Hattori KD...why all the hype?

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labor of love

labor of love

Cowboys from Hell
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I'm curious why these knives are in such high demand. They look pretty ordinary. Wear resistant stainless, fancy cladding, pretty pedestrian profile and grind. Are they expensive just because they're really hard to find?
 
hattori hd series is as crappy as shun and i don't see anything potentially special from the kd series photos/specs. there are other knives with pretty damascus patterns if that's what you're into, so why all the hype?
 
Not answering the question, but I will say I'm not a fan of the bolster/handles, thought others seem to love them.

Someone who owned one told me the handles are a bit on the small side also.

Be best to ask the guys who own one to see what they think of the grinds. I know gic has a gyuto. Don't see many of them for sale these days so definitely a true unicorn.
 
Why don't we wait until the one on B/S/T sells before we comment on them?
 
Or better yet, maybe put our energy to more productive uses than trashing something based purely on conjecture, possibly in the aim of making oneself feel better that they're not missing out on anything.

(Disclosure: not obsessed with or looking to get a KD)
 
Not to long ago the Hattori KD was considered the paragon of high end kitchen cutlery. The smith (Mr. Ichiro Hattori) is very well respected and in his 70s. He rarely makes knives these days and spends most of his efforts teaching his knife making and techniques to young craftsmen. The steel itself was one of the many "super steels", the fact it is also no longer in production adds to it allure. Its a simple case of supply and demand
 
Rarity, its a retired master smith(kinda like keijiro doi) but instead of yanagis its gyutos so its more in demand. Exotic steel and damascus definatly play a factor. Think regular kramer vs damascus 5k used to 25k. But its price is 50-70% rarity i dont know what a 240 sold for on jck im guessing 800-$1200 given the steel and damascus, wooden kiri box etc. Im surprised it isnt on the bay, hed probably of sold it by now. This is a blade that will appriciate beyond $2500 in 10-15 years time once the bladesmith passes i wouldnt be suprised if this was a 10k blade auctioned off to collectors never to see a drop of food :'( i also have no issue saying its most likely a very very good knife cowry-x is basically a more exotic zdp-189 just more expensive and i think slightly higher in carbon(too lazy to look up) if i was a celebrity chef with millions of dollars id buy one and use it. For now its just me and my takamura uchi.
 
labor of love said:
I'm curious why these knives are in such high demand. They look pretty ordinary. Wear resistant stainless, fancy cladding, pretty pedestrian profile and grind. Are they expensive just because they're really hard to find?
Click to expand...

Yeah...I think the fact that they are quite hard to find is the main reason why the price is so high. I once saw a 210 gyuto appeared on a Japanese website for approximately $1500USD couple months ago, however I didn't pulled the trigger because I am not a big fan of the KD series. They probably are not as bad as panda said they are, but I just don't think they worth more than Kato, Shigefusa, and Tsukasa. <-- again, just my opinion.
 
I think worth it has to do with how you view your collection and what you're looking to get out of it in the future.

There are makers and knives out there that will appreciate with time much like wine or cars. If you're purchasing knives with this in mind the worth is actually calculable. If you're just looking for another knife to experience the geometry and steel and compare it to others as a cutter you would be hard pressed to find value there.
 
I always enjoy sharpening KD's. It's a super hard powered steel that sharpens on stones like white#1...buttery....and it deburrs super clean with an aggressive edge even from polishing stones.

Users have always complimented on edge retention being very high and of course the knives look good and they have great F&F too....plus the damascus is stainless.

They were worth the price charged when new.
 
From japanesechefsknife.com:


Without any compromises, Traditional Craftsman, Mr. Hattori has devoted all his energies, times, experiences and techniques to create these beautiful Chef's knives, using ancient forging technique of the swordmaking. Each blade is hand forged fromCowry X core steel with Nickel Stainless Damascus steel. Cowry X is the tough powdered metal alloy specially developed by Daido Steel Company for high performance cutting tools. It contains high carbon (3%) and high Chromium (20%) with 1% Molybdenum and 0.3% Vanadium, and can be heat treated to HRC63 to 67 without brittleness.
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The pattern comes from this:
The Cowry X Steel blank is hand drilled and hammered repeatedly to create beautiful Damascus design.
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Img386.jpg


Img500.jpg




The handle:
Sturdy black linen Micarta handle enhanced with nickel silver bolster and rivets, fits perfectly with your hand and is water and shrinkage proof.
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Img151.jpg
 
Honestly a good majority of the blades seen in these parts are over the top, so while the KD isn't for me, to each their own. I've had more than my share of near $500 knives and feel that honestly, anything over $300 is going into big boy toy territory. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but the best Japanese chefs I've worked with who had incredible skill never used anything nicer than Suisin IH for example. At least the KD seems to invest most it's decadence in the damn blade, I just don't get the handle thing.....
 
Didn't the 240 gyuto sell for around $300 when new?..

I'm a big fan of the KD series, but let's be honest. It's not that special. It's a collectors piece but not worth what it sells for these days.
 
I wrote in the other B/S/T thread this about the KD knife

Personally don't care much about ridiculously priced knives based on rarity (i.e. Kramer)

In one of my responses I referred to the lore of his career about how it sort of represented a pinnacle of his career because he had spent so much of his life making hunting/combat knives, and only entering kitchen knife making toward the end of it. He want didn't compete with his families company Masahiro but he did the three lines The HD, KD, and FH (KF Forums series) before retiring due to age and health concerns.

All the stuff I mentioned about his life is here. Its pretty neat.

http://hattoricollector.com/

The steel was rare (Cowry X) and no longer made.

No more blades will ever be made.

His construction process was supposed to be precise and detailed.
Especially how he created the Damascus pattern. He drilled holes in every blank and hammered it to get the damascus pattern.

JfCLrDY.png


I couldn't imagine drilling little holes into each blank without going through the other side and neatly. It doesn't look like it was done by a CNC machine but by hand. It must of taken forever.

I guess these could all be compelling reasons to own a KD.
 
Dave Martell said:
I've been asked to more than a few times but I always get out of it when I say that I can't offer the exact shape. :D
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It looks like the tang tapers a bit like a production Kramer, not as dramatic but its still there. I have no idea, how you would ever get the wood to fit on a tang that tapers.
 
I have a little 135mm KD. It's my very favorite knife for putting up tomatoes (I blanch, peel, quarter and freeze them.) I don't know what it is about the knife, but it's super nimble coring, cutting out bad spots, etc. The micarta handle is perfect for a task where it's going to spend hours soaking in tomato juice. Its biggest flaw is the spine wasn't rounded at all (and we have wabi-sabi where I got impatient with a sharp spine.) BUT--I would say I can put up tomatoes about 20% faster with the KD than with any other knife I own. It's like driving a sports car vs. a big spongy luxury sedan, even when comparing with similar sized knives.
 
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