Best Magnacut heat treatment

[NotAddictedYet]

For people who owned multiple Magnacut knives, is there a difference to how the steel feel between different makers? Whose treatment of Magnacut would you recommend?

 

[Jovidah]

@jedy617 don't be shy now!

 

[Barmoley]

For people who owned multiple Magnacut knives, is there a difference to how the steel feel between different makers? Whose treatment of Magnacut would you recommend?

Any good maker that works with magnacut will do it well. Larrin has published very good heat treating data for it, so I wouldn't worry. Pick the maker you like that works with it and go from there. I've tried it from Hoss, MSicardCutlery, and Bidinger in kitchen knives and all are excellent. In folders Spyderco did an excellent job with it as did Chris Reeve. Outdoor Big Chris does great stuff.

 

[azn_knives_4l]

Bos, maybe? Can always just go with 64.5 if all you need is a number

 

[jedy617]

You're not part of the club who can make fun of me

 

[azn_knives_4l]

You're not part of the club who can make fun of me

You talking to me? Who's making fun?

 

[jedy617]

For people who owned multiple Magnacut knives, is there a difference to how the steel feel between different makers? Whose treatment of Magnacut would you recommend?

I don't know the specific protocols available, but I have used magnacut available from 62-65. For me, there is a much noticeable difference in edge retention the higher up you go.

Will anything in the 62-63ish range be good to go? Absolutely.

On durability. Me personally, I use a reground protech mordax magnacut in my woodshop. I purposefully baton with it and beat the crap on it. Pretty sure the heat treat is in the 63 range. Trying to damage it purposefully has never resulted in a chip or roll, and it's extremely thin behind the edge.

Remember. Geometry trumps all. But as a rule of thumb, you want more edge retention? Push higher. Magnacut can take it. You want a camp knife or something you can hack with? Lower is fine. Sharpening any and all of them is great with diamond.

 

[blokey]

Haven’t got a bad one tbh

 

[azn_knives_4l]

Haven’t got a bad one tbh

I've only ever heard complaints in the EDC space.

Edit: Expanding on this... I actually can't think of much in the kitchen knife space where steel and heat treat are both unexpected and the disqualifiers about a knife or maker

 

[M1k3]

I wouldn't shy away from any competent maker.

That said, I'd probably say Devin Thomas probably has the most knowledge and experience with it, outside of the metallurgist that came up with it. That just happens to be his son also.

 

[blokey]

I've only ever heard complaints in the EDC space.

Edit: Expanding on this... I actually can't think of much in the kitchen knife space where steel and heat treat are both unexpected and the disqualifiers about a knife or maker

My sample size is too small to be useful, that said I do avoid Kitchen knives by EDC manufacturers (grind, ht sometimes are just off for kitchen knives, and some got that awful tactical look)

 

[NotAddictedYet]

I don't know the specific protocols available, but I have used magnacut available from 62-65.

Thanks for sharing your experience. Any kitchen knife maker that claim 65 hrc for their magnacut? I think most I come across claims around 62 HRC.

 

[MSicardCutlery]

Thanks for sharing your experience. Any kitchen knife maker that claim 65 hrc for their magnacut? I think most I come across claims around 62 HRC.

Shawn Houston, @Blank Blades. ? 64 is common enough though.

You talking to me? Who's making fun?

It's KKF lore. Jedy once got into a dispute with a very popular knife maker about their heat treat of MagnaCut being 62 hrc when he personally felt that was something of a waste of the steel's potential. That dispute made its way here (without the associated maker in tow), and now there's a small group of members that toss out "65" or "64" hrc in discussions as an inside joke directly aimed at Jedy who has long since dropped the argument.

 

[dabes]

Shawn Houston, @Blank Blades. ? 64 is common enough though.


It's KKF lore. Jedy once got into a dispute with a very popular knife maker about their heat treat of MagnaCut being 62 hrc when he personally felt that was something of a waste of the steel's potential. That dispute made its way here (without the associated maker in tow), and now there's a small group of members that toss out "65" or "64" hrc in discussions as an inside joke directly aimed at Jedy who has long since dropped the argument.

Yeah Blank claims 64-64.5 right in the jedy zone

 

[azn_knives_4l]

Shawn Houston, @Blank Blades. ? 64 is common enough though.


It's KKF lore. Jedy once got into a dispute with a very popular knife maker about their heat treat of MagnaCut being 62 hrc when he personally felt that was something of a waste of the steel's potential. That dispute made its way here (without the associated maker in tow), and now there's a small group of members that toss out "65" or "64" hrc in discussions as an inside joke directly aimed at Jedy who has long since dropped the argument.

Fascinating. I saw it the other day from @M1k3 and assumed people were talking about maximum hardness for whatever reason.

 

[parbaked]

Fascinating. I saw it the other day from @M1k3 and assumed people were talking about maximum hardness for whatever reason.

That's what she/he said...

 

[jedy617]

Thanks for sharing your experience. Any kitchen knife maker that claim 65 hrc for their magnacut? I think most I come across claims around 62 HRC.

