“One-man” operations

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Miyamoto Musashi

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A knife that has been forged, shaped, sharpened and handled by a single skilled craftsman adds significant value.

What your guys’ opinions are on Jiro’s knives being more sought after than other Japanese one-man operations?

Mazaki is the only other one man operation based in Japan that comes to mind at the moment.
 
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Why does it add significant value?
That's a great question! I think there are a number of factors and I most definitely will not be able to include all of them off of the top of my head. I think the first two points apply to things universally, not just knives.

1.) Economies of scale dictates that an inverse relationship exists between the cost of a good and the quantity produced. So generally speaking, if you have industrialized equipment to increase your output quantity, manufacturing costs will be lower, and therefore the product can be offered at a lower cost.

2.) Working independently does not eliminate the other costs of running a business, (facility costs, utilities, maintenance). For someone working alone, these costs are spread over a smaller production volume, leading to higher per-unit costs.

3.) I think for a lot of people, there are intangible incentives that comes into purchasing a knife made by a single person (i.e. knowing exactly who and where this knife was manufactured, developing a relationship with said craftsperson as a buyer and supporter of their work etc.)
 
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That's a great question! I think there are a number of factors and I most definitely will not be able to include all of them off of the top of my head. I think the first two points apply to things universally, not just knives.

1.) Economies of scale dictates that an inverse relationship exists between the cost of a good and the quantity produced. So generally speaking, if you have industrialized equipment to increase your output quantity, manufacturing costs will be lower, and therefore the product can be offered at a lower cost.

2.) Working independently does not eliminate the other costs of running a business, (facility costs, utilities, maintenance). For someone working alone, these costs are spread over a smaller production volume, leading to higher per-unit costs.

3.) I think for a lot of people there are intangible incentives that comes into purchasing a knife made by a single person (i.e. knowing exactly who and where this knife was manufactured, developing a relationship with said craftsperson as a buyer and supporter of their work etc.)

A good and practical answer. :)
 
There’s a romanticism about it no doubt. To have a knife done start to finish by one guy seems to me to be the purest form of craftsmanship. Exactly what the guy wants, and done right by himself.

Maybe a little more googly eyes at the maker vs the knife itself, but if you like the maker then it’s a nice piece of history.

Maz got my business for that reason.
 
Kiyoshi Kato and Shuji Toyama have to be in the conversation too.
Can't believe I forgot about Toyama.

I figured Yoshiaki Fujiwara/Kiyoshi Kato is a unique example, given that his knives have come to command unusually high prices, and also since he has apparently retired recently.

Regardless, what is it about Jiro's knives have made his work be perceived as more distinguished from other one man operations? (all of whom I believe are distinguished in their own right).
 
What about two guys? The Sakai way, dedicated forger works with dedicated sharpener. Is that somehow less valuable?

I agree there is some mystique around the one man operation, but I don’t think it’s all that common in Japan. Sanjo is known for it, but I expect a lot of those guys have apprentices working for them.
 
What about two guys? The Sakai way, dedicated forger works with dedicated sharpener. Is that somehow less valuable?

I agree there is some mystique around the one man operation, but I don’t think it’s all that common in Japan. Sanjo is known for it, but I expect a lot of those guys have apprentices working for them.
There's a third. The handle maker.

Possibly a fourth, engraver.
 
Regardless, what is it about Jiro's knives have made his work be perceived as more distinguished from other one man operations? (all of whom I believe are distinguished in their own right).
They have a unique look, you can recognize a Jiro immediately. I think that’s part of it. Similar to why Takeda are so popular.
 
What about two guys? The Sakai way, dedicated forger works with dedicated sharpener. Is that somehow less valuable?

I agree there is some mystique around the one man operation, but I don’t think it’s all that common in Japan. Sanjo is known for it, but I expect a lot of those guys have apprentices working for them.
I don't think it's less valuable and hope those restock soon.

I get the sense when reading bios that there is a lot of stock placed in these "one man" based brands and that this quality is something that is emphasized.
 
They have a unique look, you can recognize a Jiro immediately. I think that’s part of it. Similar to why Takeda are so popular.
This definitely makes sense and I haven't thought about it like that before.
 
A huge factor is surely just the self-perpetuating difficulty of buying one. The harder it is to get something, the more people want it, which makes it even harder to buy. Add to that the engraved numbering, the calligraphy, the image of a man alone in the woods, and Jiro’s mystique is strong.

Also, it has to be said: something, something, cultural relativism, something, western obsession with individualism, something something…
 
What your guys’ opinions are on Jiro’s knives being more sought after than other Japanese one-man operations?
To answer your question more directly, I can understand why Jiros are so sought after. My 225 yo is strikingly unique (at least among my Japanese knives) in the hand, with its cutting feel, and visually. My Mazaki, K Kato, and Toyama knives are definitely not outliers in the same way.

But while it’s undoubtedly a great cutter, the funny thing is that I think a lot of the people hunting for one would be just as happy (if not more so) with the cutting performance of a high grade western workhorse that’s much easier to buy — say, a HVB or Kemadi, or even a HF or Shi.Han.
 
