(ahem)..i think: my vintage CAST iron > my DB carbon skillet.

i am not having the best time with my DuBeyer carbon pan. i just dont love it. every time you make a mistake and try something, leave it on too long..etc. and you cause some food to stick beyond wiping with a paper towel..game over. the next try will be a mess if you have to do anything more to wash it clean. i truly just boil away the mess. get it simmering, wad up a paper towel and drop it in and push it around with a wooden spoon. i lose seasoning; precious seasoning every time. i put away both my old Griswold pans to force myself to really give the carbon pan a go. today was the day for corn beef hash. any more corn beef and i will scream but i had to use up the last chunk.

chopped up some beef, some old bake potato, and some cooked cabbage. i used both pans side by side. carbon vs cast. i literally had to wash dust out of the cast since it has been so long. heated them both up, oiled them..dumped in the hash. right away..i just knew it. my carbon pan flipped on the tractor-beam and sucked the food onto the bottom. i did my usually game of "pan-chicken" where i dare myself to not touch it. no stirring, no poking..hoping the bottom crusts over and releases. the carbon pan was like a ice skating rink right from the dump. nothing stuck! granted i think vintage cast kicks ass on the newer stuff..but the difference was profound. in the end i just scraped the food out of the carbon pan and dumped it all into my cast. game over.

fill the carbon with water, wad up some paper towel, and cuss at myself for losing "pan-chicken" yet again.

i have a carbon wok that wont stick chow-fun noodles, so i know it is a possibility. and those noodles are like food velcro.

I know the pain... i have the same fight with my debuyer.

And totally agree on the wok front. Cheap carbon woks seem to take seasoning so easily and nothing sticks.

So you are saying debuyers are the shuns of the pan world.

I love my debuyer carbons....sorry they're not working out for you. Mine definitely sucked the first few months, but 2 years later they're the only skillets I want to use at the house.

rami_m said:

So you are saying debuyers are the shuns of the pan world.

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Actually they're more like the Tojiro DP or Fujiwara FKH. Or even the Victorinox Fibrox... Over here they're dirt cheap. Definitly the best bang for the buck I ever bought in pans, and virtually indestructable.

I actually never encountered much problems; once it has a proper coating its baby-bottom-smooth. The only issue I have occasionally had, is that if you have to clean them up right after cooking. And not because of rust issues. For some reason that I cannot explain when you leave the pan with fats that solidify (like butter for example), the seasoning washes off when you finally when you finally clean the pan.
Otherwise, no issues. Just coat it in a thin layer of linseed oil, heat (either in oven or on stove), repeat. I've even made fatty pancakes with bacon & cheese in them, no problems.

Jovidah said:

Actually they're more like the Tojiro DP or Fujiwara FKH. Or even the Victorinox Fibrox... Over here they're dirt cheap. Definitly the best bang for the buck I ever bought in pans, and virtually indestructable.

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Jovidah, would you mind giving me an idea of how much would they cost over there? And you are talking about local stores or online?

If you shop around a bit you can get the 28cm for 25 euros (I got it for 20 in a good sale) and the 32cm for about 30-ish euros (or slightly less on a good sale). Since they're used a lot in restaurants they're on sale quite often at restaurant wholesalers. They actually have the best prices for these pans. There are a few online retailers selling them but they're generally not the cheapest - unless they are targetted at restaurants and food retailers.

That's the Acier Carbone model by the way. Oddly enough most big consumer stores choose to sell the more expensive Mineral-B version. Which is the exact same pan with some beeswax on it just so it won't rust in the store. Total rip-off.

In comparison, the cheapest 'plain' cast iron pan here is the Lodge Logic, but it tends to still for around 50 euros for a 26cm model. Around 70 for the 30cm model.

Jovidah said:

If you shop around a bit you can get the 28cm for 25 euros (I got it for 20 in a good sale) and the 32cm for about 30-ish euros (or slightly less on a good sale). Since they're used a lot in restaurants they're on sale quite often at restaurant wholesalers.

