Page 1 of 4 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 35

Thread: Disscussion - BST Rules and Expectations

  1. #1
    daveb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Just outside Tampa
    Posts
    4,100

    Disscussion - BST Rules and Expectations

    Let me preface the disussion by stating that these are my personal opinions and that I'm not speaking for the moderator group.

    Recently there have been a rash of negative comments made in BST posts, usually IMO by self appointed BST policemen that are "calling out" someone they think is trying to to overcharge for a knife.

    The Guidelines {read rules} of BST are not ambiguous, "Negative comments in sales threads are forbidden and will result in revocation of BST forum privileges". This includes IMO "I was just calling out....." comments.

    If this should be how the guidelines apply is of course subject to discussion and that is welcome here. (But not in BST)

    In my opinion it is unreasonable to expect the moderators to evaluate each sales thread to determine if "calling out" comments should be allowed. Further it is my opinion that determining "fairness" is the responsibility of the buyer, again it is unreasonable to expect the forum moderators to make that determination. The responsibility of determining sales price lies solely with the seller. The responsibility of the buy price lies solely with the buyer. If they find common ground then it's a win/win.

    I personally don't care if one of our members wants to sell a Kiwi for 3K. It is not the responsibility of the moderators to censure the thread nor the members to comment on it.

    In any given thread if you've had a positive experience with the knife or similar knife, share it. If you think something is a great price, share it. If you've had a positive transaction with the seller, share it. If you want to give a friendly bump then a softball question or GLWS is appropriate.

    But in words of one syllable, if you think the knife sucks, the price sucks, the seller sucks or all of the above then simply STFU.

    Bottom line is treat the seller's posts like you would want your's treated when you are selling a knife.

    Again this is my opinion and I'm soliciting yours. I certainly don't expect everyone, not even fellow moderators, to agree with me.

    Fire at will. Fire for effect.

    Dave
    Dave
    Older and wider.

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    1,186
    I disagree strongly.As long as the response is purely factual and not an opinion it should be allowed, for example a statement like: "Tojiro DP's are available from XXX for significantly less money."

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Canberra, Australia
    Posts
    553
    I agree totally Dave. As far as I'm concerned the forum isn't warranting any sales or anything but just providing a medium.

    If someone is flipping a knife for profit it is the sellers responsibility to decide if it is worth it.

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    140
    I agree one should not say subjective negative opinions on knives in the BST, that's just bad mannered and derails the thread.

    although I don't want to see people get ripped off in BST, I think we are all adults here, and if you are going to drop a couple hundred of dollars on a knife, you should do your own research, especially with things like list prices considering there really isn't that many vendors that carry knives.

  5. #5
    Senior Member brainsausage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Portland, Maine
    Posts
    2,822
    This is a sticky one. I think we've seen people pop up here in the past and make a bunch of bogus posts just to get BST privileges in order to flip some knives. Do we want to encourage that type of behavior? Im guessing no for the most part. I've always been under the impression(entirely my own construct I suppose) that the BST was a way to recoup some funds from a knife that hasn't seen use, or collect some funds for another purchase, or just clearing house. Kind of a yard sale, and not a retail/market/mall what have you. My only concern with people not being called out, is that some of the newer members may not have a full understanding of the value of some knives, and may as a result get taken for a ride. I'm not my brother's keeper by any means, but I do see concerns from time to time from other members regarding the need to keep this a friendly place that is primarily about education, sharing experiences, and comradery. We all get a little salty from time to time, which I think is healthy, but I really don't want to see this forum gummed up with constant BST threads, especially if they're primarily opportunistic in nature. I also don't want to see it become a sterile wasteland of non content like some other forums. Like I said- it's a sticky issue...
    The AI does not love you, nor does it hate you, but you are made out of atoms it might find useful for something else. - Eliezer Yudkowsky