Newham does 64hrc, and my I was not shy with using it for everything, and even letting my parents use it who chip all my other stuff. Never had a chip or roll.

 

[azn_knives_4l]

That's what she/he said...

I did, indeed, say that.

 

[mengwong]

@jedy617 was right, there is a huge difference between heat treating to 62 vs 64.5

 

[azn_knives_4l]

@jedy617 was right, there is a huge difference between heat treating to 62 vs 64.5
View attachment 332814

Looks at user... *Carbonara*, huh.

 

[aporigine]

@jedy617 was right, there is a huge difference between heat treating to 62 vs 64.5
View attachment 332814

Nice ni-mai Mazeggi

 

[Yoshi]

Nice ni-mai Mazeggi

Nah more of a tamahagane mazaki lol

 

[Blank Blades.]

Shawn Houston, @Blank Blades. ? 64 is common enough though.


It's KKF lore. Jedy once got into a dispute with a very popular knife maker about their heat treat of MagnaCut being 62 hrc when he personally felt that was something of a waste of the steel's potential. That dispute made its way here (without the associated maker in tow), and now there's a small group of members that toss out "65" or "64" hrc in discussions as an inside joke directly aimed at Jedy who has long since dropped the argument.

Yeah. Pushing it up higher isnt going to get any real benifit.

At least that outweighs the potential higher retained austenite.

 

[ethompson]

Shawn Houston, @Blank Blades. ? 64 is common enough though.


It's KKF lore. Jedy once got into a dispute with a very popular knife maker about their heat treat of MagnaCut being 62 hrc when he personally felt that was something of a waste of the steel's potential. That dispute made its way here (without the associated maker in tow), and now there's a small group of members that toss out "65" or "64" hrc in discussions as an inside joke directly aimed at Jedy who has long since dropped the argument.

Yeah, and thankfully @jedy617 stuck around even though some of us were pretty mean about it (definitely looking in the mirror here). Especially since, on the balance, he's probably quite right. In kitchen knives, there is definitely a point where things are "tough enough" such that only deliberate abuse will cause issues and maximizing toughness at the expense of other attributes beyond that doesn't make sense.

 

[ethompson]

Yeah. Pushing it up higher isnt going to get any real benifit.

Bigger number better - bragging rights 101

 

[azn_knives_4l]

Yeah, and thankfully @jedy617 stuck around even though some of us were pretty mean about it (definitely looking in the mirror here). Especially since, one the balance, he's probably quite right. In kitchen knives, there is definitely a point where things are "tough enough" such that only deliberate abuse will cause issues and maximizing toughness at the expense of other attributes beyond that doesn't make sense.

What are you targeting in performance? Can also go the other direction where hard enough not to roll for your geometry is hard enough for a kitchen knife while giving buffer to accidents. And hardness isn't that important for wear resistance anyway? Going from 62 to 65 on Magnacut is ~10% improvement on CATRA while decreasing impact toughness by ~30%.

 

[ethompson]

What are you targeting in performance? Can also go the other direction where hard enough not to roll for your geometry is hard enough for a kitchen knife while giving buffer to accidents. And hardness isn't that important for wear resistance anyway? Going from 62 to 65 on Magnacut is ~10% improvement on CATRA while decreasing impact toughness by ~30%.

But if the knife is already twice as tough as it needs to be for normal use, why would I trade 10% edge retention for even more toughness?

Awwww shiiiiii here we go again (literally the exact same argument)

 

[azn_knives_4l]

But if the knife is already twice as tough as it needs to be for normal use, why would I trade 10% edge retention for even more toughness?

Awwww shiiiiii here we go again

Mostly because it's not twice as tough as it needs to be because we just would just thin it down No need to get into it. Just wanted to put some of the known numbers (Larrin's) out in the open.

 

[Tekkz]

What are you targeting in performance? Can also go the other direction where hard enough not to roll for your geometry is hard enough for a kitchen knife while giving buffer to accidents. And hardness isn't that important for wear resistance anyway? Going from 62 to 65 on Magnacut is ~10% improvement on CATRA while decreasing impact toughness by ~30%.

Ruh roh

 

[MSicardCutlery]

What are you targeting in performance? Can also go the other direction where hard enough not to roll for your geometry is hard enough for a kitchen knife while giving buffer to accidents. And hardness isn't that important for wear resistance anyway? Going from 62 to 65 on Magnacut is ~10% improvement on CATRA while decreasing impact toughness by ~30%.

My understanding is that the geometry dictates how hard a knife can be while not rolling the edge. The thinner, the harder the knife needs to be. Most large chips begin not as faractures, but deflections, rolls. Often times making an edge marginally thicker which includes steepening the sharpening angle, will have a far more meaningful impact on toughness than just reducing the hardness a couple of HRC. For instance, I could make my blade 30% thicker bte, which is pretty insignificant margin on a kitchen knife, just a thou or so, and still have the same overall toughness as the thinner knife at a lower hardness where the toughness is 30% higher.