That's the Acier Carbone model by the way. Oddly enough most stores choose to sell the more expensive Mineral-B version. Which is the exact same pan with some beeswax on it just so it won't rust in the store. Total rip-off.

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Thx, you are right I can't see that model around here only the mineral-B and it didn't seem dirt cheap to me. Will look around for the acier and see if I can find some interesting price.

Yeah I'd steer away from the Mineral-B. You're paying a hefty premium (1,5 to twice the cost usually) just for some beeswax which you're actually instructed to remove before first usage. It's paying more for more trouble.
But really restaurant supply stores is where you should go for the cheaper model. Even if deBuyer isn't as cheap there (due to shipping across atlantic) I'm sure you can find a more local comparable alternative. There really isn't any reason these pans should be as expensive as they're sometimes sold for.

I don't know. I've got the Min B and for 60ish a pan I like em. Cast iron does take seasoning better and lasts forever but it takes three guys to more it from the pantry to the stove.

Boom, if you want to put a stamp on it, I'll buy the stamp

It all evens out imo... Cast iron takes longer to get a good seasoning a holds on to it longer. While carbon steel is both easier to apply and lose. Sure carbon steel is not as uniform looking, but the performance is nearly the same.

daveb said:

I don't know. I've got the Min B and for 60ish a pan I like em. Cast iron does take seasoning better and lasts forever but it takes three guys to more it from the pantry to the stove.

Boom, if you want to put a stamp on it, I'll buy the stamp

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Well I'm not saying it's a bad pan. Heck, it's a great pan. The problem is that it's exactly the same pan, just a whole lot more expensive.

I'd take an old, beat up, unmarked mystery cast iron pan over a debuyers any day. I absolutely love never cleaning my cast irons with anything but super hot water​. The seasoning is worth more than the pan itself in terms of non-adhesion of food and the taste it gives. I don't think I could live without my huge cast iron grill pan haha

Jovidah said:

Well I'm not saying it's a bad pan. Heck, it's a great pan. The problem is that it's exactly the same pan, just a whole lot more expensive.

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Thats not been my experience. I've had what's called a DB Blue Steel pan. Didn't ever want to season right and I "lost" it in a move. The Min B has worked very well for me.

daveb said:

Thats not been my experience. I've had what's called a DB Blue Steel pan. Didn't ever want to season right and I "lost" it in a move. The Min B has worked very well for me.

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Mineral B line is the same as the Acier Carbonne line. They are not the same as the Blue Steel / Force Bleu line... Apart from the surface treatment that line is also thinner.
Can't really comment on the performance of those as the thinner gauge led me to steer away from them. I had a cheapo no-brand pan as a tester that was also just 2mm and it had issues with head spreading / hotspots. I suspect that line has the same issue.

Boon, I'm thinking your not getting your pan hot enough before cooking. These pans love heat and patina well when used. I don't baby mine at all, no oiling before putting away BS. I don't clean them with soap, just hot water and nylon brush. The handles on the DB pans suck, mine are all rusted and peeling. I reached out to their customer service department and they never responded.

My new favorite carbon pans are

Spring USA Blackline. I have two and they patina faster as my Shigfusa.

http://www.wasserstrom.com/restaura...-40-28-blackline-swisssteel-11-fry-pan-553117

Mucho Bocho said:

Boon, I'm thinking your not getting your pan hot enough before cooking. These pans love heat and patina well when used. I don't baby mine at all, no oiling before putting away BS. I don't clean them with soap, just hot water and nylon brush. The handles on the DB pans suck, mine are all rusted and peeling. I reached out to their customer service department and they never responded.

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Interesting; I never had any issues with the handles, no rust whatsoever. Although I did season mine with at least a few coatings.
And I agree about not overdoing the maintenance. I never oil after putting them away either... just dry them well after washing. Never had any problems with it. If they wanted love and care they shouldn't have been so cheap. Occasionally I even use some soap and no problems there; doesn't really hurt the seasoning. As I said I only get into problems when I get lazy in cleaning up the butter...

