Seeking recommendations on a Chinese Chef's Knife.
What type of knife(s) do you think you want? Chinese Chef's Knife
Why is it being purchased? What, if anything, are you replacing? I've used a couple of chinese cleavers and I love the weight and feel of them. I'm not really replacing anything in my kit, just adding to it.
What do you like and dislike about these qualities of your knives already?
Aesthetics- I love the rugged looks of my CCK knives, as well as the handmade looks of my Japanese knives.
Edge Quality/Retention- While the edge doesn't last long on most of my knives, I still prefer white #1 carbon on most of my knives as I love the edge that I can achieve with it.
Ease of Use-
Comfort- All of my knives are extremely comfortable. The only one I really can't stand to use most of the time is my Shun. I still don't know why I bought it, it was a mistake.
What grip do you use? It depends on the blade and what I'm doing. I'm most comfortable using a pinch grip.
What kind of cutting motion do you use? Depends on what I'm doing and which knife I'm using.
Where do you store them? All of my knives stay oiled and in their sayas and stored in my knife roll.
Have you ever oiled a handle? I regularly oil the handles on my CCK knives.
What kind of cutting board(s) do you use? Bamboo and soft wood. Occasionally composite, but I don't like to use them.
For edge maintenance, do you use a strop, honing rod, pull through/other, or nothing? I use a strop and polish on a 16k or 30k grit water stone. I rarely hone my japanese knives, but when I do, I use my Hand American borosilicate honing rod.
Have they ever been sharpened? I sharpen my knives every week (or when needed). I currently put my gyuto through hell at work, so I usually have to sharpen it every 1-2 days.
What is your budget? I already spent $7k on my knife kit, so I don't really have a max. I just like to by the best I can as long as the knife is worth it.
What do you cook and how often? I work in a fine dining restaurant in DC. We cook American cuisine with French influences. We currently average at about 150-200 covers on a weeknight and have been doing 300 covers on weekends (dinner service)
Special requests(Country of origin/type of wood/etc)? I only use carbon steel if I can help it. I prefer White #1, but I use Aogami Super Steel from time to time.
This is the situation. I love my knives, I use all of them. But I have used a couple of different co-workers chinese chef's knives for prep and I loved it. The knife sped up my prep when it came to vegetables and now I must have one. I strongly dislike name brand knives and I refuse to use anything but carbon steel if I can help it. I prefer White #1 carbon, but I have a couple of Aogami Super Steel knives as well. The only stainless knives I use are my Berti's, and that's just because I particularly like Berti knives.
I am currently looking at the CCK 1303 as I love my CCK knives, but I know there are better knives out there, I am just having a hard time finding them. Would any of you know of any top end chinese clef's knives made from White #1 carbon? Or atleast recommend some good carbon chinese chef's knives.
My current kit includes:
Fujiwara Terayasu 8 1/4" Nashiji Gyuto
Fujiwara Terayasu Nashiji Petty
Konosuke Fujiyama White #1 Kiritsuke Yanagiba 270mm
CCK Butcher Knife (KF2208)
CCK Big Rhino Cleaver (KF2201)
CCK Large Scraping Knife (KF2205)
CCK Small Scraping Knife (KF2206)
CCK Butcher's Bone Chopper (KF2301)
Shun Premiere 7" Santoku
Fujiwara Terayasu Maboroshi No Meito Nakiri Kagugata 7 3/4”
Konsuke Fujiyama White #1 Deba 180mm
Konsuke Fujiyama White #1 Wa-Kiritsuke Gyuto 270mm Ebony
Tojiro 270mm ITK Bread Knife
Itto-Ryu Rentetsu Hand Forged White #1 Santoku 160mm
Massakage koishi bunka 170mm
Kikuichi Elite Carbon Hankotsu 150mm
Konsuke Fujiyama White #1 Petty Knife 150mm
Berti Large Chef Knife Anchor Tang Oxhorn
Berti Flexi Fish Filet Knife
Berti Pesto Knife (Mezzaluna)
Shapton Glass Sharpening Stone 1,000 Grit
Shapton Glass Sharpening Stone 4,000 Grit
Shapton Glass Sharpening Stone 8,000 Grit
Shapton Glass Sharpening Stone 16,000 Grit
Shapton Glass Sharpening Stone 30,000 Grit
MAC Black Ceramic Honing Rod
Hand American Borosilicate Honing Rod
Kangaroo Leather Strop
Good Lord you seem pretty stocked. Selling stuff or just adding to?
Just adding to. I like all of my knives, I use them all somewhat regularly =)
Touche. I only keep that knife in my kit to remind me to never buy another one like it. =)
White #1? Fujiwara Teruyasu does a Nashiji cleaver, I see you already have a couple of his.
Keiichi at bluewayjapan has got an Ashi #6 in white #2.
Undoubtedly the granddaddy in this class is the Sugimoto #6.
I'm using a sugimoto 6 and a konosuke fujiyama 6 at work (as my carbon cleavers) which I believe are both white 2; the konosuke certainly is, I assume the sugimoto is too. Both truly great knives.
Personally I prefer the sugimoto (balance, handle, finish, find it a touch more responsive on the stones, but the konosuke is no slouch either. Sugimoto is more of an all-rounder, it's the first knife I'll grab if I'm seperating ribs/wings, trimming marylands, chopping vege etc. The Konosuke is much thinner and a better slicer, so if I was faced with 20kilos of onions to finely dice, it'd grab it first.
I haven't seen any cleavers in white 1, though as Tim mentioned, Fujiwara make a cleaver (dunno what steel) and they do custom orders too. Was eyeing it off recently myself. I'd also consider the Sugimoto oms and the gesshin hide cleavers if money wasn't an issue. Or go custom, ecchef recently sold a takeda menkiri in the BST forum which was white 1; presumably takeda can still produce white 1 knives
Isn't white #1 the same as virgin carbon? And if so isn't white #1 what litterally 99% of the carbon cleavers on the market are made of? I know of people who have tried to order custom cleavers from many of the famous makers in the past and they have been told virgin or white #1 was their only choice because that is the only steel the cleaver guys would use. This was a while ago so if I'm incorrect someone please step in. Regardless, I'm pretty sure that Sugimoto's are white #1, and I think that I Mizunos are as well.
After re-reading JKerr's post I think he's right, I think the cleavers called virgin are white #2? Man I'm way behind the curve when it comes to all this steel term nonsense.
Seeing as you're here, Andy. Any chance you could speculate on whether the Sugimoto OMS uses a different steel than the regular line? Any noticeable difference? Or is it pretty much the same but produced by a "more experienced smith"?
Thanks in advance,