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Thread: Voice Your Concerns

  1. #1

    Voice Your Concerns

    If there's something that's bugging you about KKF (whatever it may be) I'm asking that you bring it up. I can't promise that I can fix everything but I'd like the opportunity to try.

    Remember, this forum is a community where we all have input, it's nothing without everyone's voice being heard.

  2. #2
    Senior Member DwarvenChef's Avatar
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    There needs to be a filter so I can filter out all that shiny steel stuff (sorry just in a goofy mood)

  3. #3
    I'm assuming this is not a request for altering features and interface, cause there's already a place for that, no?

    Outside of that, KKF needs a pair clear, one-sentence mission statements. A vision for the vendors, owner, and permanent members, and a vision for passersby, traffic and newbies.

  4. #4
    Senior Member/ Internet Hooligan
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    Okay, I'll bite.

    I said it when you were first setting the site up and I'll say it again now: paid vendors will kill this place, just like they killed KF. You already had to temp ban a respected contributor for not "playing by the (stupid) rules," and we aren't even a year into things. Wait until you find yourself having to ban someone with a whole lot of followers. Sound familiar? LOL.

    It's easy to monetize your users without resorting to a pay-to-play system. Many of the biggest, longest tenured, and most respected forums are able to offset their operational costs through various ways that don't create the same problems. The first 20 $30 paid subscriptions paid for your software license, the other 30-40 should have your bandwidth and hosting covered--if not, you're getting ripped off. If the paid subscriptions are dwindling, drop the price a bit (because it's a little prohibitive), put a NON AFFILIATED ad on the bottom of the site, and remove them for paid subscribers. Think people will ***** about the Ad? Wait until they start bitching about the bans. vBulletin is rich with plugins and add-on packs which can be setup specifically for paid subscriptions: offer better incentives for signups. Custom user titles, arcades, "secret forums," badges. Beyond basic forum software perks, consider KKF emails. Freaking bumper stickers. Give all new signups a $10 discount on their next Martell branded product.

    Just don't ban users because they don't pay you money. Regardless of how you look at it, that's what just happened with Dark Hoek. And it's a really bad sign.

  5. #5

    ecchef's Avatar
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    I still wish there was a more accessable, dedicated photo gallery that a techno-neanderthal like myself can use comfortably.

    Vertigo....I'd rather have a fridge magnet. I agree with you; banning is never a good thing. But I don't think the road ahead is leading to "four legs good, two legs better!" It's not that bleak.
    Though I could not caution all I still might warn a few; Don't raise your hand to raise no flag atop no ship of fools. - Robert Hunter

  6. #6
    Senior Member/ Internet Hooligan
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    Quote Originally Posted by ecchef View Post
    Vertigo....I'd rather have a fridge magnet.
    Fridge magnets, key fobs, trucker hats.. These things cost like 5 cents a pop in bulk and forumites eat them up. I'd love to write my contrarian dissertations while sipping coffee from a KKF branded mug. Lol.

  7. #7
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    First of all thanks for asking Dave. And I also like Eamon's idea of a mission statement -- or even some sticky with clear forum rules for users and vendors so everyone knows them (and are reminded of them).

    With that said, I must admit I was VERY leery of the emphasis on vendors at first, but for the most part I don't have a problem with it now. And I don't want to make 'vendor' a bad word because when I look through the list of vendors, it is a bunch of people I respect and (maybe Dave hides it from us), but for the most part they seem to be class acts with high-quality product and they act appropriately. Maybe the vendors have a different take too, but I don't see it.

    And I enjoy the vendor interaction. I think it is harder to manage in the long run and more work for Dave, but managing vendors is an issue everywhere -- not just on internet forums.

    The hobbyist 'grey' area and regular user self-promotion links are the weakest parts IMO (but probably not a big problem right now). Self-promotion can get out of hand quickly and attract the wrong types of users. There are many of us members who could promote our enterprises, blogs etc. but choose not to. And frankly, many forums wouldn't have allowed Darkhoek (Harald) to post his links in the first place. If that had been the rule, he probably wouldn't have been banned as it may have headed off the offense.