Mucho Bocho said:

Boon, I'm thinking your not getting your pan hot enough before cooking. These pans love heat and patina well when used.

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+1

Does your seasoning feel sticky or glassy?

I love this crap...
Spring USA® Blackline SwissSteel Fry Pan
Country Of Origin: Hong Kong S.A.R. of China

Each pan is a little different. U use high heat with the 8, 10, 12, 14 and Country pan are black as tar, dry, not sticky, but not glassy smooth patina either. My crepe pan never sees high heat so its sorta patina'd and splotchy. All of the pants that have a clear lacquered stick handle are rusted underneath and its flaking off where the handle meets the pan.

guari said:

+1

Does your seasoning feel sticky or glassy?

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DaveInMesa said:

I love this crap...
Spring USA® Blackline SwissSteel Fry Pan
Country Of Origin: Hong Kong S.A.R. of China

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They make the price in USA? :biggrin:

Mucho Bocho said:

Each pan is a little different. U use high heat with the 8, 10, 12, 14 and Country pan are black as tar, dry, not sticky, but not glassy smooth patina either. My crepe pan never sees high heat so its sorta patina'd and splotchy. All of the pants that have a clear lacquered stick handle are rusted underneath and its flaking off where the handle meets the pan.

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Excessively sweaty palms?

Mucho Bocho said:

Boon, I'm thinking your not getting your pan hot enough before cooking. These pans love heat and patina well when used. I don't baby mine at all, no oiling before putting away BS. I don't clean them with soap, just hot water and nylon brush. The handles on the DB pans suck, mine are all rusted and peeling. I reached out to their customer service department and they never responded.

My new favorite carbon pans are

Spring USA Blackline. I have two and they patina faster as my Shigfusa.

http://www.wasserstrom.com/restaura...-40-28-blackline-swisssteel-11-fry-pan-553117

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i typically put the pan over my lowest setting while i am gathering or fast chopping something..then i put the spurs to it with my turbo burner.

i might try to get it even hotter..thanks for the new thing to try.

I too have retired my carbon in favor of my vintage Griswolds. The vintage CI is pretty much non-stick at this point.

Mucho Bocho said:

All of the pants that have a clear lacquered stick handle are rusted underneath and its flaking off where the handle meets the pan.

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I take it you have top style?

I have the bottom type (silvery coated) and don't see too many of the clear ones nowadays… makes me wonder what's happening under mine lol.

If I had smooth vintage CI I probably wouldn't bother with the CS

Has anyone tried the Solid Tecknics pans?

I had a DB carbone plus that I had to give away because it bowed-out too much (it was too large for our ceran cooktop), but I got a VERY stable patina on it. I only cleaned it with water and metal sponge and it was impossible to scratch the seasoning. I have often burned-out the rest oil after cleaning (and wiping with a paper towel).

I have not a smaller carbon pan from Turk (which is graet and SUPER flat) plus a Spring Black Line which in basic behavior reminds of DB, but I have it too short to judge.

I can properly compare to cast iron as I only have Skeppshult for pancakes (which I LOVE since the pnacake No.1), but I may get a proper cast iron skillet later.

I am quite satisfied with mine. I have 28 and 34 cm and they are keeping seasoning quite well. I had some issues creating seasoning on the larger one as I do not have ultra large gas burner, but at the end it is fine.

Jovidah: yesterday I was doing some nice steak and at the end I used some butter. I must say that I experienced the issue you were talking about butter, seasoning was slightly washed away, but no biggie. Next time i will wash it while still warm.

I have 3 de Buyer (bought cheap in France), which I'm pretty happy with. Lately I came across:
http://www.darto.org/ and
http://www.turk-metall.de/cms/index..._id=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=26&lang=en

which both seem pretty cool; I like the single-piece construction.

arny1 said:

Has anyone tried the Solid Tecknics pans?

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I have two - they work very well but they have the same small drawbacks/care as above. Sear like crazy

Thanks Anton, I like the one piece design and seasoning is not a problem. Being Australian made and all I think some of these are for me.