Nenohi's - Not much love?

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S-Line

S-Line

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Being a chef in the sushi industry, almost all of my fellow sushi chefs dream of owning a nenohi one day. Few actually forked over the money and got one (or a few) and to them, it's almost like it's the pinnacle of sushi knives. Yet.. it gets so little love/discussions here on the boards. I've done a search and there are only a handful of post about nenohis.

Why is it that they get so little attention here? I've handled a few of my co-worker's knives (a corian handle honesuki and also a 300mm kaede) and they're very very well made. The fit and finish I would say even surpasses my SIH. I know it's not the price of entry as I've seen way more fancier knives here on this forum. So why do they get so little love...?
 
You don't own a Nenohi for the performance, you own it for the brand. They marketed themselves to the "I saw Morimoto using one on Iron Chef" demographic with the Nenox, which is all well and good, but most enthusiasts (like those who congregate here) are skeptical about a slab of VG-1 being offered for $500. That skepticism spilled into their other offerings, which are--for the most part--arguably overpriced as well.
 
I was under the impression that only the Nenox g-types were VG-1. I don't think the traditional nenohi's are made of the same steel, someone correct me if I'm wrong.
 
Sorry, I used the "VG-1" tag as a generic slight to their steel. I don't think anyone's settled for sure on what they're using these days; they designate all their stainless knives (S1, G-type, Kaede IIRC) as "high carbon stain resistant" and, for the most part, they all behave roughly in the VG-1 / VG-10 range, with minor differences depending on the hands holding the knife. I'd bet my car on the S1 I used for a few months being poorly treated VG-10.

The problem is, they busted into the U.S. market with a flashy knife, gave them to a bunch of celebrity chefs, and they dropped a lot of panties. Once the dust settled, though, and the market expanded, people realized they had a mediocre knife with mediocre steel, a mediocre heat treat, a mediocre grind, and exceptionally good looks. Was that worth the $600? The decline in conversation about Nenohi over the last 6 years should answer the question. The Hattori FH was designed as a direct competitor to the S1, and gave you a damn similar product at a fraction of the cost.

So while they do make a wide range of other products--neat "traditional" knives in white and blue steel--many people around here see the brand as "nice, but not for the price," and aren't willing to risk the investment.
 
Ahh I didn't know the history behind the brand, had absolutely no idea that they're such a young company. I guess in a way they're like the Beats by Dr.Dre of the headphone world. That would explain why most of the chefs I come across goes gaga over nenohis since they don't know anywhere as much about the knives they use as us knifekuts.

Although I got to admit, I envy his kaede... It's a gorgeous blade, wish I can get a hold of one to try for a shift and put it on the stones to find out for myself on the aspects of performance.

LucasFur said:
the only knife that appealed to me was the cheap honyaki ... untill i read this
http://www.zknives.com/knives/kitchen/ktknv/nenox/nenoxgy270p2.shtml
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I'm pretty sure that the S1 is a monosteel blade and not a true honyaki.
 
Man, that Zknives review gets way to much credit, tired of seeing it. I have used a bunch of knives and my Nenox performs better than a lot of em. Better than a lot of knives that sell on here for $500+ dollars all of which also have a lot of hype or bells & whistles.
 
The only Nenox I've ever owned or used is a 210mm S1 gyuto. While I'm considering parting with mine, that has absolutely nothing to do with its performance. Though I cook at home, baby my knives and their edges, and do nothing like the volume of a professional kitchen, my experience with the S1 contradicts almost everything I've read about it. Edge out of the box was screaming (not that that matters much), edge retention has been outstanding (longer than many of my carbons from U.S. and Japanese makers alike), and the profile, while relatively ordinary, yields a very good cutter that's a jack of most trades if not quite a master of any one. [Full Disclosure: I'm selling mine at the moment, but not for anything related to performance].

