Need some help buying an usuba

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b2kk258

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2015
Messages
129
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7
LOCATION
What country are you in?

USA



KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chef’s knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?


Usuba but not a kamagata

Are you right or left handed?

Right

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?

Wa handle

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?

180 MM

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)

No, but a SS clad would be nice

What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?

$375

KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?


Professional Environment

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)

Just katsuramuki cucumbers, scallions, etc...produce only

What knife, if any, are you replacing?

Tanaka Ironwood nakiri and a cheap 150mm blue #2 usuba

Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.)

Finger grip

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)

Usually push and katsuramuki

What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)

After buying a few single bevels, I want something with a relatively Flat road, rounded choil/spine (as long as it's not sharp) and something that doesn't need much work out of the box.

Better aesthetics (e.g., a certain type of finish; layered/Damascus or other pattern of steel; different handle color/pattern/shape/wood; better scratch resistance; better stain resistance)?

I don't care about aesthetics...Just can't do the hammered. I would like a stainless clad if possible.

Comfort (e.g., lighter/heavier knife; better handle material; better handle shape; rounded spine/choil of the knife; improved balance)?

Again, a rounded spine and choil is nice. Just don't want anything with sharp edges.

Ease of Use (e.g., ability to use the knife right out of the box; smoother rock chopping, push cutting, or slicing motion; less wedging; better food release; less reactivity with food; easier to sharpen)?

A thinner edge would be nice? I'm not too picky about ease of use.

Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)?

As long as possible.

KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)


Rubber, Synthetic, and Pine wood boards.

Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)

Yes.

If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)

No.

Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)

No.

SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

I want something that won't go dull or rust fast. I would, again, prefer blue steel or something else. I'm just not a fan of white steel for work. I would love to hear your suggestions. Personal experience would be greatly appreciated.
 
I've a 210mm white Tadasuna that I like quite a bit. I don't have a work requirement for it but like using it at home. Never had rust / corrosion issues probably cause it's only used on produce. Do wish it was a little shorter.

Me thinks stainless or stainless clad would be hard to find in a Usuba. But if I were buying new I would be on the phone with Jon / Japanese Knife Imports, before I did anything else.

A Frames seems to have a decent selection.
 
I've a 210mm white Tadasuna that I like quite a bit. I don't have a work requirement for it but like using it at home. Never had rust / corrosion issues probably cause it's only used on produce. Do wish it was a little shorter.

Me thinks stainless or stainless clad would be hard to find in a Usuba. But if I were buying new I would be on the phone with Jon / Japanese Knife Imports, before I did anything else.

A Frames seems to have a decent selection.

Yeah, I've noticed most places don't have any stainless cladding. I might give Jon a call this week.
 
I have the Sabun ginsan kamagata 180mm and it is one of my favorite knives. Very sharp out of the box. For my home use, I can't imagine needing anything longer than the 180. It was very sharp out of the box, but I can't provide any insight into sharpening, as I haven't touched it up yet.
 
@jdt40 "It was very sharp out of the box" is valuable information for the OP. Where did you buy it from, and did you select any honbazuke or similar option? Initial edge could be somewhat dependent on the dealer...

("Gin-3", "Ginsan", "Ginsanko", "Silver Paper Steel #3" (not german Silberstahl!) mean the same steel. A very simplistic but well reputed stainless alloy that is often used for stainless single bevels.)
 
@jdt40 "It was very sharp out of the box" is valuable information for the OP. Where did you buy it from, and did you select any honbazuke or similar option? Initial edge could be somewhat dependent on the dealer...

I got it from hocho-knife.com, with no optional service. I should note that "very sharp" means relative to my expectations, and that the knife made my initial attempts at katsuramuki much easier than I expected (though obviously years away from competent).
 
I still hold that carbon is best for single bevels. However G3 as mentioned is a stainless that is used for SB. I have only used Tanaka G3 gyuto & liked it. Think it could work well as an Usuba.