  6. #6
    Senior Member chinacats's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    4,488
    My only point would be that people get called out other threads when they're full of it, why not here. That said, seems that only the most egregious usually draw any attention and more often than not, the knives sell anyway. I'd err on the side off protecting the non informed buyer before worrying about hurting feelings. This hobby thing is supposed to be fun anyway right...seeing people get ripped off reminds me of my entry into J-knives and that was through a vendor (not a KKF vendor, anybody guess which one)

    Cheers
    once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right

  7. #7
    Senior Member Smurfmacaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    884
    Quote Originally Posted by chinacats View Post
    My only point would be that people get called out other threads when they're full of it, why not here. That said, seems that only the most egregious usually draw any attention and more often than not, the knives sell anyway. I'd err on the side off protecting the non informed buyer before worrying about hurting feelings. This hobby thing is supposed to be fun anyway right...seeing people get ripped off reminds me of my entry into J-knives and that was through a vendor (not a KKF vendor, anybody guess which one)

    Cheers
    I'm not so sure only the most egregious are the only "negative" comments called out. I think the phrase caveat emptor in response to someone asking how the knife differed from one that is currently for sale on another site for significantly less even though the original poster distinctly said it can't be found anywhere (and saying "to my knowledge" is not a release from the fact it was not true) was so "negative". I might admit my comment that people profiteering on knives on the site is in the "spirit" of what goes on here but still.....that was a separate comment so why remove the caveat emptor comment since that is pretty much what db said. I don't even have a problem with someone charging "market" value, just don't make claims of scarcity that aren't true. I expect untrue claims to be pointed out so people that may be a little naive don't get taken advantage of....this is a forum to exchange information and the love of kitchen knives. If you want to screw people then go to eBay.

    I haven't posted any questions yet on the economics of knives, especially with western makers....don't really want to give them any ideas since I like a deal as much as the next guy. Murray Carter and Bob Kramer get the microeconomics of it...raise prices until your supply curve and demand curve cross to maximize revenue. I've got mixed feelings on that, most of the more desirable makers have years long waiting lists....if they raised their prices the list would be much shorter and I could get one of their knives sooner....it would cost me more.....hmmmm.

    Rant mode off - Bottom line, I don't mind someone charging market price but making false statements is beyond the pale and either we are eBay or we are a community that keeps things to a dull roar.

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Canberra, Australia
    Posts
    553
    The issue you make there is firstly if you call someone out and you are wrong you can cost them a sale. Do yoy want to gave to introduce rules that mean you are liable if you ruin their sale?

    Also if you introduce too many regulations controllable by the forum then it means the form risks becoming liable/warranting sales which means we will all have to pay significantly more to contribute.

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    663
    I feel as though this thread may define this forum and where our ethics lead us. I am going to 100% agree with the above posts. It should be axiomatic that we as a community Don't think BST is the place for oppurtunity selling. We are a community built on trust. When I go to BST I presume I am getting a fair price. I've used it a few times to score knives ranging from HHH to kato. I always felt it was a fair deal. Imagine if a newer member joins and let's say he knows little and person x is selling a tadafusa clone for 2x market value( these are commonly rebranded) and person abc(New member) buys it because person xyz said it was "rare" person abc 6 months later after learning some stuff realizes he was ripped off and is pissed, he leaves the forum and joins chef knives to go instead. It's a possible scenario. I can honestly say I am proud that the thread I presume you are referring to got roasted not only once but twice. It shows me where are moral compass lies. As I have said it shows that we are a community and we have integrity. Which is something the world is slowly losing. Sorry if I stepped on anyone's toes. I just think this isn't an issue for any 1 person or a select few to decide. It should be a community decision. It would be different if there were direct attacks at the vendor but claiming item xyz is over priced at a sale price isn't a direct attack at the vendor. It's stating fact. Basically if we don't have each others backs who will.

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    At computer
    Posts
    1,922
    I think that the bst rules are fairly good but not easily enforceable, especially by volunteer moderators who can't be expected to know and see all. I hope bst generally continues to maintain the spirit behind the rules, though. It's great because knowing you can almost always re-sell what you buy, if in good condition, frees you up to be able to try a lot more gear and not lose too much. I think of bst as a kind of sharing mechanism not a marketplace.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •