210 - vs 240+ , long vs short

[Taurahe]

What , in your opinion , are the functional differences between long and short knives, say 210 - and 240+ . What do long knives excel at? What are this pitfalls vs shorter knives ?

I want to add a long knife, but have very limited room to use one, and know it would not see much use because of this. Most of my prep is done on top of my stove , so 210 and under is my go to, but I still want a long knife

 

[sumis]

personally: for a gyuto/chef,
shorter than 225 has no functional advantages other than fitting better into a cramped space, or above a small board, etc.
longer than 255, begins to become unwieldy for smaller victims (like, moving my elbow to far back if i want to keep a garlic clove close to the body when cutting).

.

 

[Qapla']

What are you looking to cut with it?

 

[stringer]

What , in your opinion , are the functional differences between long and short knives, say 210 - and 240+ . What do long knives excel at? What are this pitfalls vs shorter knives ?

I want to add a long knife, but have very limited room to use one, and know it would not see much use because of this. Most of my prep is done on top of my stove , so 210 and under is my go to, but I still want a long knife

240 is the shortest useful gyuto length for me. Less than 240 in length I prefer a sujihiki or cleaver/nakiri profile. Longer gyutos are more efficient at nearly every task if you are used to them. If I'm in a cramped space then I would prefer to use a petty or a nakiri to a short gyuto. Short gyutos tend to be either heel heavy or very light. I use shorter knives all of the time at work when I'm training people who are new and learning. I just don't care for them and would never consider buying one for my personal use.

 

[esoo]

the biggest functional advantage of the longer knife is the longer usable cutting edge (obviously). This allows you to work more product at one.

If you rock chop with the tip on the board, a longer blade is better for ergonomics

 

[HumbleHomeCook]

I'm a short knife guy. About the only time I want something over 200 is for slicing so I keep a 240 suji on the active duty rack. 165-200 for daily drivers, a 120 for "utility" type work and chicken butchery and the suji for those specific slicing or long tasks that pop up.

I don't feel under equipped at all and even my 210 gyutos just sit.

 

[bradmacmt]

I've encountered an interesting evolution in my own gyuto use. While I've owned a number of 240's, I tended to prefer a 210 for home use. And really, my most used knives are all in the 180 range. Lately I've been picking up the 240 more and more, and now I find I essentially have no use for the 210, which really caught me by surprise. I can really see the beauty of it in a professional kitchen, and why it's considered the "perfect" length. If I need or want "more" than my 180's I tend to skip right over the 210 and pick a 240. Truth of the matter, because of how my wife and I eat, we really have little use for a gyuto of any kind and a good 180 nakiri, bunka, or santoku is the 99% knife in our kitchen. But I've come to enjoy using the 240 - I honestly never saw this coming as I've always been a small knife guy. We humans are weird.

 

[Taurahe]

What are you looki

I've encountered an interesting evolution in my own gyuto use. While I've owned a number of 240's, I tended to prefer a 210 for home use. And really, my most used knives are all in the 180 range. Lately I've been picking up the 240 more and more, and now I find I essentially have no use for the 210, which really caught me by surprise. I can really see the beauty of it in a professional kitchen, and why it's considered the "perfect" length. If I need or want "more" than my 180's I tend to skip right over the 210 and pick a 240. Truth of the matter, because of how my wife and I eat, we really have little use for a gyuto of any kind and a good 180 nakiri, bunka, or santoku is the 99% knife in our kitchen. But I've come to enjoy using the 240 - I honestly never saw this coming as I've always been a small knife guy. We humans are weird.

My problem is lack of sufficient space to use a 250. I have a small house with a galley kitchen and have very little open counter space. Most of my prep is done on my stove , and a 210 or under is far more efficient use of the space , but I feel like I need a longer knife just because

 

[bradmacmt]

@Taurahe I just came back to re-vamp my response, and you pointed out the exact reason I intended to - I realized I was mostly typing to hear myself, rather than really answer your question! Sooo - I think you already answered your own question. I'd absolutely go with a 210 in your situation. A 240 takes time to acclimate to and I don't think your work situation is anywhere near ideal to do so.

​

 

[Gshep91]

I'm a short knife guy. About the only time I want something over 200 is for slicing so I keep a 240 suji on the active duty rack. 165-200 for daily drivers, a 120 for "utility" type work and chicken butchery and the suji for those specific slicing or long tasks that pop up.

I don't feel under equipped at all and even my 210 gyutos just sit.

I have a pile of 240/270/300mm’s that rarely get used. I grab a 150-180 petty/mini gyuto almost every time.

I like quick and easy when it comes to making something like a fruit bowl for the kiddo

 

[deltaplex]

What , in your opinion , are the functional differences between long and short knives, say 210 - and 240+ . What do long knives excel at? What are this pitfalls vs shorter knives ?