My white steel kamagata usuba is so sharp it is spooky :O
 
Sharpened my friends Korin Ginsan Kamagata usuba. I like Ginsan for single bevels. Easy to sharpen, gets very sharp and isn't "chippy" like some stainless.
IMG_1004.jpg
 
The Usuba 180mm to short for pro work. I had 180mm Sakai Takayuki Gin 3 steel at japanny. The steel like white #2 steel easy sharp, maintenance and rust free. The reason I said knife short because when I cut daikon thin slice usually 4~5 quart per time around 20 minute, combine 4~5 stack and cut. Buy around 195~210mm length would be good to use a long time. I recommend Jikko cutlery they can custom ebony handle also.
https://www.jikko.jp/products/detail.php?product_id=209
This is the picture i prep at work, for slow week 2~3 time per week. If busy week 4~5 time prep.
16938574_10207052172381537_1823864535241348285_n.jpg
 
I still hold that carbon is best for single bevels. However G3 as mentioned is a stainless that is used for SB. I have only used Tanaka G3 gyuto & liked it. Think it could work well as an Usuba.

My white steel kamagata usuba is so sharp it is spooky :O

I love white steel and you're deff right that its gets crazy sharp, It just doesn't meet my needs in the kitchen. I need something that will take a beating.
 
The Usuba 180mm to short for pro work. I had 180mm Sakai Takayuki Gin 3 steel at japanny. The steel like white #2 steel easy sharp, maintenance and rust free. The reason I said knife short because when I cut daikon thin slice usually 4~5 quart per time around 20 minute, combine 4~5 stack and cut. Buy around 195~210mm length would be good to use a long time. I recommend Jikko cutlery they can custom ebony handle also.
https://www.jikko.jp/products/detail.php?product_id=209
This is the picture i prep at work, for slow week 2~3 time per week. If busy week 4~5 time prep.
16938574_10207052172381537_1823864535241348285_n.jpg

I'm upgrading from a 150 mm and I think that 180mm would be ideal for me. Also, my cutting board space is really limited. So, 210mm is a bit much. My cutting board is only about 12" wide.
 
I'm upgrading from a 150 mm and I think that 180mm would be ideal for me. Also, my cutting board space is really limited. So, 210mm is a bit much. My cutting board is only about 12" wide.
I see, maybe you can consider about 195mm. I like that knife, can cut really fast, cutdown the prep time. I will take a picture of my cutting board and length of knife next time I prep.
 
I find if you want to try at a hand at katsuramuki or similar, a too-large usuba can feel very heavy and unsafe... certainly feels less scary with my 165 edo than with the 190 kama...
 
I love white steel and you're deff right that its gets crazy sharp, It just doesn't meet my needs in the kitchen. I need something that will take a beating.

Must admit I'm old school used carbon yanagiba's for years at work both blue & white steel.. Really protect those sharp edges.

Tienowen is working sushi chef so his advise is good.
 
Will ANY usuba take a beating? And will a blue steel edge on one not be harder to touchup once the beating wasn't taken, and have less edge stability at the same angle?

Real questions, I'm an amateur trying to understand, not giving advice here.
 
Will ANY usuba take a beating? And will a blue steel edge on one not be harder to touchup once the beating wasn't taken, and have less edge stability at the same angle?

Real questions, I'm an amateur trying to understand, not giving advice here.

I guess I didn't phrase that right. I meant, from my past experiences, blue was a bit easier on the maintenance vs white. Less rust, held an edge a bit longer, etc. But you're right, I don't think any usubas can take a beating. :lol2:

I find if you want to try at a hand at katsuramuki or similar, a too-large usuba can feel very heavy and unsafe... certainly feels less scary with my 165 edo than with the 190 kama...

I was kinda thinking the same, the 150 is just too small but the nimbleness certainly is attractive. Are the weight variations in usubas that big? I thought most were relatively light?
 
133g for the Nakagoshi (165mm Edo, has lost some steel due to me not getting things right the first time. BTW, caveat emptor, blade straightness is suspect with these I think...), 175g for the Kumagoro Kama (just noticed it is officially 180mm, real live cutting edge is 185mm)... they feel very different weight wise. Haven't had the Kamagata for long, holding it freehand still has me anxious of that thing slipping, falling and really hurting me...
 
Sakai Usuba 180mm about 170~180g. I have to cut really thin for sashimi garnish. The way I stack for easy prep but the knife bit short to cut all the way, only half of each stack. I try 195mm the knives can cut faster and easy cut 1 stack at that time. Here my prep picute:
33868401986_0f4eb3874a_c.jpg
 
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