    Other than that, the soulfly and leftover KF bashing turns me off (keep it to PMs). After KF blew up, I went to foodie forums for a bit, but some negative-toned users turned me off and I never really went back. And when Adam Marr came here briefly, the vibe almost chased me away from here too. Imagine being a new user and walking in when those threads were active? It's not very inviting. Sure, I don't want to censor, but when topics chase people away or intimidate people so they don't post, the 'balance' was probably off.

    Just my 2 cents.

    k.
    "There's only one thing I hate more than lying…skim milk, which is water that's lying about being milk." -- Ron Swanson

  8. #8

  9. #9
    Senior Member Ratton's Avatar
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    Cool

    Here are my thoughts and ideas on this situation. First of all I would like to say this is a GREAT Forum but it is still in its infancy stages so there are bound to be bumps along the road as it grows and develops; it is still in a learning curve.

    I think we can all agree that there must be rules set out for what is acceptable and is not acceptable. I feel the protection of the paying vendors is very important. That said I feel that the rules of posting must be very clear and laid out and changed from time to time as grey areas crop up. I also feel that there should be laid down in print a list of consequences that happen when the rules are broken. Then no one can be startled when discipline is handed out.

    Here is how I would visualize it working. If a rule is broken then the person is told, “this is your first reprimand” and directed to the rule that was broken. Then if he breaks or bends a rule again he is told “this is your second reprimand”; and if you break the rules again on the “third reprimand” the result will be that your privileges of posting will be suspended for 2 weeks; and after that if you break the rules again your fourth reprimand will result in your privileges being suspended for a month; and after a fifth reprimand you will be banned permanently.

    If the rules and consequences are laid out then no one should get their feathers ruffled when actions are taken!

    Dave I think you should be very pro-active, and if a suspension is handed out you mention to the Forum members right away that someone (weather you mention the name or not is up to you) has received their second, third or fourth reprimand and the consequences have been implemented; do this before someone else post about it and confusion happens.

    I feel it a privilege to be a member of this Forum and post here, it is not one’s right to be able to do it!
    Just my $.02 worth!!

  10. #10

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    I'll jump in too.
    agree with the photo gallery thing, miss being able to see everyone's whole collection in one place.

    Mobil friendly!!!. I'm on a iPad 95% of the time theses days, hell I don't even own my own tower or laptop any more. It kills me when I see threads that have links, at least I think they are links as I can not see them. I always have to ask someone to post a link that I can see on a iPad.


    Last but none the least I have to agree vertigo a bit. It does seem that this payed vender thing is becoming a problem. Both for you and the and the mods having to police the sight as you have admitted more then a few times yourself. Also for the members who might not always understand what is going on in the background. More then a few times both on this sight and the other I have PT'ed you to ask "what just happened" or " what's going on", but I doubt every member feels as conferrable doing that as I do. From the out side some of the things that surface here look "bad" for lack of a better word to the members who might not know the "background story". Now that you are the owner of this sight and not just a contributing member it therefor makes you look "bad", the term " Dave's sand box" has been thrown around more then once.

    John sad above that the sight needs a clear mission statement, I agree. But to add to that I don't think this sight can successfully be both "a place for small (paying) knife makers to sell there stuff" and a forum for " the guys" to hang out. Even know you have clear set subsections for both the "bleed threw" is troublesome.

    I could be wrong but there has to be a better way to make this all work. I think you told me at one point what you charge for a "vender membership" and if I remember right with a 1000 members now you should be able to come out ahead and cover costs by charging a very small fee for general membership privileges I.E. the privilege to post and get PT's. Charge more to have your own subsection, witch in turn would give a vender a more predominant status as well as keeping there items and services more visible as they won't get berried by new posts.
    That's my $0.02

    Colin

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