I want to add a long knife, but have very limited room to use one, and know it would not see much use because of this. Most of my prep is done on top of my stove , so 210 and under is my go to, but I still want a long knife

Mass is your friend for most cutting tasks, longer knives have more mass than shorter ones, and it's easier to get the mass where you want it since there's more space to put it. Often this means that you get a stretched out grind in comparison to the equivalent, shorter, version. You can also get balance that's much more difficult to do at shorter lengths (e.g. balance point near the heel with good weight over the tip).

 

[deltaplex]

I do use <200mm knives for almost all quick cutting tasks; rectangles, 210, 240s, or 270s for anything meal prep sized, and 270's for any prep larger than that.

 

[daveb]

Space available is probably my 1st criteria, tasking is a close 2nd.

When prepping in a pro kitchen, space was usually not an issue and quantify of product was usually large. I liked a 270, could live with a 240.

At home with somewhat limited space I like the 225ish though can use a 240, can use a 210.

On the camper, I'm prepping for two and have to move "stuff" to get any counter space. 210 and maybe a 225.

 

[rgar4012]

I definitely enjoy 180-210, for some tasks, fruits for the kids, small meals, etc. Especially if I'm not breaking down anything large. If space was a concern, there's really nothing I couldn't done with just a few extra slices.

If I'm doing a full meal I tend to reach for a 240. Some larger produce a ~270. After using them more a 270 certainly seems more reasonable than when I first got into this hobby, nice ones don't feel unwieldy at all, as long as you have space.

 

[1dog]

i cant really speak to anything 240+, but i do have very limited space in my kitchen. i have ~24x18" of usable counter top, and my cutting board isnt terribly big either at 18x12".

for a while my longest knife was 202mm, but my lucid ended up being 222mm and the difference was surprising. the total difference in length between the 2 knives is barely more than an inch, but both my cutting board and my space around it felt a bit more restricted when using the lucid. it tows the line of being just long enough to be comfortable for my space. i think if i had anything longer than that, even for as nice and pretty as all the 240s are, it just wouldnt fit my space well enough. id also be mindful of the total knife length and not just blade length if space is a premium, which it is for me.

as an aside, i only cook for myself and my bf so im not doing any big meal preps or any tasks that take a considerable amount of time, so i dont really feel hampered by having less blade length. the space is more valuable to me.

 

[stringer]

My problem is lack of sufficient space to use a 250. I have a small house with a galley kitchen and have very little open counter space. Most of my prep is done on my stove , and a 210 or under is far more efficient use of the space , but I feel like I need a longer knife just because

I would much rather be using a huge knife on a tiny board than vice versa. The only dimension that limits knife size for me is if there is an obstacle immediately on the other side of the cutting board like a wall or the lid to a deli cooler. And in that case I prefer a nakiri, sujipetty or even santoku to a gyuto profile.

Big knife on a little board

 

[timebard]

175-195: nimble, compact, just big enough for most tasks. Main downsides are that they often don't have enough length to combine forward balance and a nice tapered spine, and either being too short at the heel for a really high performance grind or an awkward shape/profile.
195-210s: no mans land, too long to be agile but not quite big enough to do everything well.
220-230: great! Big enough for pretty much any task at home while still reasonably compact.
230s-250: also great! I feel like this is where a lot of makers shine in terms of maximizing performance, and this length is sufficient to tackle pretty much any product. Starts to get a bit less agile for tip work but still very usable, given enough counter space.
250-270: fun but not a daily driver. Great for a big melon or pile of greens, but most tasks don't really benefit from this size vs. a 240.
275+: too big and clunky for my taste.

If I needed one knife for everything, 225. Two knives, 190 and 240-250. Three knives, 180-190, 225-230, and 255-270.

 

[rickbern]

What , in your opinion , are the functional differences between long and short knives, say 210 - and 240+ . What do long knives excel at? What are this pitfalls vs shorter knives ?

I want to add a long knife, but have very limited room to use one, and know it would not see much use because of this. Most of my prep is done on top of my stove , so 210 and under is my go to, but I still want a long knife

I feel your pain. I’m not so constrained by counter space but I have a tiny sink that makes 240s difficult to maneuver. My main knives now are a 180 and a 210.


I tend to grab the 240 for cabbages, squash, melons and greens. If I’m doing something like borscht that has a lot of prep I’ll go for a 240 every time, I deal with the sink issue. I’m assuming you use a pinch grip and you’re a home cook, if you hold the handle the 8”/210 size is functionally larger.

 

[rickbern]

You guys are selling me on a 225 gyuto

 

[stringer]

If I am doing something quick and small. I have lots of options that I would prefer over a gyuto in the same length.

 

[Gjackson98]

Space available is probably my 1st criteria, tasking is a close 2nd.

When prepping in a pro kitchen, space was usually not an issue and quantify of product was usually large. I liked a 270, could live with a 240.

At home with somewhat limited space I like the 225ish though can use a 240, can use a 210.

On the camper, I'm prepping for two and have to move "stuff" to get any counter space. 210 and maybe a 225.

As a home cook, sometimes my food prep decision is based on what knife I want to use that day.
And a big knife makes me fat.

