Belgian Blue Whetstone

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I was thinning a knife today so I gave it a polish with my BBW.
The Damascus cladding popped out nicely. I gave the whole knives a bit of garnet love and I like the finish. I had to even out the finish with a bit of 1200 wet n dry

Original
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During King 320
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After garnet's over the whole thingView attachment 179334

After evening the polish with 1200 wet n dry (I cover the sandpaper in 800 slurry and smear away)
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Sharpened it with a Washita and finished on a Turkish
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^This right here^... Holy Trinity of knife sharpening stones. I use those three (/ four) types more than everything else put together.
 
I noticed @milangravier did a very interesting comparison above with a Maruoyama Shiro Suita, which happens to be one of the few fancy jnats I own too, so I thought I'd have a little look at how mine compared on the same knife.

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Now the MSS is a world class kasumi stone, with a reputation and price tag to match, so I feared this was going to be a little bit of an unfair comparison against the humble Belgian Blue, but in many ways the results weren't a million miles from each other. I probably don't have a good enough phone camera to capture the differences particularly well, but I'll try to describe them...

The Maruo is also quite an easy stone to use and get good results, with water management it will self slurry nicely and there's no further trickery required. With the BBW I was working with low pressure and slurry on the jigane, and then higher pressure and more water to brighten the hagane (maybe that's how people always polish?), but the MSS does this automatically. It's a very good stone for hagane, and if I worked longer it'll go a lot more mirror than this. BBW by comparison leaves a darker jigane with less shine, the contrast is probably more notable, but the overall effect is less delicate, and the finish a little less lucent than than the Japanese stone. Both very nice though I think.


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In terms of sharpening the Maruo acts as one might expect from a med-fine Japanese stone, i.e. slooooowly. BBW may not be quite as fast as it's yellow brethren, but it's a considerable step up on the MSS. Though in part that's because the MSS is finer, I'd say around 7k vs BBW at around 4-5k.

TBH I don't often use it for sharpening, usually just when I sell the occasional yanagi. In my mind it has that jnat tendency to produce edges that lean too much toward refinement over bite for my personal tastes on normal kitchen knives. But using it again yesterday I was surprised - though this is a very fine edge, there is still some grip left to it, and I think people who like higher grit finishes would think the result rather good. I don't know if this might be anything to with the Maz being Shiro 2, whereas most knives I sharpen are the slightly higher alloy and hardness paper steels, mostly Aogami 2 and Super. Any steel experts out there know if that makes any sense? (Probably doesn't tbh, I'm just speculating).

Nevertheless there are a lot of better options for sharpening knives out there, including Belgian Blue. For polishing though the Maruo is a very smart bit of kit. Is it worth a grillion times more than the more versatile BBW? Undoubtedly not. But equally - yes of course it is. Depends what you're looking for ;).
 
Sounds like a BBW is worth playing with.

I had a coticule that wasn't agreeing with me once, it was fast but way to soft and crumbly and put me off from ardennes, also had an ebay find that was insanely to hard and cut to slowly, my favourite charnley was leagues ahead, even an hindustan was faster.

So makes me think I could be missing out, also like that you can get them 70mm wide.

And you're not alone on how a knife edge feels with different stones, can't explain it.
 
So mine just came in, one silly question: is it a soaker or a splash and go? From this thread I think it's splash, but maybe I need to soak it first or something?
 
So mine just came in, one silly question: is it a soaker or a splash and go? From this thread I think it's splash, but maybe I need to soak it first or something?
I bought one too...Thanks @cotedupy for the reco. Not quite as cool as you, but I took my paper towel cut from about halfway to about 3cm short of through. I feel like if I switch to store brand I could make it all the way :)

Splash and go worked for me. I started with a King 1000 to set a fresh edge then with the BBW, worked up a slurry and just did a couple quick minutes on each side of the knife. Mine is only the blue variety and doesn't have yellow coticule.
 
I had a coticule that wasn't agreeing with me once, it was fast but way to soft and crumbly and put me off from ardennes, also had an ebay find that was insanely to hard and cut to slowly, my favourite charnley was leagues ahead, even an hindustan was faster.

Oh dear! Sounds like you had some bad luck with the yellows. I've only had a couple that I didn't think that good for knives, both because they were of the hard n slow variety. So maybe 3/4 of the ones I've had have been good.

BBW is (ime) a bit more consistent in terms of how it cuts, and the grit level. I've not seen any mega coarse and quick, or super slow and fine BBWs, whereas yellow coticule bounces around the place a bit.


I bought one too...Thanks @cotedupy for the reco. Not quite as cool as you, but I took my paper towel cut from about halfway to about 3cm short of through. I feel like if I switch to store brand I could make it all the way :)

Splash and go worked for me. I started with a King 1000 to set a fresh edge then with the BBW, worked up a slurry and just did a couple quick minutes on each side of the knife. Mine is only the blue variety and doesn't have yellow coticule.


Nice work. They're quite easy stones to like I think, as you get great results quite easily, and they're fairly inexpensive. I was fairly confident with the OP that I wasn't going to have a load of people saying I was an idiot and talking complete nonsense, which is rarely a certainty otherwise ;). Glad you like!
 
Oh dear! Sounds like you had some bad luck with the yellows. I've only had a couple that I didn't think that good for knives, both because they were of the hard n slow variety. So maybe 3/4 of the ones I've had have been good.

BBW is (ime) a bit more consistent in terms of how it cuts, and the grit level. I've not seen any mega coarse and quick, or super slow and fine BBWs, whereas yellow coticule bounces around the place a bit.
To be honest I have had bad luck with all natural stones, but find good ones and there great.
Nice work. They're quite easy stones to like I think, as you get great results quite easily, and they're fairly inexpensive. I was fairly confident with the OP that I wasn't going to have a load of people saying I was an idiot and talking complete nonsense, which is rarely a certainty otherwise ;). Glad you like!
A good natural stone beats any synthetic in my opinion. Good charnleys are magical, washita are cheap and consistent, hindustans surprise me everytime, dalmore blues are fast with slurry and water and also easy to find.

Jnats are to expensive and over rated.
 
So mine just came in, one silly question: is it a soaker or a splash and go? From this thread I think it's splash, but maybe I need to soak it first or something?
You may first dress it. Some come very polished. I use an Atoma 140 with water before first use. Makes raising a bit of mud much easier.
 
I got my delivery from AC today.

My Nakagawa Blue1 needed a touch up, so it got first go.

The sharpening experience on the BB is quite interesting. It is a hard stone that releases a bit of mud but is definitely not a muddy stone. Quite similar mud to Chosera 3k. The mud smells earthy, a bit like some Japanese naturals.

Feedback is quite good, especially the aural feedback, even if it is a bit 'screechy'. Tactile feedback is a bit strange. It almost felt like I had bits of broken burr in the mud between the stone and the knife, but there were none. I guess it's the feeling of tiny balls rolling under the knife? This was less pronounced when almost sharpened. Maybe that is part of the feedback?

Burr formation is tiny. I didn't know whether to reduce the burr, so I did (gradually reducing pressure then a longitudinal stroke). However, I didn't do any edge leading strokes and didn't repeat the last few pressure levels as I would with a synthetic.

It's seems a bit slower than a fine synthetic (say, a Chosera 3k). Even a little slower than Naniwa 6k diamond. Maybe similar to a fineish jnat? It could be that I kept going after it was already sharp because I couldn't use burr formation as an endpoint.

Results were pretty good. Very sharp. No indication of residual burr on paper towel. The edge is certainly finer than Chosera 3K. It's been so long since I used anything finer (except Naniwa 6k diamond, which I only use for high alloy steels) that I can't really compare the edge to something finer (say, a Kitayama).

I also polished the wide bevels. Quite a bit of contrast and overall quite bright, almost semi- mirror, without quite the cloudiness of some jnats. I had a few deep scratches in mine, a bit more like @cotedupy 's effort with the coticule. Not sure if this means that my BB has a higher concentration of smaller sharper garnets or maybe I'm just showcasing my lacklustre polishing skills.

I also sharpened my utility knife (made this at @Kippington 's forge out of 15N20 IIRC). It's sharpened at almost 30dps. It cut through paper towel without a problem, something that it has not done before sharpened at this angle.

I also bought a small stone for for my stainless veggie peelers. Took a while to sharpen them but they are very sharp now. So good to have sharp veggie peelers.

Overall, I'm pretty happy with these stones, especially the burr minimisation. Thanks @cotedupy for the PSA.
 
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Feedback is quite good, especially the aural feedback, even if it is a bit 'screechy'. Tactile feedback is a bit strange. It almost felt like I had bits of broken burr in the mud between the stone and the knife, but there were none. I guess it's the feeling of tiny balls rolling under the knife?
I also polished the wide bevels. Quite a bit of contrast and overall quite bright, almost semi- mirror, without quite the cloudiness of some jnats. I had a few deep scratches in mine, a bit more like @cotedupy 's effort with the coticule. Not sure if this means that my BB has a higher concentration of smaller sharper garnets or maybe I'm just showcasing my lacklustre polishing skills.

my newly mined cotis feel the same, they also make that sound! crushing tiny balls.

i get good contrast out of my cotis, almost without stray scratches, but those tiny balls sometimes break through. atleast thats what it feels like.
 