If there's a problem with Nenox, it can be summed up in one word for me: provenance. At the Nenox price point, you're in Shigefusa territory, where you're getting exceptional performance and a more subtle but certainly no less beautiful knife made by a craftsman rather than a conglomerate.

I know a lot less about the Nenohi single bevels. Their honyakis are stunning, but their brand reputation is diluted by the Kaede and Keyaki offerings (really expensive tool steels), and their lower lines (like the dentoukougeishi) are priced at about 30% more than competitors who are likely using the same Sakai artisans for some components and offering equal or better fit-and-finish, e.g. Gesshin Hide.
 
I've owned a couple of Nenox blades, and they are nice, but nothing special. They are essentially equivalent to the Hattori FH Forum knives, but at more than twice the price.
 
i bought a Nenox SG1 270 mm gyuto a few years ago. I have two other 270 mm gyutos, a Hattori and a Suisin Inox Honyaki. The Nenox is comparable in performance to the Hattori but not even close to the Suisin. IMHO the Nenox is WAY overpriced and I'm sure that one can purchase a much better knife for the price of a Nenox. It is a pretty knife. The F&F is very good and it has a very nice handle. I don't use it much any more. I don't sell knives so I'm stuck with it but if I had to do it over again I wouldn't buy it.
 
I have a 240 gyuto bought straight from a visit to "57 Warren Street." I don't have anything bad to say about it, I even carved last Thanksgiving's turkey with it. It been in the rack for several years but I have never really warmed up to it like I have my Shig and others. Edge holding is down my list several notches when I pick a knife because I resharpen without really thinking about it much . Fit and finish is great so if the style is something you like I would just go for it.
 
easy13 said:
Man, that Zknives review gets way to much credit, tired of seeing it.
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Lol.

panda said:
They're fancier shuns.
Click to expand...

That's basically it. And there isn't a lot of love for Shuns around here either, which run for about 1/5 the cost of a Nenohi.

We had a Shun float through the kitchen for about 5 years that was, ostensibly, the best knife in the house stable. Doesn't mean I'd spend a single cent of my own money on one, let alone one that cost 500% more.
 
Self proclaimed Nenox Ironwood fanboy here.

I bought the 240 gyuto for $225 on Ebay and would do it again if the opportunity arose. I used it daily for at least 4 years. I dropped it, used cheap diamond steels on it a couple times daily...went through cases upon cases of lobster heads, thousands of pounds of red fish scales....cleaned thousands of pounds of beef....

Ive always went against the grain though...liked things outta the norm...

At the end of the day, for me, it kicked ass. It was admired by other cooks and even had a sous chef buy a couple. Sure...call it a status symbol or whatever but it performed very very well and stayed shape as hell through professional abuse/ real wear and tear.
 
Nenohi is a lot more than Nenox. While Nenox are very well made knives, I feel like there are better values out there for one's money. Nenohi Single beveled knives are a whole other story. They use most of the best craftsmen in Sakai for the forging, polishing, sharpening, handle construction and saya production available. The price is high but the work that goes into them demands it. Anyone who has used one of their Honyaki Kataba knives knows there is not a whole lot more that can be done to improve it.
 
S-Line said:
Being a chef in the sushi industry, almost all of my fellow sushi chefs dream of owning a nenohi one day. Few actually forked over the money and got one (or a few) and to them, it's almost like it's the pinnacle of sushi knives. Yet.. it gets so little love/discussions here on the boards. I've done a search and there are only a handful of post about nenohis.

Why is it that they get so little attention here? I've handled a few of my co-worker's knives (a corian handle honesuki and also a 300mm kaede) and they're very very well made. The fit and finish I would say even surpasses my SIH. I know it's not the price of entry as I've seen way more fancier knives here on this forum. So why do they get so little love...?
Click to expand...