Manaka but not sure does he do all the handles himself
 
Might want to add Tsukasa Hinoura and Hiroshi Ashi to the list. Tsukasa-san’s hand engraved lines and Ashi-san’s honyaki meet these criteria I believe.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if a handful of the makers on Knife Japan meet the criteria being laid out here, in spirit if not also in letter. I don't personally view a one person shop as inherently more interesting/more valuable than a shop which has different people focusing on portions of the finished product. I think there's a lot of makers, world wide, making fine tools by themselves, and it's pretty unlikely that the only ones in Japan just coincidentally happen to be represented by the wholesalers that supply the major vendors.
 
Toyama doesn't forge weld the majority of his production so I would be tempted to eliminate him from the list. And K. Kato doesn't appear to install handles (maybe for some retailers), although its the blade that should be primary consideration here. Bonus points to Jiro and Kato for using the traditional Sen.
 
I guess most non-Japanese custom makers are one man operation.
Toyama doesn't forge weld the majority of his production so I would be tempted to eliminate him from the list. And K. Kato doesn't appear to install handles (maybe for some retailers), although its the blade that should be primary consideration here. Bonus points to Jiro and Kato for using the traditional Sen.
That’s a very hard line to draw, Toyama is more than capable of lamainating stuff himself as saw in his more rare creation, he use prelam just to save cost. But if prelam doesn’t count, does factory steel like Hitachi paper or Takefu Vtoku also counts as a team effort?
 
Might want to add Tsukasa Hinoura and Hiroshi Ashi to the list. Tsukasa-san’s hand engraved lines and Ashi-san’s honyaki meet these criteria I believe.
What about Nakaheiji is his son helping him or? And then we have Shigefusa and sons of course! Neither of these is possible to add to the list?
 
I wouldn't be surprised if a handful of the makers on Knife Japan meet the criteria being laid out here, in spirit if not also in letter. I don't personally view a one person shop as inherently more interesting/more valuable than a shop which has different people focusing on portions of the finished product. I think there's a lot of makers, world wide, making fine tools by themselves, and it's pretty unlikely that the only ones in Japan just coincidentally happen to be represented by the wholesalers that supply the major vendors.
One of the blacksmiths that I deal with (available on WithKnives.com and Knife Japan and a couple of European sites) Junichi-san from Yosimitu Kajiya, does the whole process himself. His father passed away a few years ago and now he does everything, he told me that after his father passed his production levels dropped and he also stopped doing inhouse forge welding. His knives have strong Wabi Sabi but are great performers, he works mainly in Shirogami 2.

The Kajiya is a family business in Shimabara, his wife makes custom handles for the knives and his mother, a former tailor, makes knife bags and rolls.
 

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Love the thread! My take on it goes back to that romanticism aspect. To me, one person making the knife doesn't make it better, performance, fit and finish, or otherwise. One person making the entire knife has to deal with a lot including forging, heat treat, grinding, profiling, sharpening, handle making, fit and finish (round spines, polished, etc.), and handle installation. There are a lot of different tools and expertise to do all of these masterfully. I see nothing wrong with spending your entire life dedicated to mastering just sharpening, or just forging, and that's why I also find that most Japanese knives outperform just about anything else for much less money.

But also, if you look at the majority of Japanese knives, a lot is left to be desired. To me, their focus is mainly on the performance of the knife, and as you get into the Jiro's of the world, the fit and finish catch up. Compare it to western knife makers though, and it's a different approach to knife making. I find they're much more focused on looks, fit and finish, and of course performance, but there are definitely a lot of western knife makers out there who don't understand the fundamentals of making a knife cut well, no matter how pretty the knife is.

I also consider the money making factor. If there's someone just dedicated to forging, he can focus and knock out many more knives of great quality. It's then passed to a sharpener, who probably sharpens that blacksmith's knives all the time, making him proficient at sharpening them. And then it's fit up with a handle from someone who just shapes handles all day. This would lower the cost and time spent on each knife.

I'm always torn on this subject because the performance of most Japanese knives, even at that $200-$400 often rival some of the most expensive western makers. I get people in my shop who ask what makes a knife cost $1000+ and if they're better. My answer is often "better is subjective, but will it cut better? Probably not much better". You're mostly paying for that one person's time and experience at mastering all aspects of knife making (and maybe fancy handle materials).

As I'm entering my knife making journey, I sure can sympathize with anyone who takes on making their own knife from start to finish. So many details and choices that affect the final product. So I understand why someone making their own would want to, or needs to, charge a higher price. My knives are definitely not nearly as good as Jiro, but I can see why he charges what he does with the countless hours that go into each one.
 
Might want to add Tsukasa Hinoura and Hiroshi Ashi to the list. Tsukasa-san’s hand engraved lines and Ashi-san’s honyaki meet these criteria I believe.
All I know for certain is that Ashi Hamono has not produced any honyaki for several years.

I thought Mitsuaki Takada (of Takada no Hamono) used to be the sharpener for Ashi Hamono.

Regarding Tsukasa, I’m unsure.
 
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All I know for certain is that Ashi Hamono has not produced any honyaki for several years.

I thought Mitsuaki Takada (of Takada no Hamono) used to be the sharpener for Ashi Hamono.

Regarding Tsukasa, I’m unsure.
Ashi-san continues to make honyaki and fulfill orders, though placing an order without going through a wholesaler seems next to impossible now.
 
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