Nakiri & petty knife to complete the set

Guys,

I return from my Hiatus seeking your knowledge once more! Last year, my better half was kind enough to buy me my first Japanese knife; an Itinomonn semi-stainless gyuto. The knife has served me well, although I must admit, I'm still a bit cautious when using it due to its laser like properties, and almost avoid it entirely when tackling root vegetables.

I was hoping to purchase a Nakiri which will solve that problem. The petty knife would make a trio, which would be more than adequate for 99% of the tasks I'd be carrying out. A year ago I was apprehensive about carbon knives, due to the greater care they demand - however, after a year of owning an a premium knife I believe I'm ready to make the jump.

So far, I've narrowed down my options to the following:

http://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/itinomonn-kasumi-180mm-wa-nakiri/

https://www.japan-messer-shop.de/Messerarten-im-Ueberblick/nakiri-messer--usuba-messer--gemuesemesser-/Murata-Takeo-Aogami-1-Kurouchi-Nakiri-16-5-cm--nicht-rostfrei.html

https://cleancut.se/butik/knivserier/kurosaki-2-serier/kurosaki-r2/nakiri2015-01-29-11-52-00-detail

https://cleancut.se/butik/knivmodeller/gronsaksknivar/santoku-8-2098-2278-detail

https://cleancut.se/butik/knivserier/shiro-kamo-3-serier/shiro-kamo-carbon-damascus/nakiri2013-08-22-12-33-182013-08-22-12-33-18-2-detail

I haven't had a chance to look at Petty knives yet (that's where your knowledge comes in handy), but I'd like it to be 150mm.

Budget is ~ £150 for the Nakiri and £100 - £150 for the petty knife.

Once again, your help and expertise is greatly appreciated!

Thanks,
Jordan

Nice options! I like all your choices. Although the Murata is unknown to me.

I'd go with the Itinomonn. You have one already and know how good it is. The SS cladding makes life a bit easier and the 180 size is better IMO.

If you wan't some variety in your collection the Kurosaki is great. I'm really drawn to his "signature" hammer finnish and the pollish makes it even better. (just my personal preference though). I have not used one, but they have a stellar reputation and Kurosaki knows his R2 steel. I'll own one at some point for sure. Longest edge retention of the bunch.

The Shiro Kamo is a another great performer, but very reactive. I like his knives a lot, but for a similar price the Itinomonn is better.

The Yoshikane is another great performer. I've used the gyuto and the grind is as good as the Itinomonn. It's a good option with a superbly made steel from a very reputable maker.

Having said all that, the default recommendation of nakiris around here is the Watanabe Pro KU 180. It's in your budget and it's a lot of knife for the price from one of the most respected makers around. A good addition to any collection, with well made steel which takes a crazy sharp edge and plays very nice on the stones. The grind is really well done.

Still, personally I'd go for the Itinomonn. As good as the Wat is I like the Itinomonn better. Wat has too much belly for my taste for a nakiri and the sand blasted finish on the wide bevel ads a little bit drag. Only very little, but I find it distracting (most don't). Most would probably opt for the wat though and for all the right reasons.

Many thanks Java for your advice. Unfortunately, both the Watanabe and Itinomonn are out of stock! My wife has given me a deadline now - I need to have picked a knife within two days. I just realised that I linked the wrong kurosaki knife in my post, it was this one I was considering:

https://cleancut.se/butik/knivserier/kurosaki-2-serier/kurosaki/nakiri2015-01-16-15-23-28-detail

How do you think it weighs up against the rest?

There is a wannabe pro 180 available on bst for a fairish price

The bst Wat is worth a look.

The Kurosaki in the link should have a similar performance to the R2 version. It's probably not SS clad because the description doesn't mention it. Not that it needs to be, but K&S has a SS clad version with similar hammer/KU finish. My understanding is that Kurosaki knives are all safe bets to get. Actually never heard a bad thing of his stuff.

...But me personally, from what is readily available to you in EU, would get this:
https://cleancut.se/butik/knivmodeller/gronsaksknivar/nakiri_wakui_180-2224-detail

It's 180 size which I prefer over the 165, made by Wakui who also makes one of my favourite gyutos, which has a very similar grind and performance with your Itinomonn. Nice flat profile that I like. Though not a ss clad knife either

One more to consider is this:
http://www.japanesenaturalstones.com/munetoshi-kurouchi-nakiri-180mm/
Munetoshi gets lots of love here too. Haven't used one, but what's been said is good. Super hard steel, great food release though might wedge on tall dense veg. Very rustic finish and the KU has a very nice rough finish to it. This knife from all the options should be the toughest.

...But, If your ok with the smaller size the Kurosaki will work great.