Been playing around with a Belgian Blue myself recently and have discovered how much I love it. I use a little diamond plate to work up a slurry before sharpening and then go from there. Really clean and crisp edges like others have said, surprised myself a bit on how quickly I had a hair popping edge shaving up and down my arm. Really good. Definitely holding onto this one….or actually buying a bigger one but yeah I dig it, prefer it to the Jnats I’ve tried and you can buy a bench stone sized one for like $100. Crazy deal and can’t image wearing through one anytime, would last forever like a good sized jnat would

Also if you haven’t tried it on Blue steel or Blue Super you totally should. One of my favorite edges I’ve ever made is Shapton 1.5k right to Belgian Blue and then quick strop on kangaroo tail strop or cardboard. Been using this edge on some Blue Super and Murata Blue #1 and it’s outstanding.
 
Been playing around with a Belgian Blue myself recently and have discovered how much I love it.

Thanks @cotedupy for the PSA.


No worries. Good to hear that some of the seasoned pros like them as much as I do!

For polishing stuff I always work from a slurried stone, usually atoma or sometimes a BBW nagura, because obviously they don't really self slurry. According to the kind of razor people who look at stuff under microscopes, this has the effect of breaking up the garnet, and as you work the mud it kinda rounds and smooths out further. Like this I've found that almost every BBW I've used will give a very nice finish on cladding, with basically no visible scratch pattern. I'm definitely not an expert polisher myself, but I do find them very good, and quite easy to use for it.

@Nemo - ping me a message if you'd like a little BBW slurry stone. I have a piece that I'm going to cut the end off this weekend, and can send you a bit if you fancy. Works nicely on all sorts of stones.
 
No worries. Good to hear that some of the seasoned pros like them as much as I do!

For polishing stuff I always work from a slurried stone, usually atoma or sometimes a BBW nagura, because obviously they don't really self slurry. According to the kind of razor people who look at stuff under microscopes, this has the effect of breaking up the garnet, and as you work the mud it kinda rounds and smooths out further. Like this I've found that almost every BBW I've used will give a very nice finish on cladding, with basically no visible scratch pattern. I'm definitely not an expert polisher myself, but I do find them very good, and quite easy to use for it.

@Nemo - ping me a message if you'd like a little BBW slurry stone. I have a piece that I'm going to cut the end off this weekend, and can send you a bit if you fancy. Works nicely on all sorts of stones.
I certainly can't claim to be a pro.

I'll try with a bit more mud next time.

Thanks for your generous offer but I actually bought a smaller BB to use on veggie peelers that I reckon will do this job well. And it will keep it flat to boot.
 
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Also if you haven’t tried it on Blue steel or Blue Super you totally should. One of my favorite edges I’ve ever made is Shapton 1.5k right to Belgian Blue and then quick strop on kangaroo tail strop or cardboard. Been using this edge on some Blue Super and Murata Blue #1 and it’s outstanding.


The large majority of stuff I sharpen is A2 and AS. Perhaps this is why I rate BBW so highly - it’s certainly an incredible stone on those steels!

(Though actually the Maz in a lot of my pictures on this thread is Shirogami, and it’s great for that too :)).
 
The large majority of stuff I sharpen is A2 and AS. Perhaps this is why I rate BBW so highly - it’s certainly an incredible stone on those steels!

(Though actually the Maz in a lot of my pictures on this thread is Shirogami, and it’s great for that too :)).
Agree 100% it's really outstanding on those steels, also SLD is really nice with BBW as well. I tried it on some white steel as well and it's great as well but it didn't feel as "magically delicious" as it did on the Blue stuff. I'm thinking it's because White is so easy to deburr and get a crazy sharp and nice edge that I don't notice how much better the BBW edge finish is vs. like Blue or SLD that takes a little more work to deburr sometimes and the BBW just does magic then. ;)
 
today i put my 65hrc or so srs15 santoku on the 220 shapton to roughen it up a bit. experiment time.

then put it on my big coti.

and the results are: almost nothing happens, as close to nothing as you could possibly get imo.
i gave it 5 minutes. lets just say this is the wrong stone for this steel. dont waste your time.

i guess r2 would be similar
 
I certainly can't claim to be a pro.

I'll try with a bit more mud next time.

Thamks for your generous offer but I actually bought a smaller BB to use on veggie peelers that I reckon will do this job well. And it will keep it flat to boot.


Nice rainy day in SA, but here FWIW is what I'd consider a fairly standard few minute polish on atoma slurried BBW looks like, done by someone (me) who doesn't really know what they're doing. Hagane getting on for semi-mirror, and nice contrast because the jigane is quite dark. With pressure on the edge you can get the core steel brighter and more mirror than this.




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The knife btw is my no.1 new favourite thing for polishing, and might be of interest (?): Okeya Shirogami 2 Unagisaki, available from Protooling who have an eofy sale on atm, making it $61 Aud. I almost certainly will never use it for chopping up live eels, but at that price it's pretty difficult to ignore. I might even buy another!

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https://protooling.com.au/collectio...itional-japanese-white-paper-steel-no-2-knife
 
if you dont have any eels to chop up maybe you can find some snakes?
 
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