Nenohi makes both Nenox and Nenohi single bevel knives. They have two very different target markets with these. Various Nenox (almost exclusively double bevel) lines are mainly designed for professionals in western style food industry. "Oh but they got that thick grind and so expensive!!!" Yea, it is expensive if you get their higher end stuff with ironwood, giraffe bone and mammoth molar handles. But they also have less fancy handled G-types that will not break your bank, won't chip easily and handle so many tough kitchen tasks that you will not pull out your lasers and high carbon knives out for.

Nenohi single bevels are pretty much what jklip said above. You get what you paid for with these, and i bet this is why many sushi chefs recognize both the brand and the product.
 
I have the red handle S1 utility knife and it is beautiful and pleasure to hold but I cannot see anything special about the blade.
 
adam92 said:
I love the feedback so much, very detailed!! never knew Nenohi steel is suck when comparing to others, seems like overpriced & overrated brand, only the F&F is good.
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I don't have one, but some chef/knife nerd friends of mine love them. Not on my immediate 'must buy' list, but would love to land one eventually—need a stainless—they're beautifully crafted knives, steel is decent enough, an iconic design IMO. I've mostly carbon KU knives, only stainless that have been in my kitchen were ux10 (hardly used) and Tanaka ginsan (didn't like, so gave it away).
 
i guess a lot of this thread sort of answers the op's question in a roundabout way. he was asking about sushi knives and everyone immediately wanted to talk about their experience with gyutos. in a sense that sort of answers why their knives are not as discussed here as they are with sushi chefs....their single bevels appear to be pretty outstanding and their double bevels more mass market orientated - and this forum is very gyuto orientated. I have never used their knives, but that is the impression I have always had from looking at their knives.
 
Barry's Knives said:
i guess a lot of this thread sort of answers the op's question in a roundabout way. he was asking about sushi knives and everyone immediately wanted to talk about their experience with gyutos. in a sense that sort of answers why their knives are not as discussed here as they are with sushi chefs....their single bevels appear to be pretty outstanding and their double bevels more mass market orientated - and this forum is very gyuto orientated. I have never used their knives, but that is the impression I have always had from looking at their knives.
Click to expand...

Yeah, sorry, new to the thread and didn't read previous comments. A Japanese sushi chef I know often just uses a gyuto at work, even for sashimi. Depending on mood at home, it's either yanagi, suji or gyuto to cut up sashimi. Admittedly, I've never cut with a Nenox, only held them.
 
I have a Nenox S1 270 mm gyuto, a Hatorri 270, and a Suisin Inox Honyaki 270. They’re all very nice knives IMHO. I’m a home cook and a little anal about keeping my knives very sharp. I regularly hone them with a borosilicate honing rod followed by stropping on a CrO2 loaded strop. I rarely need to go to the stones. So my main gripe is not about Nenox’s edge holding ability, I just wish that (at this price point) the spine and choil could be more rounded. Small gripe and I do like the Nenox. I also collect kitchen knives, I have about 60 knives (for this forum that’s not a lot) and I like to use them all. The Suisin Inox Honyaki is one of my favorites but I also love the Nenox. Hell, I love all my knives 🙂
 
I vaguely remember reading somewhere that Nenohi's white-steel lines are made by Yoshikazu Ikeda. Their website lists their carbon-steel single-bevel honyaki knives (both white and blue) as being made by Yoshikazu Ikeda and Shinpei Ino.

I can't say anything about them myself, though, as I've never used one.
 
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I thing it all depends what you are looking for. The Nenox line are well made knives, that work as expected, but nothing exceptional, the different handle materials are what sets them apart and adds to the price. Most of the Nenohi are a very different knife, made by skilled craftsman. I have a Nenox 165mm Yo-Deba with the Corian handle and a 285 S-1 Sujiihiki with a wood handle, bought both in Japan, no complaints about either one. I also have a Nenohi 270 S1 Wa-Kiritsuke, which feels similar to my Susin 270 Inox Honyaki Gyuto, the special one though is the 270 Ao-ko Highest Kasumi Kiritsuke, beautiful knife
 
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