
Kiri and Kumo are VG10 damascus patterned
Kujira has various scrap metal folded and pattern welded to form the cladding, Blue 2 core steel
Zero is a bling line, western handle desert ironwood, stainless clad AS, some kind of tsuchime

@preizzo nice! I guess you were concerned about it selling out day 1? I look forward to reading what you think of it!