If your getting the knife from Cleancut check out this Takamura petty:
https://cleancut.se/butik/knivserier/takamura-4-serier/takamura-r2/allkniv2015-04-21-15-11-23-detail
One of the best pettys money can buy IMO. crazy good cutter with long edge retentio. It's laser thin and the R2 SS is a good option for a petty. If you cut a lot of acidic stuff which pettys are usually used for it'll dramatically drop the edge retention on any carbon steel.

If you are interested in the watanabe, email him directly. When I visited his workshop last summer, he had a lot of nakiri blades in production.

Have a look at cuttingedgeknives as well...

A "laser" will work very well on root vegetables if you don't twist the blade during cuts.

Think you could save a bundle and buy a cheapie parer in place of the petty which would free up some extra funds for the other purchase. Personally a Kiwi or Forchsner parer under 10 bucks rocks pretty hard for the bang for buck ratio
Good luck with whatever you decide

Thanks for all the advice! I did inquire about the Wantanbe directly, but it seems there's very limited stock and he couldn't give me an approximate date for when they'd next be available.

Out of all the knives available on cutting edge knives, I'm drawn to this one:

- [URL="https://cuttingedgeknives.co.uk/brands/masakage/koishi/nakiri"[/URL]

It's a little more than I was hoping to spend, but I've yet to see a negative review for the koishi range.

Java - I believe I've found the Wakui at a lower price on a german website. Could you confirm whether or not its the same knife?

- https://www.japan-messer-shop.de/Me...-V2-Kurouchi-Nakiri-18-cm-nicht-rostfrei.html

Thanks,
Jordan

jbuchan359 said:

Thanks for all the advice! I did inquire about the Wantanbe directly, but it seems there's very limited stock and he couldn't give me an approximate date for when they'd next be available.

Out of all the knives available on cutting edge knives, I'm drawn to this one:

- [URL="https://cuttingedgeknives.co.uk/brands/masakage/koishi/nakiri"[/URL]

It's a little more than I was hoping to spend, but I've yet to see a negative review for the koishi range.

Java - I believe I've found the Wakui at a lower price on a german website. Could you confirm whether or not its the same knife?

- https://www.japan-messer-shop.de/Me...-V2-Kurouchi-Nakiri-18-cm-nicht-rostfrei.html

Thanks,
Jordan

Click to expand...

Yes and no. Looks like it has the same cladding, same profile, same grind, same KU nashiji style finish, same weight, but different core steels. Cleancut version has a B2 core steel and the other has V2. I don't have experience with V2, but I have heard that Wakui knows his away around that steel. Taking into account the price difference, I'd choose the V2 version. Also I'd prefer the burnt chestnut handle with horn ferrule. Though the B2 versions handle is good quality too.

I have no experience with Masakage knives, but The Koishi has a strong reputation. So if it appeals to you most its should be a good choice too. Others who have used it will probably chime in.

JaVa said:

Yes and no. Looks like it has the same cladding, same profile, same grind, same KU nashiji style finish, same weight, but different core steels. Cleancut version has a B2 core steel and the other has V2. I don't have experience with V2, but I have heard that Wakui knows his away around that steel. Taking into account the price difference, I'd choose the V2 version. Also I'd prefer the burnt chestnut handle with horn ferrule. Though the B2 versions handle is good quality too.

I have no experience with Masakage knives, but The Koishi has a strong reputation. So if it appeals to you most its should be a good choice too. Others who have used it will probably chime in.

Click to expand...

Ok, so Wakui it is then. Now, to complicate things even further, I found this:

https://www.japan-messer-shop.de/Messerarten-im-Ueberblick/nakiri-messer--usuba-messer--gemuesemesser-/Wakui-Nashiji-Nakiri-17cm.html.

It's slightly shorter than the V2 variant, but comes with a Shirogami 2 edge and stainless cladding (I believe). Considering it's only 25 euros extra it seems like the better choice?

V2 is basically white #2 with a little spice, so you should pick the more expensive one only if the stainless cladding is important to you. I wouldn't do it just for the shirogami core.

It’s not ss clad. 🙁

My German isn't exactly par for a conversation, but I do remember some:

Außenlagen Edelstahl (rostfrei)

means "Outer layer, stainless steel (stainless)"

edit: Some of our Germans can probably chime in to confirm or deny

Yeah, it is ss clad. Sorry about that. I was quickly checking it on my phone and missed that.

Java, Konge,

Appreciate the help, but after all that effort I opted for a previously unlisted knife :bat:. To save hassle, and to make the impending Christmas deadline, I opted for a UK seller. In the end I purchased the 150mm Kotetsu, Iron Clad petty. It features similar specs to the Takamura previously recommended, but has a unique profile that I like.

I'll be sure to post photos once received! I'll try my best to comment on its performance, but that may be a stretch given my limited experience.

Thanks again!