First Carbon Chef Knife

So this is my first post! I just graduated college (Johnson & Wales Charlotte) and I want to get myself a proper knife to use in a kitchen.Right now I have a Mercer Chef Knife and I am tired of it. I want a carbon knife that has better steel quality in terms of chips and edge retention.

LOCATION
What country are you in?
USA


KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chef’s knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?
Chef's
Are you right or left handed?
Right
Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?
Japanese
What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?
8 in - 9 in.
Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)
No
What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?
$450


KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?
Professional
What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)
slicing, dicing, veg, light breakdown of protein (Not going through bones)

What knife, if any, are you replacing?
Mercer Chef's
Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.)
Pinch
What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)
Rock, Push and Pull
What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)
chipping. My knife chips no matter what I do.
Better aesthetics (e.g., a certain type of finish; layered/Damascus or other pattern of steel; different handle color/pattern/shape/wood; better scratch resistance; better stain resistance)?
aesthetics are nice but I want a knife that preforms well
Comfort (e.g., lighter/heavier knife; better handle material; better handle shape; rounded spine/choil of the knife; improved balance)?
rounded choil, good balance
Ease of Use (e.g., ability to use the knife right out of the box; smoother rock chopping, push cutting, or slicing motion; less wedging; better food release; less reactivity with food; easier to sharpen)?
less wedging, food release isn't that big of a deal to me
Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)?
Not sure about this one but maybe a few weeks or more



KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)
Bamboo, looking to upgrade as well
Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)
Starting to learn and get better but Im not that good yet
If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)
In getting better yes.
Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)
I have the Bob Kramer Sharpening Stone set


SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS
Ive held the Kramer knives at Sur la Table and liked the weight and the handle. I do know there is a knife made by Haburn that is still on his site but should I get that as my first splash into this wonderful world?
Thank yall for your input and help!!

If you want a carbon knife that won't wedge in anything and don't care about food release, it sounds like you want a "laser." Recommend any of the following:

- Ashi Ginga 240 w#2 (Gesshin house brand from JKI, if you can get it)
- Ikkanishi Tadatsuna 240 w#2
- Sakai Yusuke 240 w#2

Of these the only one in stock I can find is the Tadatsuna :http://yhst-27988581933240.stores.y...a-wa-gyuto-240mm-white-steel-balde-kn240.html

A note about chipping . . . A Japanese knife will, as a general rule, be harder than the knives you are using. While it will take a keener edge and have better edge retention, it may be more brittle and therefore chip prone if proper technique is not utilized. You said you rock chop a lot. That can be dangerous with Japanese knives if you do not take care to avoid "torquing" (applying lateral stress) to the blade while rocking. It can be typical to see micorchipping at the pivot point if not done correctly. You will see them and learn how to correct. The good news is that white steel at 61 HrC is not a chippy steel, at least in my experience.

It won't have the edge retention capabilities as blue 1 or 2 or blue super. So you may want to explore knives using those steels as well. But with the very thin grind on the laser it will seem sharper longer.

Finally, looks like the spine/choil on the tadatsuna don't come rounded but you can do it yourself in about 10 minutes with a few different grits of automotive sandpaper.

Good luck and enjoy

Honestly I would Email James about this http://www.knivesandstones.com/tana...o-240mm-with-custom-octagonal-bubinga-handle/ It's arguably the best bang for your buck chef knife on the planet. If you can't wait this http://www.knivesandstones.com/syou...-aogami-super-stainless-cladding-by-kurosaki/ is a really nice blade, both are significantly under budget and well made, I have yet to chip either and I am basically a savage in the kitchen, both would leave you some funds to buy other stuff, whether that's stones, a new board, or another knife(both these guys make excellent petty knives, so does takamura), I chose James as the US/AUD is really really good right now, so you'd be getting a good deal. Haburn is defiantly a good knife, better than what I listed(I don't even own a Haburn, but he is legend) working in a kitchen I wouldn't want my only knife to be a $700 ish blade, especially starting out . Anyways welcome to the forum, I look forward to seeing you around. :knife:

Thank y'all for the quick replies! I am always working on my form and knife skills in the kitchen. I will look further at the recommendations and see what I come up with! :running:

I know you're looking to upgrade but are you sure you're prepared for the extra care you'll need to give a carbon steel knive particularly used in a professional environment ? I don't know your menu or requirements. There are excellent options worth considering in your price range that will require less constant attention other than carbon .

