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Thread: Buttermilk Supply Issue

  1. #21
    Senior Member chinacats's Avatar
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    I happen to see things as going in an overall positive direction. Sure, there are issues occasionally but I see far fewer makers doing the long wait list with large deposits of days past. I look at it more as being fortunate to be a member here where you're pretty much hearing about it as soon as someone drops out of the system...if you'd just stumbled onto Sam's website and tried to buy a knife it would be quite an unpleasant experience and you'd of gotten no warning at all..at least here, people speak up.

    As to Pierre, that's a whole other thing.

    once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right

  2. #22
    Senior Member Jovidah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mise_en_place View Post
    I'm going to disagree. Until recently, nobody had much to say in terms of negative feedback and this sort of negative feedback only starts to show up for catastrophic ****-ups on the vendor/maker's end.

    I've dealt with vendors here that while they actually provide a service for the money you give them, they are awful at communication, willfully ignore you for months on end, charge different forum members different pricing per mm (for same style of knife), etc. These kinds of things NEVER show up on sub-forums because it's extremely uncommon and confrontational for a member on this site to open X maker's sub-forum and say: "I loved the knife but later I found out X charged me $.50 more a mm than another person who ordered a knife at the same time. X asked for all my money up front and didn't deliver the knife for 13 months; all the while being terrible at communication."

    Vendors like I described above are highly lauded and have plenty of forum fan boys who would step in and say, "Hey, man. This knife thing is a hobby for X, so issues are bound to come up," or "He's had family issues!" I'm commissioning a knife for hundreds of dollars, not a wax candle. And who hasn't had family issues?

    Despite the legal implications (of which I think Matus is greatly overestimating, but please, somebody, correct me if I'm wrong), the fact that inactive and some untrustworthy people continue to be "Site Vendors" implies that KKF is giving some sort of sponsorship, approval, or stamp of approval. If I didn't know better from interacting with some excellent vendors/makers on this site, I'd assume the status as a KKF approved vendor means jack $hit. I would also go so far to imagine responsible vendors don't like being associated with the irresponsible because it makes them look bad.
    Fair points. I think at the root it comes down to the complicated and somewhat conflicting relationship between the forum and the vendors. The fact that vendors are in a way paying customers of this forum creates a very weird situation.
    Although I think the hesitancy to 'nail people to the cross' also has to do with regular psychology. I don't see an easy way around this cognitive dissonance, even if you created a seperate sub-forum. It results from having more of a personal relationship with the vendors / manufacturers (even by the simple virtue of knowing their name and 'reading their thoughts'). It's contact theory at its best and this is hard to prevent unless you barr vendors from popping up and posting all together. Considering a lot of them ofer 'added value' in sharing their knowledge that doesn't seem like the best way out either.

    Quote Originally Posted by mise_en_place View Post
    Despite my long response above, I think the best way to handle this is to open a reviews sub-forum and encourage people to leave honest and open reviews including details about how well they communicate, how much input do they allow, do they stick to their estimated timelines, and not just how the knife turned out.
    Again, though I don't have a strong opinion either way (like Matus I have no beef in any of these fights) I think the same factors that drive people to spread unwarranted positivism, suck up critique and/or otherwise self-censor would still exist even if you turned it into a seperate sub-forum.

    But Chinacats makes a fair point. At least here there is some signalling function. If you just roamed the net you'd have nothing to go from at all. BMS simply looks like it's still in business.


  3. #23

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    Hi all. As an update, I got two automated alerts from Sam's website. One to say my money was refunded. And the other to say my order was canceled. No word on if my knives would be returned. It's been a week since I received these auto alerts so I gotta assume that my knives are long gone. Naturally, Sam has not returned any calls, emails or other social media pings. I've turned it over to my lawyer now so it's out of my hands.

    I did speak to a person on Facebook that is also hunting down Sam to get back his merchandise. So looks like I'm not alone.

    I've filed a complaint with the BBB as well as the FBI dept on fraudulent websites - per Google's suggestion (if anything, his site should be taken down). I've also posted on Yelp to maybe help others avoid my mistake.

    Thanks for all of the help and advice from this group. I appreciated all of your time and comments. Have a nice week.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Matus's Avatar
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    John, I am sorry to read all that. Please keep us posted if anything new comes up. I hope you will get your knives back.

    In general - for one thing - how comes in this time of internet and instant information on everything, we can not figure out what on earth is going in with Sam.

  5. #25
    Senior Member
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    Best of luck, John.

  6. #26
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    daveb's Avatar
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    I'm sure it's been a tough 6 weeks for you. Good luck to all.
    Older and wider..

  7. #27
    Senior Member
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    Update: Sam got back to me.... Sent me PayPal money request and shipped my knife for free. That said he mentioned expedited shipping and sent it ground parcel but I have a tracking number and it's in Canada now. He didn't respond to any other emails after that though.

  8. #28

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    That's great! If you happen to get a box that has a bunch of extra Shun knives in it, let me know


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