Honing - Edge trailing or edge leading?

I don't use my hone much anymore, I prefer to hone on my stones. But, the other day someone asked me about honing and why we do it. I explained the steel edge rolling over and straightening it again but then they asked if they use edge leading strokes doesn't that just roll it over further? I thought about it and just didn't know what to say since I only hone on stones with edge trailing strokes. So, give me your thoughts ..... please.

I think the whole thing is a linguistic mis-understanding. Versus the actuality of what is really happening to the knife. Words like 'honing' are a generic word that can mean many things. And edge leading stroke is sort of likewise a shorthand for people who understand what it means (but only in context). Neither term is really useful for absolute sense or as true physics descriptions of what you are doing to the metal.

Its pretty easy to use the word hone with either steel or stone (round or flat), for example. Likewise, some edge leading actions are damaging, others are not. Most honing honing on a round steel is really using a heel-to-tip stroke (oblique to edge), just with the edge pointing in one way or the other. A direct orthogonal-to-edge "edge leading" action would do as your friend suggested-- and wreck an edge in a hurry--particularly on a round rod.

You want to be really careful finishing your new edge by removing the burr. To reduce the chance of ruining your new edge use edge trailing strokes. This is what I get from Jon's Stropping video.

If you accidentally strop with a very steap edge leading stroke you risk grinding away that toothy edge. Also risk cutting into the stone.


[video=youtube;XnhIKOX6Rco]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnhIKOX6Rco[/video]

Heres another video with both styles done in back-to-back for comparison.

https://youtu.be/I_--p26JO54?t=553

For the OP, I'd note how much obliqueness there is on the stones wrt to the edge.

unprofessional_chef said:

You want to be really careful finishing your new edge by removing the burr. To reduce the chance of ruining your new edge use edge trailing strokes. This is what I get from Jon's Stropping video.

If you accidentally strop with a very steap edge leading stroke you risk grinding away that toothy edge. Also risk cutting into the stone.


[video=youtube;XnhIKOX6Rco]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnhIKOX6Rco[/video]

Click to expand...

How does one strop with an edge leading stroke? I always thought a stropping motion was an edge trailing stroke.

K813zra said:

How does one strop with an edge leading stroke? I always thought a stropping motion was an edge trailing stroke.

Click to expand...

Kit, somehow this went from my question about using a steel to a stropping discussion

I guess I really didn't put enough information in the post to begin with, when I said hone I should have said steel hone

I don't use my hone much anymore, I prefer to hone on my stones. {...}

Click to expand...

I think this perhaps was a confusing formulation.
Maybe rephrase what you were asking,
and someone will chime in.

frog13 said:

I guess I really didn't put enough information in the post to begin with, when I said hone I should have said steel hone

Click to expand...

Ahh. That makes sense. I would have answered that individual by saying that it is possible to do edge training strokes on a rod and that is in fact what many people do . Some find rods practical (it isn't always easy to stop and pull out a stone) but most people who use Japanese knives and rods use very fine ceramic rods rather than steel.

tripleq said:

Ahh. That makes sense. I would have answered that individual by saying that it is possible to do edge training strokes on a rod and that is in fact what many people do . Some find rods practical (it isn't always easy to stop and pull out a stone) but most people who use Japanese knives and rods use very fine ceramic rods rather than steel.

Click to expand...

I use a ceramic rod with edge trailing strokes in my softer J-knives in my travel kit all the time. Never owned a metal rod though.

frog13 said:

Kit, somehow this went from my question about using a steel to a stropping discussion

Click to expand...

It's the same theory. Honing on steel is similar to stropping on wood backed leather strop. Where you're straighten the edge. If you take it a step further, stopping on stone is basically trying to achieve the same thing. The low risk method would be edge trailing when using a honing steel. In my experience, stropping on stone is the way to go anyways. I never use my steels anymore.

In my view ,,,Rods, stones, strops loaded or unloaded are all abrasive devices to remove steel ( edge leading/ cutting into abrasive) or to uncurl them ( spine leading ).

I prefer the edge leading as it wld hopefully break the curl and the subsequent strokes wld further refine the edge and achieve the ultimate apex possible under that given grit..... so I hope.

Spine leading .. if you do it at a higher angle, hopefully it breaks off the curl and then you chase for the apex. If it does not break.. then you have a weak edge that will curl again on contact with the cutting board.

Rods..

a)Its the grit that matters... It all depends on how much steel that needs to be removed to achieve the ultimate apex.. Not ashamed to say... that i use a medium rod ard 800 grit even on my single bevel honyaki... The trick is Pressure. The pressure is all focused on the small contact area and thus amplified..

b)Controlling pressure is the Key...

rgds z