I applaud your interest in quality cutlery (hard not to improve on Mercer) but will suggest that you get to the deep end by going thru the shallow end.

You prob don't want flashy to start. The expression that "you don't want a better knife than your chef" is valid. You also don't want more knife than you know how to use. A +400 knife would be the most expensive knife in most kitchens. Are you going to be the best cutter?

I like having a laser and would not be without one - but a laser would not be my first knife. IMO a mid range with a little heft will prove more versatile.

The Tanaka from James suggested above is a good choice though I prefer the Ginsan stainless variant to the carbon. I picked up a 210 from James and liked it well enough that I bought a 240 as well. They both hold an edge well, no wedging to speak of and little stiction. And I can leave them alone for a minute if I need to.

There are other good quality knives in and near this price range, enjoy the search - it's half the fun.

Finally suggest you

I'll agree that the Tanaka Ginsan is a great value. I think it performs as well as knives that cost twice as much, or more. I've also heard very good things about the Blue #2 version, but haven't used it.
The 240 Ginsan is in stock right now--I think it's a knife that you can grow with for quite a while.
I'd also strongly suggest you get control of the chipping issue before spending too much on a knife. You'd probably be very upset if you chipped your new $400+ knife. I don't know all that much about Mercers, but they seem to be made of German steel that should be pretty tough (though it appears they have a number of lines, so maybe you have a harder steel that has a greater chance of chipping).

Congrats on the graduation and welcome to the world of fun knives.

+1 to the Tanaka...I would add Watanabe

I agree that starting out flashy to start would not be the best route. When I went and saw some of his work... I couldn't help myself but drool!! Im still looking into a few knives that y'all recommended and hopefully something will be at my door in the next few weeks or so!

So I've looked around and I have come down to four knives. They are as follows (in no particular order):
Syousin Chiku KU Gyuto 240mm Aogami Super, Stainless Cladding by Yu Kurosaki
Syousin Chiku Migaki Gyuto 210mm Aogami Super, Stainless Clad by Yu Kurosaki
Tanaka Ginsanko (Ginsanko, G3) Nashiji Gyuto 240mm
Tanaka VG10 Nashiji Gyuto 240mm

Two are in stock and two are not. Three are 240 and one is 210 mm. How would the stainless clad effect the knife performance and would that be a good knife to start out on? Ive heard good things about both Tanaka's. I have heard some people have trouble worth the VG10. Im not the best sharpener yet but I am honing my technique! Just wanting some input on how they compare. The profiles are different with the Syousin being a little shorter and lighter. Thank y'all for the help!

I heard that Tanaka might not be making the ginsako any more.

Kochi.
By "first carbon chef knife" I took that as non-stainless but Kochi has both carbon and stainless clad carbon.

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.c:/om/products/kochi-240mm-kurouchi-wa-gyuto

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/products/kochi-210mm-kurouchi-wa-gyuto

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.co...240mm-kurouchi-stainless-clad-carbon-wa-gyuto

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/products/kochi-210mm-kurouchi-stainless-clad-carbon-wa-gyuto

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/products/kochi-240mm-migaki-wa-gyuto

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/products/kochi-210mm-migaki-wa-gyuto

If you are looking at JKI knives give Jon a call. He will walk you thru the good and bad of the knives you have listed and may recommend something you have not thought of.

That you for your responses. I first wanted a carbon knife but I was differed to go more towards a stainless for a professional environment. I did not know I could call him so Ill do that! I really do look forward to entering into this world of knives. Especially since it comes in handy in my profession!

HuntforFood said:

That you for your responses. I first wanted a carbon knife but I was differed to go more towards a stainless for a professional environment. I did not know I could call him so Ill do that! I really do look forward to entering into this world of knives. Especially since it comes in handy in my profession!

Click to expand...

So, what did you go for in the end?

Considering that you're in the US, looking for carbon, have a relatively high budget and do rock chopping i'd recommend a Bob Kramer carbon steel chef knife.
Just to have one more option and make your decision harder.

To follow up the Thread I bought the Tanaka Blue 2 240 mm. gyuto! I got the Ebony handle because, well, I wanted it. Im excited to get my hands on it. If a Ginsako version pops up I WILL get it, if I can. Excited to start the journey!