 

[ehhh]

I usually cook for 2, don't have a huge prep area, and I prefer gyutos between 210mm-240mm edge length (Sanjo 210mm to Sakai 240mm). For me, the benefit is mostly the longer flat spot rather than the heel to tip blade length. I could probably do 99% of my prep with a 165mm santoku or nakiri, which "feels" like a longer gyuto because of the flatter profile.

Whether you'd benefit from a longer gyuto probably depends on what you cut, and obviously if you can comfortably use it in your space. Longer would probably be better if you cut big things like cabbages, melons, etc on a regular basis, or prep high volumes. For my use, I don't see a benefit to a 240+ gyuto. I think my longest is a Sakai 270mm (255mm-ish edge length) and it really only comes out for big watermelons or if I just want to mess around with it.

If you want one just because, I'd suggest trying a Sakai 240mm (230mm edge) and go from there. I used to think 210mm was all I needed, but now my sweet spot is a 225-230mm gyuto

 

[rinkhals]

I usually cook for 2, don't have a huge prep area, and I prefer gyutos between 210mm-240mm edge length (Sanjo 210mm to Sakai 240mm). For me, the benefit is mostly the longer flat spot rather than the heel to tip blade length. I could probably do 99% of my prep with a 165mm santoku or nakiri, which "feels" like a longer gyuto because of the flatter profile.

My last two purchases were a Sakai 240mm and a Sanjo 210mm that has pretty much the same flat spot length and while I don't find the 240mm unwieldy at all and have plenty of prep space I feel 0 need or benefit to reach for it over the shorter one that has more qualities I prefer. Currently waiting shipment on another 210mm gyuto and a 185mm santoku to further hone in what I like but so far I feel I would be quite happy with a big dumb oversized 225mm "santoku" (looking at you Masashi).

So I'd say only get a 240 if it also has other qualities that you think might appeal to you because imo edge length alone is one of the easiest things to accommodate/adjust around for (at least between 210vs240) or get something considerably longer like 250/270, for the funs.

 

[DitmasPork]

What , in your opinion , are the functional differences between long and short knives, say 210 - and 240+ . What do long knives excel at? What are this pitfalls vs shorter knives ?

I want to add a long knife, but have very limited room to use one, and know it would not see much use because of this. Most of my prep is done on top of my stove , so 210 and under is my go to, but I still want a long knife

Very subjective, personal preference.
My daily go-to knives are gyuto that typically measure 225mm from heal to tip, whether cooking for 2 or 20 people—225 gyutos have the most functionality for me, paired with a 150mm petty. I’ll occasionally reach for a 210, 240, 270 if I feel like it, but my 225s usually give me the length/nimbleness to do whatever I need.
Three of the 210s I have are closer to 215mm on the edge.

Kitchen drawer, grab bag.

Current 225mm gyutos.

 

[Cliff]

I'm a home cook, but I cook for crowds a fair amount. For that, I gravitate to 250-70's. For more everyday stuff, I'll use whatever, a 180-210 Gyuto. Lately I've been using a 180 Petty for just about everything.

 

[darkamage]

i'm a home cook and to me ~230mm is the sweet spot where i can use it for most tasks without grabbing another knife. I used to prefer 240mm gyutos because i like the look and the feel of holding it. but since i got my first 230mm, i've been getting more 230s and using them more than my 240s.
while there are other factors like profile, weight, etc. i just prefer my 230mm gyutos for preparing a meal.
I still like to look and hold my 240mms just for the sake of it or if i just need to cut 1 thing lol.

btw, i used to think the same about tall knives but now i think regular height gyutos (~50mm) are better for most tasks. ymmv

 

[YumYumSauce]

Not a fan of 210 gyutos, dont own any. Feels like an in between size. Id rather rock a 180 mm for tigher spaces, less prep, nimbleness or a 240 with enough Space, more prep.

I've never had a problem cutting small ingredients with a 240 knife. I segment citrus with 240's and my cck sometimes. Using too small of a board is a different story.

Petty/suji's from 135-270 all feel fine depending on the task

 

[jakuda]

...

I've never had a problem cutting small ingredients with a 240 knife. I segment citrus with 240's and my cck sometimes. Using too small of a board is a different story.

...

Reminds me of Iron Chef Sakai peeling an apple


and more recently, this reel from Kappo Sato restaurant:

and from Corey Lee's account:

 

[YumYumSauce]

Reminds me of Iron Chef Sakai peeling an apple


and more recently, this reel from Kappo Sato restaurant:

and from Corey Lee's account:

Whoa thats beautiful. Working my way towards that level

 

[Qapla']

My problem is lack of sufficient space to use a 250. I have a small house with a galley kitchen and have very little open counter space. Most of my prep is done on my stove , and a 210 or under is far more efficient use of the space , but I feel like I need a longer knife just because

Taking a bit of a wild guess here, but what do you think of this?
https://www.hocho-knife.com/sakai-takayuki-aoniko-blue-2-steel-slicer-sujihiki-240mm/