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Thread: Vintage Beatty & Son Cleavers

  1. #11
    I think if either of these were kept lashed on your front door, between kitchen tasks, unsolicited doorbell ringers and squirrel problems in your bird feeders would cease.

    Very cool Dave.

    Great prices.

  2. #12
    Both SOLD
    Last edited by Dave Martell; 05-02-2012 at 02:11 AM.

  3. #13
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    Thank goodness. I was just checking at work because if they were not sold I was going to take them.

    -Chuck

    Edit: if they don't sell, let me know.

  4. #14

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    So now that they are sold, let's go back and discuss the "cast" stamp.

    I am thinking that knives that are stamped cast were done so to reflect that the steel was cast billet. This would be to differentiate it from crucible steel, blister steel, cemented steel, puddle steel, etc. As time evolved and all steel was cast the stamp was no longer necessary. Note I am talking about the billets that were forged into blades being cast, not the blades themselves. I cannot fathom the actual blade being cast.

    I'm not aware of any cast steel "prior to 1839" in the USA. Cast steel in the US didn't really start until post-Civil War with Bessemer and I wouldn't say there was any good quality cast steel until late 19th century, early 20th century. I suppose these cleavers could be made of imported German or English cast steel, but I think then they would have cost a pretty penny back then.

    So I think it is interesting that the name and emblem would seem to indicate the cleavers were early 19th century yet the term "cast" would seem to me to indicate much late manufacturing.

    Anybody have any more data?

    -AJ

  5. #15
    Senior Member chazmtb's Avatar
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    Damn, I can't believe I missed them!

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by ajhuff View Post
    So now that they are sold, let's go back and discuss the "cast" stamp.

    I am thinking that knives that are stamped cast were done so to reflect that the steel was cast billet. This would be to differentiate it from crucible steel, blister steel, cemented steel, puddle steel, etc. As time evolved and all steel was cast the stamp was no longer necessary. Note I am talking about the billets that were forged into blades being cast, not the blades themselves. I cannot fathom the actual blade being cast.

    I'm not aware of any cast steel "prior to 1839" in the USA. Cast steel in the US didn't really start until post-Civil War with Bessemer and I wouldn't say there was any good quality cast steel until late 19th century, early 20th century. I suppose these cleavers could be made of imported German or English cast steel, but I think then they would have cost a pretty penny back then.

    So I think it is interesting that the name and emblem would seem to indicate the cleavers were early 19th century yet the term "cast" would seem to me to indicate much late manufacturing.

    Anybody have any more data?

    -AJ

    I've wondered about this myself and I have no explanation. I guess I assumed that they marked them "cast-steel" for some advertising purpose that was significant at the time but that they were really cemented or blister?

    I always note how perfect the built up support section is where the handle enters the blade and how they all look alike in this regard. It can easily make you think of a casting process but then maybe a die or something like that?

    Also worth noting is that the construction appears to be of a core with a jacket. The core steel throws BIG time carbon sparks and is hard as hell to grind (yet not brittle as they're almost never significantly chipped) and the jacket appears gummy and grabby towards the belts and buffers.

  7. #17
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    sachem allison's Avatar
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    This is from Colins post as he is a huge collector of Beatty's


    I use two smaller old beattys almost every day, size 0 nd 2. That big boy is a #10 and has only been used to behead some large fish that has hit my dock. I also have a few lamb splitters that get used a lot. But to fully answer the question I have been trying to collect one of each size of Beatty in as good a shape as I can find.
    This got harder when I learned that not only were there the "Beatty and son" cleavers made from cast steel that most of you know of, made from around 1820's-1900. In around 1940 one of the Beatty's daughters marred a mr. Briddell from that point on all the knives were stamped Briddell. But a older (also cast steel) cleavers made by the stamped " W. Beatty PA". These were made from around 1720-1750, he was the grandfather of the William Beatty from Beatty and son.
    But hold on I'm not done yet a even older cast steel cleaver made by John Beaty from around 1680-1720, stamped "J Beatty Ulster Co NY" that's the one in the picture above.
    AND! From what i can tell the oldest Beatty cleavers made stamped "Thomas Beatty Forged Down Co. Ireland 1662". If I'm right these were made by the great great grand uncle of the "Beatty and sons" in county down Ireland. I found this cleaver in a antique store in PA thing looks like it was never used, funny my oldest Beatty is the one in the best condition.

    So there's lots of Beatty's out there.
    I haven't lived the life I wanted, just the lives I needed too at the time.

  8. #18
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    so they were cast steel marked 200 years before the Civil War, hope this solve at least some of the mystery
    I haven't lived the life I wanted, just the lives I needed too at the time.

  9. #19
    I can't say it solved anything for me except make my head spin thinking that there's even more out there to look for....thanks Son...and Colin too.

    Oh and nice avatar Son....it's about time the rest of us can see it.

  10. #20
    Senior Member DwarvenChef's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Martell View Post
    Both SOLD
    THANK YOU Whoever bought them because I would be getting shot if they had not been sold

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